FL FL - Isabella Hellmann, 41, catamaran off Cay Sal, SE of the FL Keys, 14 May 2017 #1 *GUILTY*

[JerseyGirl]

I'm not buying the main point of impact was the BACK of the boat.

 

[Hatfield]

Just want to go on record that I think this case could go one way or the other. Either he did something on purpose or there really was some sort of accident.

I have flip flopped on which way the case may turn out and I think I may have to stay right on top of the fence for now. LOL

Its an amazing case. Lots of circumstantial evidence that leans towards maybe something was done on purpose and then lots of other evidence that points to maybe a real accident of some sort.

I even like the one persons theory from yesterday that she may have been going to the bathroom and fell off way earlier in the night. Then the boat could have hit something much later which was nowhere near where she went in the water. That is a feasible thing that could have happened. He may have feaked out and knew it would look bad because he could not find her which could explain some of his actions.

Its really an amazing case that I hope FBI can get to the truth on.

 

[Hiandmighty]

On our April carnival cruise, the ship found a capsized boat so we had to stop and circle it/inspect it for signs of life and then coast guard released us after the captain gave CG the coordinates.

 

[Hatfield]

On our April carnival cruise, the ship found a capsized boat so we had to stop and circle it/inspect it for signs of life and then coast guard released us after the captain gave CG the coordinates.

That is interesting to me because it sounds like there is some protocol for other boats to report locations of capsized boats or to try to render aid if possible.

What is interesting to me the most is whether the CG took any steps to retrieve the one your ship found or not.

IMO
Just guessing but I dont think they do because if they did then wouldnt they have made stronger attempts to make sure the Hellman boat got out of the water. It almost sounds to me that the CG just reports last location of large objects like this and doesnt have the funds to retrieve and remove the hazards. Which is sad if that is the protocol.

 

[Hiandmighty]

I had wondered if we could somehow find the report for the boat we found but I haven't the first clue on how to go about that.

(Btw, I'm picking up my EPIRB on thursday-- been in the shop for maintenance and new battery)

 

[Hiandmighty]

It is possible the boat has sunk now. If there were storms, it could have been ripped apart by waves and then sunk. They are made to float but even those designs can be laid to waste by mother nature.

 

[TeaTime]

I got some info from my SO who is a ship Captain and has taken ships all over the world.

The water through which they were sailing is known for being very rough as this is where the north east trade winds meet the Gulf Stream which makes for very rough water as the current runs one way, the winds another. If I was correct in describing their position, this would be the Mona Passage which typically has 6-8 foot seas and if I wasn't confused, the current turns north east from Cuba to FL. Therefore, one would be fighting the current to maintain a westerly direction to the Keys.

It would be easy to take on water if the catamaran ended up broadside in the waves.

There is no explanation for deep scrapes on the rear of the hulls without damage to the front of the hulls if the boat was underway in a forward direction. To have damage only to the rear of the hulls means the hulls hit something as it was moving backwards or was hit while broadside. So, to me, this indicates that no one was steering at the time of the collision.

And, as an FYI, one would be a fool to not have all the safety equipment that this boat had and go out into open water. This man was a seasoned captain, he wouldn't sail without it. You have it for a reason and it is because the ocean is dangerous and unpredictable. I see NOTHING suspect about having this equipment aboard. It saved his life.

If you look at photos of 37 foot catamarans you will see that the wheel and controls are right at the edge of the boat which is where she would have been sitting. It wouldn't take much to be flung from the boat if, for instance, the controls are starboard and the boat is broadside with the waves hitting port - or the reverse.

I am going with accident.

I looked up 37 ft. catamarans. A 17 year old one is about $160K.

As for the personal issues here:

I do not understand her sister burglarizing the condo.
I do understand that he wanted to return to his home country with his daughter.

I would be surprised if the FBI paid a salvage ship to tow that boat to a warehouse. But, I have often been surprised.

 

[Hiandmighty]

I'm not buying the main point of impact was the BACK of the boat.

If they were intersecting perpendicular with the item, it could have hit the back.

 

[JerseyGirl]

TeaTime, if your husband asked you to do a night watch alone, would he give you a life vest and say "goodnight" or would he also give you the personal locator beacon in case, heaven forbid, something went wrong. Also, wouldn't the person on the helm be attached to the boat in case they fall?

 

[Hiandmighty]

I got some info from my SO who is a ship Captain and has taken ships all over the world.

The water through which they were sailing is known for being very rough as this is where the north east trade winds meet the Gulf Stream which makes for very rough water as the current runs one way, the winds another. If I was correct in describing their position, this would be the Mona Passage which typically has 6-8 foot seas and if I wasn't confused, the current turns north east from Cuba to FL. Therefore, one would be fighting the current to maintain a westerly direction to the Keys.

It would be easy to take on water if the catamaran ended up broadside in the waves.

There is no explanation for deep scrapes on the rear of the hulls without damage to the front of the hulls if the boat was underway in a forward direction. To have damage only to the rear of the hulls means the hulls hit something as it was moving backwards or was hit while broadside. So, to me, this indicates that no one was steering at the time of the collision.

And, as an FYI, one would be a fool to not have all the safety equipment that this boat had and go out into open water. This man was a seasoned captain, he wouldn't sail without it. You have it for a reason and it is because the ocean is dangerous and unpredictable. I see NOTHING suspect about having this equipment aboard. It saved his life.

If you look at photos of 37 foot catamarans you will see that the wheel and controls are right at the edge of the boat which is where she would have been sitting. It wouldn't take much to be flung from the boat if, for instance, the controls are starboard and the boat is broadside with the waves hitting port - or the reverse.

I am going with accident.

I looked up 37 ft. catamarans. A 17 year old one is about $160K.

As for the personal issues here:

I do not understand her sister burglarizing the condo.
I do understand that he wanted to return to his home country with his daughter.

I would be surprised if the FBI paid a salvage ship to tow that boat to a warehouse. But, I have often been surprised.

Agree. There is so much to back up his story.

 

[TeaTime]

TeaTime, if your husband asked you to do a night watch alone, would he give you a life vest and say "goodnight" or would he also give you the personal locator beacon in case, heaven forbid, something went wrong. Also, wouldn't the person on the helm be attached to the boat in case they fall?

My SO would NEVER, under any circumstances, ask me to do a night watch alone. Period.

We would never embark on a night ocean crossing in our small (43') ship. We would never embark on such a trip even during the day without at least one other experienced and capable pilot aboard and I am not that person.

While underway, I would not be allowed to roam free without wearing a life vest and using tethers. Period.

The ocean is too unpredictable and Captain's rules are THE rules. Period.

 

[Satchie]

I even like the one persons theory from yesterday that she may have been going to the bathroom and fell off way earlier in the night. Then the boat could have hit something much later which was nowhere near where she went in the water. That is a feasible thing that could have happened. He may have feaked out and knew it would look bad because he could not find her which could explain some of his actions.

I agree, a husband's (normally) going to feel guilty if his wife dies in an accident, but having it happen when he was captain, and possibly oversleeping or something, would be an extremely heavy burden of guilt for most sailors, IMO. The captain is supposed to be responsible for the safety of his crew, and it wasn't a situation where she was just as experienced as he was.

It could be that he's covering up for a lapse on his part, for eg, she was supposed to wake him at 11 pm, or something. It's never been mentioned how long her shift was supposed to last.

IIRC, there was mention of 2 ft waves, I don't recall any indication of heavy seas.

Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk

 

[Hiandmighty]

Ok. Let's talk about the head.

There could be any number of reasons why she may have gone to the bathroom and not used the head (broken, plumbing, wake him up etc)...

While a woman can sort of squat over the rail, she likely would have used the empty live well for #1 (not #2) or a bucket. Maybe she slipped and fell while tossing the bucket contents.

Maybe she threw up-- seasick/pregnant again/bad food etc and fell over..

<modsnip>

Maybe he only wanted to rest an hour or two so he could have a nap before HE took the night watch shift...

Maybe he is aggravating as hell and she encouraged him to go lie down so she could call her sister and then have some peace and quiet (even the best relationships are challenged in a 37 foot 2 week boating trip)...

I'm inclined to believe he wanted a few hours of rest before he took night shift and she fell off before they hit the item...

She was an adult who had the capacity to take off her life jacket-- especially if she felt nauseated and it was making her hotter and clammier, etc and she fell off with no life jacket.

Maybe she was teathered and wearing a life jacket with PLB and she took it off to go make a cup of tea/get a snack/use bathroom..

There are so many possibilities...all legitimate

 

[Hiandmighty]

I agree, a husband's (normally) going to feel guilty if his wife dies in an accident, but having it happen when he was captain, and possibly oversleeping or something, would be an extremely heavy burden of guilt for most sailors, IMO. The captain is supposed to be responsible for the safety of his crew, and it wasn't a situation where she was just as experienced as he was.

It could be that he's covering up for a lapse on his part, for eg, she was supposed to wake him at 11 pm, or something. It's never been mentioned how long her shift was supposed to last.

IIRC, there was mention of 2 ft waves, I don't recall any indication of heavy seas.

Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk

Right because in hindsight, what might have seemed as a solid decision to him at the time very obviously became a super bad decision. If he didn't kill her and his story as told is true, I'm sure he is living inside of his head going over and over the situation trying to figure out where it all went wrong.

Like tea time said, it begins and ends with the captain's decisions...

 

[Hatfield]

What bothers me the most is if they would have either gotten the boat or sent a dive team out to look again at it then I am pretty sure a fairly simple investigation of the holes (or lackthereof) would prove one way or another whether a hole in the boat was purposely done or by some object the boat struck.

For example a bullet hole is pretty obvious. Or a large heavy tool like a sharpened crow bar that took multiple whacks to get a hole would be obvious.

It may not be conclusive but that would be the very first thing I would look at in the investigation. It is troubling why there seemed to be no real urgency to do that in this case.

 

[msphilosopher]

Just want to go on record that I think this case could go one way or the other. Either he did something on purpose or there really was some sort of accident.

I have flip flopped on which way the case may turn out and I think I may have to stay right on top of the fence for now. LOL

Its an amazing case. Lots of circumstantial evidence that leans towards maybe something was done on purpose and then lots of other evidence that points to maybe a real accident of some sort.

I even like the one persons theory from yesterday that she may have been going to the bathroom and fell off way earlier in the night. Then the boat could have hit something much later which was nowhere near where she went in the water. That is a feasible thing that could have happened. He may have feaked out and knew it would look bad because he could not find her which could explain some of his actions.

Its really an amazing case that I hope FBI can get to the truth on.

Yes, yes, yes. I agree with you Hatfield.

I lean a little more towards foul play due to the many red flags in this relationship and in his narrative. Although, it is VERY possible this was a tragic accident.

 

[GigTu]

My gut feeling is that she nodded off and fell. I'm heartsick for her, and him, if that's the case. Tragic no matter the reason.

 

[Hiandmighty]

What bothers me the most is if they would have either gotten the boat or sent a dive team out to look again at it then I am pretty sure a fairly simple investigation of the holes (or lackthereof) would prove one way or another whether a hole in the boat was purposely done or by some object the boat struck.

For example a bullet hole is pretty obvious. Or a large heavy tool like a sharpened crow bar that took multiple whacks to get a hole would be obvious.

It may not be conclusive but that would be the very first thing I would look at in the investigation. It is troubling why there seemed to be no real urgency to do that in this case.

It doesnt have to be a hole in the boat. Say a whale jumped and crashed on one side of the boat-- that could have caused one side to displace under water which would allow water to rush into the boat. The boat would list and capsize. Once it capsized, he would need rescue. In this theory, maybe she wasn't wearing her life jacket and her neck was broken. She would have sunk.

Just an example. I have no idea if a whale was involved-- just trying to give a visual

 

[Estelle]

Nobody has commented on this paragraph before:

Fennimore, the neighbour and an employee and a Ph.D. student at Florida Atlantic University&#8217;s college of medicine, said Bennett was vague about his work, saying he was a plumber. She said his parents, from England, stayed at the condo twice, around Christmas and also last summer. Hellmann, she said, &#8220;liked shopping. She dressed in a different outfit every time she came out (of the apartment).&#8221;

http://rare.us/rare-news/a-womans-m...-all-eyes-are-on-her-husband-of-three-months/

His parents: i am wondering if his mother and father are going to mind the baby in England. Usually, the MSM would have found them by now and tried to interview them. They had met Isabella twice.

Isabella wore a different out fit every day: If she sank all her money into the apartment, took leave for the baby,and worked part-time, where did she get the money to be able to wear different clothes every day?

Question: How much water could you take on a cat? Or is the water stored in a tank? Drinking water and bathing water? Could LB have had enough water on the cat in pipes or barrels to have leaked it to make the boat sink?

My suspicious mind tells me that he could have agreed to get married with the idea of a delayed Caribbean honeymoon on the cat in mind and after they bought insurance at least to cover the mortgage (if they had one or life insurance) if one of them died and left the other with the baby girl. He then renovated the apartment himself with the view that he would have it ready to sell after her demise. With the arguments they had over parenting issues, he sounds as if he was a controller and possibly thought she was not a good mother for the baby and he could do better himself and all he really wanted was the baby. But how many men really want to have to look after such a young baby on their own with no family support? I guess the cat was insured so if it sunk, then he would be able to claim insurance for it.

Did he plan a win-win-win-win situation and the perfect murder? eg Apartment in his name to sell, Life insurance perhaps and insurance for the boat and the baby away from Isabella's family so he could bring her up the way he wanted with no family interference and a planned exit to England or Australia hoping he would never be found.

Also they went to mostly non-English speaking countries so witnesses of Isabella being there maybe few.

Was the Coast Guard from Cuba or Bermuda? Cuba would have limited resources to spend on this type of situation.

My prediction is that he has left the country and was lying about the passport being left on the boat and possibly telling that other person he was going to England to put them off his trail. When he went to Cuba, surely he needed his passport - not just a piece of paper, I do not believe he left his passport onboard. Did he really go to Cuba or did he just disappear for a few days? Instead of checking hospitals there, I assumed he would get into a boat to look.

Was the cat on autopilot? It seemed to be off track a bit and nearer to Bermuda than Key West. Is that the normal route?

I am particularly interested in this case as I have sailed on a yacht in the Caribbean, steering it sometimes but never at night, have been to Saint Maarten to pick up the yacht, been to Cuba and Puerto Rico, and, as an Australian, I am wondering if he is here now.

But why did they go to the Virgin Islands when that was not in their original plans? They went to Puerto Rico first then backtracked east to the Virgin islands further away from Cuba? Consequently, Isabella missed her sister's graduation. Did he plan this on purpose? They must have stayed there for some time. Also her phone broke and she was told the satellite phone did not work. Was that planned so that she could not contact her family often? She could have bought a new phone (or used landline on shore) and IMO the satellite phone was working all the time. But as he could have been about to throw her overboard, he thought she should phone her sister as one last call! So he pretended that he got it working again for her.

I worry about the baby with such a man and hope the FBI is going to remain active on this case before it becomes a cold one! My gut feeling is that he is not in the USA now so with other countries involved, it will be very expensive for them to solve. But they can at least find out where he has flown to by asking all the airlines. He has not even given a statement to the FBI yet as a witness let alone a suspect.

What do you think?

 

[Hiandmighty]

My gut feeling is that she nodded off and fell. I'm heartsick for her, and him, if that's the case. Tragic no matter the reason.

That may be where the "I think she is asleep" came from. Maybe he said "I think she fell asleep" and that caused events to transpire...