FL - FSU Law Professor Dan Markel Murdered by Hitmen *4 Guilty* #25

[Knitpicker]

I’m sort of on the fence personally between thinking that her relationship with these men was as Jeff describes, or thinking that this may be something she wanted Jeff to think for some reason. In my opinion she is not necessarily a trustworthy source. If I recall correctly, Jeff seems to say that she left her calendar open where he could see dates with other people, and I believe he also says she would tell him about some of them. To me, this indicates that she may possibly have wanted him to know she was seeing other men, and that she might possibly have wanted him to be jealous, or appear to be. Another possible explanation in my opinion is that the relationship with Jeff may have been very causal at the beginning. Jeff does say, as I recall, that they did not get serious until the fall of 2013, though they met in the Spring and began dating. Speaking of things that also may have allegedly happened in Fall, 2013: as I recall, Katie testified that Charlie first asked her if she knew someone who could hurt someone on Halloween, 2013,

They met in fall pf 2013 and didn’t become as he say s”boyfriend and girlfriend” until the next March.
Thats a good thought that it could all have been a tactic, but imo, she used him as a babysitter so she can see other men. He said in that unredacted video “Our romantic life was bad, but our home life was great” not sure what word he used but bad describes it). So it’s kind of like a married couple where the dad takes care of the kids while mom travels/works and is too tired for the romps. Not a great relationship -surprised he would even say “home life was great”. How could a home life be great unless he was saying he was Mr Mom (and of course the boys already had a father-I dont think JL would make up that WA said the boys should start calling him father….thats a kind of Giveway that their dad would soon be gone. They did already have a dad.

 

[amicuscurie]

They met in fall pf 2013 and didn’t become as he say s”boyfriend and girlfriend” until the next March.
Thats a good thought that it could all have been a tactic, but imo, she used him as a babysitter so she can see other men. He said in that unredacted video “Our romantic life was bad, but our home life was great” not sure what word he used but bad describes it). So it’s kind of like a married couple where the dad takes care of the kids while mom travels/works and is too tired for the romps. Not a great relationship -surprised he would even say “home life was great”. How could a home life be great unless he was saying he was Mr Mom (and of course the boys already had a father-I dont think JL would make up that WA said the boys should start calling him father….thats a kind of Giveway that their dad would soon be gone. They did already have a dad.

Oh, I guess I got that wrong, they met in fall and got serious in Spring. It’s still strange to me that per Jeff, she would tell him about the other men she was seeing, or at least would talk about certain other men a lot.

 

[Going Rogue]

If I recall correctly per cell phone records and Rivera’s testimony, Sig powered on his phone at 12:30 and called Katie at that time and told her the murder had been done. Per cell tower and phone records presented at Charlie’s trial, Wendi left her house at 12:30 or a few minutes before. It takes at least ten minutes to drive from her house to the location of the murder, if I recall correctly, putting her on Trescott after 12:30. To me this rules out Wendi telling Katie about the crime before Sig called at 12:30. If the evidence is that Wendi left her house at 12:30 or even a couple of minutes before, then it seems to me that she would not have time to drive by Trescott and call Katie all before Katie received Sig’s call at 12:30. As neat as such a theory is, it just doesn’t seem possible to me.

I have brought up that very point several times in the past. You are correct, based on Detective Corbitt’s testimony on the digital forensics, if Katie did in fact say “I know” when she spoke to Garcia in response to him saying the job was complete, it was not communicated by Wendi after her visual inspection of the crime scene. Based on cell tower pings, Corbitt has Wendi leaving her house at approximately the same time (literally within a couple of minutes) as the call between Katie & Garcia.

I have never seen anyone else make this point before and it has always disappointed me that in the past most that follow this case fail to objectively analyze ‘data’ OR they simply disregard or dismiss any point or analysis that isn’t supporting a narrative pointing to Wendi’s involvement. In my opinion there are so many other details to this case that are viewed or argued in a very biased manner with very little objectivity. The point you brought up is a great example – as I said in all the years I’ve followed this case, you are the first person I have seen bring this point up when to me its so blatantly obvious the timeline doesn’t add up. The only argument you can make to support Katie 'knew' from a message communicated from Wendi is that Corbitt’s data is wrong.

 

[Going Rogue]

From what I understand, the entire interview has always been publicly available if you pay for it; my understanding is that ML paid for it but redacted it and didn’t publicly release those names.

Correct ML first released Jeff’s police interviews years ago (at least 3 closer to 4) that were edited. He then removed the first version from his channel for more edits and released it again (a year later?) after more edits. There is information in the latest version (not ML’s) that is very sensitive and in my opinion shouldn’t be available for public consumption. I don’t necessarily blame the content creator that released it, because it is public record. IMO, I have a slight issue with the FL Sunshine laws as it relates to ‘personnel’ information that is of a sensitive nature. I understand its subjective, but there are people that were mentioned that have nothing to do with the crime in several of the interviews (Jeff’s and others) regarding alleged extramarital affairs and other ’personal’ issues that I am sure they didn’t want public. Also, think of Jeff Lacasse, do you think he knew everything he said would be posted to YouTube and watched by several thousand people?

 

[Zedzded]

I have brought up that very point several times in the past. You are correct, based on Detective Corbitt’s testimony on the digital forensics, if Katie did in fact say “I know” when she spoke to Garcia in response to him saying the job was complete, it was not communicated by Wendi after her visual inspection of the crime scene. Based on cell tower pings, Corbitt has Wendi leaving her house at approximately the same time (literally within a couple of minutes) as the call between Katie & Garcia.

I have never seen anyone else make this point before and it has always disappointed me that in the past most that follow this case fail to objectively analyze ‘data’ OR they simply disregard or dismiss any point or analysis that isn’t supporting a narrative pointing to Wendi’s involvement. In my opinion there are so many other details to this case that are viewed or argued in a very biased manner with very little objectivity. The point you brought up is a great example – as I said in all the years I’ve followed this case, you are the first person I have seen bring this point up when to me its so blatantly obvious the timeline doesn’t add up. The only argument you can make to support Katie 'knew' from a message communicated from Wendi is that Corbitt’s data is wrong.

Yeah there is no evidence WA and KM were communicating with one another and although WA was very reckless and impulsive before and after the murder, I believe still had the nous to stay disconnected from the other co-conspirators. I don't think she messaged KM on the day of the shooting on WhatsApp. Although I'm intrigued and confused why GC would ask such a specific question.

If she did not know if WA messaged KM, why ask when she knew she would lie and why choose the WhatsApp platform. Why not ask did you contact KM on the day of the shooting? Because if WA had messaged KM via normal SMS then technically she would not have been lying when she answered GC's in the negative. GC was very specific about WhatsApp.

But yeah I think there is an element of WA that is quite cunning and meticulous amid the chaos that is going on in her head.

 

[Going Rogue]

Yeah there is no evidence WA and KM were communicating with one another and although WA was very reckless and impulsive before and after the murder, I believe still had the nous to stay disconnected from the other co-conspirators. I don't think she messaged KM on the day of the shooting on WhatsApp. Although I'm intrigued and confused why GC would ask such a specific question.

If she did not know if WA messaged KM, why ask when she knew she would lie and why choose the WhatsApp platform. Why not ask did you contact KM on the day of the shooting? Because if WA had messaged KM via normal SMS then technically she would not have been lying when she answered GC's in the negative. GC was very specific about WhatsApp.

But yeah I think there is an element of WA that is quite cunning and meticulous amid the chaos that is going on in her head.

She specifically asked if she communicated via WhatsApp because (back then) those messages were not traceable / trackable. Theoretically, Wendi could have deleted any WhatsApp messages that day (we know she delete at least two entries – a text and calendar entry) and there’d be no record. If she communicated to Katie via standard SMS there would have been a record of the text even if Wendi had deleted it. SMS messages go through the carrier and records are kept for a certain period of time depending on the carrier.

I have said this before - Georgia knew with 100% certainty Wendi response would be ‘no’ to the question, but asking the question had the impact Georgia was looking for. It painted a certain picture to the public of what ‘may’ have happened. It’s the same when the state asked Jeff about the ‘thought’ he was potentially being set up as the fall guy – it had the same impact. IMO, the state is happy to ask questions that set up or open up public speculation. The question on WhatsApp and on Jeff being the potential fall guy have a very strong impact on the public and those questions got the exact reaction the state intended them to get.

 

[ch_13]

Do you think WA heard the unredacted JL interview in 2015? Maybe why she was so defensive on the stand towards him. The comment “I USED to like him” or something to that effect. We haven’t been privy to the whole 3/2015 interview but perhaps she was? Yes thats thats who I meant.

She doesn't necessarily have to have heard the interview to get an idea of what was said.

If she had cheated with someone who was later questioned by the police, it would be easy for her to put two plus two together and figure out that it was Jeff LaCasse who told the police about the fling.

 

[Ferpo]

Busy deposition schedule ahead, just posted today, including KM's brother Francis and CA's roommate Jerome, both of which will take place in Ft. Lauderdale

 

[Knitpicker]

Oh, I guess I got that wrong, they met in fall and got serious in Spring. It’s still strange to me that per Jeff, she would tell him about the other men she was seeing, or at least would talk about certain other men a lot.

Yeah it’s strange.

 

[Knitpicker]

Correct ML first released Jeff’s police interviews years ago (at least 3 closer to 4) that were edited. He then removed the first version from his channel for more edits and released it again (a year later?) after more edits. There is information in the latest version (not ML’s) that is very sensitive and in my opinion shouldn’t be available for public consumption. I don’t necessarily blame the content creator that released it, because it is public record. IMO, I have a slight issue with the FL Sunshine laws as it relates to ‘personnel’ information that is of a sensitive nature. I understand its subjective, but there are people that were mentioned that have nothing to do with the crime in several of the interviews (Jeff’s and others) regarding alleged extramarital affairs and other ’personal’ issues that I am sure they didn’t want public. Also, think of Jeff Lacasse, do you think he knew everything he said would be posted to YouTube and watched by several thousand people?

I thought the same thing about the names and also if he knew. But he did ask at some point or made a statement that the interview would be public,(and Isom suggested it was public information (Or soemthing to that effect) so I’m guessing he wanted it out there. I will try and find the timestamp because I know I heard him say it, although it could have been on another interview. I’ll check. I wanted to I ask you something.
Do you find it strange that WA never maintained a relationship with Robert when he distanced himself from the family bc he had suspicions? I would assume it was about ALL of them since he never kept in contact with Wendi. In my mind, thats another clue that she was involved bc after all, why would she and Robert be estranged if she wasn’t involved? She broke ties with innocent Robert, yet kept ties with Charlie. It doesn’t compute. Theres lots of info about others in Epsteins book thats also really shocking.

 

[Knitpicker]

Yeah there is no evidence WA and KM were communicating with one another and although WA was very reckless and impulsive before and after the murder, I believe still had the nous to stay disconnected from the other co-conspirators. I don't think she messaged KM on the day of the shooting on WhatsApp. Although I'm intrigued and confused why GC would ask such a specific question.

If she did not know if WA messaged KM, why ask when she knew she would lie and why choose the WhatsApp platform. Why not ask did you contact KM on the day of the shooting? Because if WA had messaged KM via normal SMS then technically she would not have been lying when she answered GC's in the negative. GC was very specific about WhatsApp.

But yeah I think there is an element of WA that is quite cunning and meticulous amid the chaos that is going on in her head.

She was asked on the stand by GC if she ever spoke to KM. Thats when she did all those hand signals saying she didn’t text, call her or anything outside of meeting her for “an hour” at the beach and the dinner with JL. So that was already asked, which would have included any call from WA to KM the day of the murder, or any other time.

 

[Going Rogue]

Do you think WA heard the unredacted JL interview in 2015? Maybe why she was so defensive on the stand towards him. The comment “I USED to like him” or something to that effect. We haven’t been privy to the whole 3/2015 interview but perhaps she was? Yes thats thats who I meant.

I think the probability that Wendi didn’t listen to ALL of the police interviews that were released as public record are zero. Think about had badly you or anyone that follows this case wanted to hear Jeff’s interview, now multiply that by 10,000 – that’s how badly Wendi wanted to hear it. Wendi and the Adelsons could have easily gotten their hands on all public records though their attorneys. IMO, there is no way she didn’t listen to the unedited version PRIOR to her first taking the stand and probably well before the first trial.

 

[Knitpicker]

It is my understanding the interview is publicly available, but you have to pay for it. I don’t see a reason why the police would have shown it to her.

So do you think she only saw the ML redacted one?

 

[Knitpicker]

I think the probability that Wendi didn’t listen to ALL of the police interviews that were released as public record are zero. Think about had badly you or anyone that follows this case wanted to hear Jeff’s interview, now multiply that by 10,000 – that’s how badly Wendi wanted to hear it. Wendi and the Adelsons could have easily gotten their hands on all public records though their attorneys. IMO, there is no way she didn’t listen to the unedited version PRIOR to her first taking the stand and probably well before the first trial.

Agree

 

[Knitpicker]

Correct ML first released Jeff’s police interviews years ago (at least 3 closer to 4) that were edited. He then removed the first version from his channel for more edits and released it again (a year later?) after more edits. There is information in the latest version (not ML’s) that is very sensitive and in my opinion shouldn’t be available for public consumption. I don’t necessarily blame the content creator that released it, because it is public record. IMO, I have a slight issue with the FL Sunshine laws as it relates to ‘personnel’ information that is of a sensitive nature. I understand its subjective, but there are people that were mentioned that have nothing to do with the crime in several of the interviews (Jeff’s and others) regarding alleged extramarital affairs and other ’personal’ issues that I am sure they didn’t want public. Also, think of Jeff Lacasse, do you think he knew everything he said would be posted to YouTube and watched by several thousand people?

I watched ML’s videos with JL so may times that I started noticing things disappearing lol.

 

[Knitpicker]

I have brought up that very point several times in the past. You are correct, based on Detective Corbitt’s testimony on the digital forensics, if Katie did in fact say “I know” when she spoke to Garcia in response to him saying the job was complete, it was not communicated by Wendi after her visual inspection of the crime scene. Based on cell tower pings, Corbitt has Wendi leaving her house at approximately the same time (literally within a couple of minutes) as the call between Katie & Garcia.

I have never seen anyone else make this point before and it has always disappointed me that in the past most that follow this case fail to objectively analyze ‘data’ OR they simply disregard or dismiss any point or analysis that isn’t supporting a narrative pointing to Wendi’s involvement. In my opinion there are so many other details to this case that are viewed or argued in a very biased manner with very little objectivity. The point you brought up is a great example – as I said in all the years I’ve followed this case, you are the first person I have seen bring this point up when to me its so blatantly obvious the timeline doesn’t add up. The only argument you can make to support Katie 'knew' from a message communicated from Wendi is that Corbitt’s data is wrong.

I have a list of those calls. I am almost sure there was a couple of minutes between when WA would have passed DM’s house and when KM spoke to SG. It was really close though. I’ll find my call list if I didn’t delete it . Well the call from WA obviously would have had to have been a burner. So unless we know exactly what time she made the turn in front of DM’s house with her cell, we can’t compare it to the approx. 12:30 call from SG to KM.

 

[Going Rogue]

I thought the same thing about the names and also if he knew. But he did ask at some point or made a statement that the interview would be public,(and Isom suggested it was public information (Or soemthing to that effect) so I’m guessing he wanted it out there. I will try and find the timestamp because I know I heard him say it, although it could have been on another interview. I’ll check. I wanted to I ask you something.
Do you find it strange that WA never maintained a relationship with Robert when he distanced himself from the family bc he had suspicions? I would assume it was about ALL of them since he never kept in contact with Wendi. In my mind, thats another clue that she was involved bc after all, why would she and Robert be estranged if she wasn’t involved? She broke ties with innocent Robert, yet kept ties with Charlie. It doesn’t compute. Theres lots of info about others in Epsteins book thats also really shocking.

Yes, at the start of the first interview with Detective Hale, Jeff did say – “this is f’ed up... I know how this works” .... then asked if he could talk "off the record". So yes I agree he understood things he said were going to be public to a certain degree. However, as Jeff went into detail about many personal things about his relationship and personal life (e.g. seeing a therapist etc.) and other people, I don’t think he was thinking it would be broadcast on YouTube and listened to by literally several thousand people. He described one guy at FSU as the guy "with really bad teeth" as an example. - he wasn't thinking everything was going to be released to the public.

Re your question on Robert, if Wendi wasn’t involved, she made a conscious decision to ‘protect’ and stand by her murderous family. Simply put, Robert didn’t make that same decision. Robert separated himself from the family because he suspected they were involved in Dan’s murder and he was obviously correct, the fact that Wendi didn’t OR wasn’t able to separate herself from the family, doesn’t indicate she was involved. That doesn’t mean I think she is innocent, just that it isn’t proof she was directly involved. If she wasn't involved, she knew her family was involved - I'm just not sure at what point she found out 'IF' she wasn't directly involved (before, during or after?). She clearly lied during her testimony in all three trials about what she knew.

 

[Going Rogue]

I have a list of those calls. I am almost sure there was a couple of minutes between when WA would have passed DM’s house and when KM spoke to SG. It was really close though. I’ll find my call list if I didn’t delete it . Well the call from WA obviously would have had to have been a burner. So unless we know exactly what time she made the turn in front of DM’s house with her cell, we can’t compare it to the approx. 12:30 call from SG to KM.

Wendi’s phone pinged at her home literally minutes before the infamous call between Katie & Sigfredo. If Corbitts data is accurate, it would have been impossible for Wendi to have been at the crime scene BEFORE the call was made. I am certain on this because I’ve mentioned it before only to be accused of being on the Adleson PR team

 

[Going Rogue]

So do you think she only saw the ML redacted one?

I believe she (or one the Adelsons Attorneys) got it directly from Leon County Public Records – and likely before ML got his hands on the record. There are not multiple versions from Leon County – the multiple versions on YouTube are edits from content creators – the most recent was likely not edited at all.

 

[Knitpicker]

I believe she (or one the Adelsons Attorneys) got it directly from Leon County Public Records – and likely before ML got his hands on the record. There are not multiple versions from Leon County – the multiple versions on YouTube are edits from content creators – the most recent was likely not edited at all.

Yes I know that lol. My question was in response to you saying you didnt think she saw them.