FL - Mass Shooting at Pulse Nightclub, Orlando 12 June 2016 #5

[CARIIS]

Go fund me at
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never heard this, oh , the ironies at the court house he did the metal detectors...................MSNBC

 

[human]

I agree with you, and what you've said is exactly what I meant about so many changes - his education, his home life, the bullying he experienced, the shame and stigma his culture and family associated with mental illness (likely led to untreated illness) and homosexuality, ability to purchase weapons, and I'm not sure how to say it, but witnessing previous mass shootings and terror attacks.

It all led him to the path that led him to Pulse that night. But when does it switch from others could have made a difference to he was responsible for his own life and own actions? Because IMO a terrorist like him doesn't get to blame his upbringing or illness. Sure he was miserable, angry, and ill. But. He made a plan. He bought the weapons. He went into the club and killed those people. He called 911. He knew what he was doing.

Yup. He was acting out his rage. He had a lot to rage about. All those inputs as a child taught him how to act. Bullying works. Violence works.

 

[NL007]

I agree with you, and what you've said is exactly what I meant about so many changes - his education, his home life, the bullying he experienced, the shame and stigma his culture and family associated with mental illness (likely led to untreated illness) and homosexuality, ability to purchase weapons, and I'm not sure how to say it, but witnessing previous mass shootings and terror attacks.

It all led him to the path that led him to Pulse that night. But when does it switch from others could have made a difference to he was responsible for his own life and own actions? Because IMO a terrorist like him doesn't get to blame his upbringing or illness. Sure he was miserable, angry, and ill. But. He made a plan. He bought the weapons. He went into the club and killed those people. He called 911. He knew what he was doing.

BBM
Sorry, your post was just that good it needed to be repeated :loveyou:. I feel we need to identify NPD better, perhaps? Take abused children, for instance. Some become bullies, and later child abusers as adults. Some abused children become drug addicts or drunks and can never seem to do anything to bring themselves out of that hole to have success in life. Others grow up somewhat normal with a functional addiction, and some become completely normal despite it all (DISCLAIMER - Yes, I'm aware that NPD isn't always caused by a troubled, abusive, or chaotic childhood, but that's the biggest risk factor). Why? Why do some people take their problems out on themselves and some people take it out on others? I think the reason is that people with NPD tend to appear successful at first glance. They always try to get to the top to prove to everyone else how great they are, which then reaffirms their greatness to themselves. A lot of people dislike narcissists because of their arrogance and entitlement complex, but to the narcissist that's everyone else's fault, and not theirs. They don't need help because they would never admit they could ever develop even the slightest chink in their armor of perfection. We resent the friend that's always crying because of depression we can't understand and think of her as "crazy" because she's too emotional, yet we praise the lunatic that says whatever is on his mind because he's "brave enough to tell the truth" and "has confidence in himself", because he's the CEO so clearly confidence like that must make him a winner! We need to stop saying "that's just who he is, he's a jerk" and giving them their narcissistic supply by continuing to make excuses for their behavior and buying into the hype these con-artists create for themselves.

Basically what I've gone off on this tangent about is that narcissists tend to be the real threat, because they so often turn into killers. We need to learn what "crazy" really is and stop stigmatizing people with "visible" mental illness and start doing more to identify the ones with the invisible ones that are ticking time bombs ready to explode at any second. If you've ever had a narcissist in your life and you've dared to criticize them in any way, you've seen how quickly they become dangerous.

This is all my opinion, of course. I'm not at all saying every narcissist is a criminal or even remotely dangerous, because there actually are some people with NPD (usually milder forms) who can be honest with themselves and actually do seek counseling. I'm also not saying that people with depression are all saints that would never hurt a fly. What I am saying is that we need to identify narcissists in early childhood and get them into counseling before they become so set in their ways that they end up lashing out in the worst ways possible. IMO, JMVHO, and IME only

 

[CARIIS]

BBM
Sorry, your post was just that good it needed to be repeated :loveyou:. I feel we need to identify NPD better, perhaps? Take abused children, for instance. Some become bullies, and later child abusers as adults. Some abused children become drug addicts or drunks and can never seem to do anything to bring themselves out of that hole to have success in life. Others grow up somewhat normal with a functional addiction, and some become completely normal despite it all (DISCLAIMER - Yes, I'm aware that NPD isn't always caused by a troubled, abusive, or chaotic childhood, but that's the biggest risk factor). Why? Why do some people take their problems out on themselves and some people take it out on others? I think the reason is that people with NPD tend to appear successful at first glance. They always try to get to the top to prove to everyone else how great they are, which then reaffirms their greatness to themselves. A lot of people dislike narcissists because of their arrogance and entitlement complex, but to the narcissist that's everyone else's fault, and not theirs. They don't need help because they would never admit they could ever develop even the slightest chink in their armor of perfection. We resent the friend that's always crying because of depression we can't understand and think of her as "crazy" because she's too emotional, yet we praise the lunatic that says whatever is on his mind because he's "brave enough to tell the truth" and "has confidence in himself", because he's the CEO so clearly confidence like that must make him a winner! We need to stop saying "that's just who he is, he's a jerk" and giving them their narcissistic supply by continuing to make excuses for their behavior and buying into the hype these con-artists create for themselves.

Basically what I've gone off on this tangent about is that narcissists tend to be the real threat, because they so often turn into killers. We need to learn what "crazy" really is and stop stigmatizing people with "visible" mental illness and start doing more to identify the ones with the invisible ones that are ticking time bombs ready to explode at any second. If you've ever had a narcissist in your life and you've dared to criticize them in any way, you've seen how quickly they become dangerous.

This is all my opinion, of course. I'm not at all saying every narcissist is a criminal or even remotely dangerous, because there actually are some people with NPD (usually milder forms) who can be honest with themselves and actually do seek counseling. I'm also not saying that people with depression are all saints that would never hurt a fly. What I am saying is that we need to identify narcissists in early childhood and get them into counseling before they become so set in their ways that they end up lashing out in the worst ways possible. IMO, JMVHO, and IME only

Neat post thanx!

 

[CARIIS]

doing these one at at time something is messing up

 

[CARIIS]

 

[CARIIS]

 

[CARIIS]

 

[CARIIS]

 

[bluesneakers]

Pretty confident they knew he conduct disordered. how would he know to look up the term anti psycotics, unless he had some previous exposure?

The first wife very compelling IMO, cause she used the term bipolar and then went on to say emotinally unstable - what could describe bipolar better.

I think he had history of on meds , then became non compliant - the typical cycle. How the media is ignoring the friend phone call is amazing, but it fits. They told the wife not to say anything about "gay" - so they are trying to keep it on this ISIS track despite the realities.

Good point. He knew exactly what to look for and if he'd ever taken them there's a good chance he stopped at some point. Non-compliance is common and anti-psychotics come with a lot of potential side effects.

They know domestic stuff is far more dangereous than ISIS - but hey they have an oppotunity to get some serious bucks out of congress.

This makes no sense to me. The only way I can explain it is it's like shark attacks, or having a gun in the house, or being struck by lightning. For whatever reason people ignore the math and the odds and let fear overtake them.

The masses will sigh relief, and all of us shall be on another thread whenever.

When and where will the next one be? How many times between now and January will Obama have to be our Consoler-in-Chief?

How much can be learned from Orlando and OM? If he acted alone there will be no connection found to make a difference.

rsbm and jmo

 

[oceanblueeyes]

This investigation is still in its infancy. This terrorist attacker will be investigated for months or it may take years to finalize what all they found out about Mateen and his radical Islamic behaviors and ideology.

When someone is this filled with radical hatred they cant keep their mouths shut and we have already seen that with Mateen. So the FBI will interview many witnesses and one witness will lead them to another and another like it always does in any investigation of this magnitude.

It will take the FBI forensic computer and technology experts time to go through all of his communication devises. Imo, there they will find out what was inside the mind of the Islamic homegrown terrorist. Until that is disclosed/learned... if the government doesn't shut it down, and suppress it from the truth from its citizens.... we really don't know nearly all the information that will be obtained in the thorough investigation that will be done on him until it is completed. And that is a long way away from now.

It is like other Islamic terrorists before where they were either not on the radar or were dropped from the watch list when we learned afterwards all about what they had been doing. Its sad actually that our country seems to have a reactive police force instead of a proactive one. It seems so many times it is only after a Islamic terrorist or terrorists have struck do we thoroughly go back and investigate them thoroughly only to find there were radical extremist red flags everywhere long before they carried their terrorist attack out.

IMO

 

[DexterMorgan]

We can't blame the prez for Omar being jealous of latin men that didn't want to cuddle with him.

This was not a murder by isis. It was a murder by a man whom felt rejected by a community that he wanted to be a part of. Jmo.

 

[NL007]

Absolutely beautiful, isn't it? I want to see news reports and photographs of people coming together like this without a tragedy involved. If we could come out in droves to support each other in times of happiness as well as sadness, maybe we would have less sad events to talk about?

I'm quite sure that idea is a bit too simplistic and child-like to actually work, but you never know. I think I'll keep that thought in my mind regardless to motivate myself to be more involved with my community. I always want to go to these events, but a lot of times my daughter would rather spend time on her phone than go out and support others, and I have to admit I'm pretty lazy myself so I don't really push it. I think next time my daughter says "I want to go but it's too hot today", I'll woman up and tell her "we can go get cold sodas or ice cream to take with us first, lets go".

I'm not even specifically talking about LGBT support events, like pride or back when we had marriage equality rallies. I'm talking about going to the presidential candidate speeches, women's rights marches, whatever. It doesn't matter the cause, if you believe in it go support it I guess lol. I think now that I'm older I find it easier to go online and punch in my credit card info and pat myself on the back for donating instead of standing outside in 106 degree heat and actually showing support by being there like these college kids do. -Sidenote- I'm not even 40 yet, why do I feel so darn old already? lol

 

[bluesneakers]

We can't blame the prez for Omar being jealous of latin men that didn't want to cuddle with him.

This was not a murder by isis. It was a murder by a man whom felt rejected by a community that he wanted to be a part of. Jmo.

I agree with you but I'm still stuck on how awful this was. Very few angry rejects reacted this horrifically. Why did he go so far? To convince everyone he was ISIS and/or to show how gay he wasn't?

 

[bluesneakers]

Absolutely beautiful, isn't it? I want to see news reports and photographs of people coming together like this without a tragedy involved. If we could come out in droves to support each other in times of happiness as well as sadness, maybe we would have less sad events to talk about?

I'm quite sure that idea is a bit too simplistic and child-like to actually work, but you never know. I think I'll keep that thought in my mind regardless to motivate myself to be more involved with my community. I always want to go to these events, but a lot of times my daughter would rather spend time on her phone than go out and support others, and I have to admit I'm pretty lazy myself so I don't really push it. I think next time my daughter says "I want to go but it's too hot today", I'll woman up and tell her "we can go get cold sodas or ice cream to take with us first, lets go".

I'm not even specifically talking about LGBT support events, like pride or back when we had marriage equality rallies. I'm talking about going to the presidential candidate speeches, women's rights marches, whatever.

Obama's Inauguration in 2009 was a giant joyous party like you're talking about. I hugged and high-fived what felt like a million people.

It would be great if we had more coming together events like you're talking about.

Get out and go! It's like Bill Murray says in Scrooged - after you have that good feeling you'll get greedy and want more.

 

[DexterMorgan]

I agree with you but I'm still stuck on how awful this was. Very few angry rejects reacted this horrifically. Why did he go so far? To convince everyone he was ISIS and/or to show how gay he wasn't?

Agree. He may have done it to prove to his dad that he is a man. Who knows.

Adam Lanza targeted and killed children in his mass shooting.

And nobody really knows why.

 

[NL007]

If this link is not allowed, please delete with my apologies, mods. This is from a website that LOGO TV (the LGBTQA channel that RuPaul's Drag Race is on ICYDK) owns.

I think this is absolutely reprehensible!!

Father Reportedly Refused To Claim Orlando Shooting Victim’s Body Because He Was Gay

http://www.newnownext.com/father-re...o-shooting-victim-because-he-was-gay/06/2016/

 

[human]

I work in horse barns. There is almost nothing but illegal immigrants working in horse barns here. Cleaning stalls, cutting grass etc. Paid under the table. They are good with horses. They know NO english. In all of the barns here there are so many Spanish to English Dictionaries. Seriously. At one hunter/jumper barn I go to... in every aisle there is a dictionary sitting on the rail.

Big turnover in these big barns. Everyday there is someone that was there yesterday, gone today and someone new there now.

They weren't vetted. They aren't legal. There are so many here in this area that it's crazy. I am 45 minutes outside of Nashville.

Exactly. No illegal will be vetted because they are not seen by govt agencies. Thank the owners of businesses who hire these people for low wages. They work for hours and hours. Violate all kinds of laws.

I do not blame peopke for leaving, Mexico is filled to the brim with money. The coast from Cancun to Tulum is filled with condos and resorts. That is like 80 miles. I have gone only to Yelappa on the other coast so I don't know that side.

Then there are the places in the interior filled with money. The people do not get the money so they leave. Then there are the ones from other countries such as San Salvador. These countries are exploited, but the regular people get little.

I imagine a lot of people in the US would risk a lot to get a better life. Look how pioneers crossed the country in the US with people dying along the way.

 

[human]

I agree with you but I'm still stuck on how awful this was. Very few angry rejects reacted this horrifically. Why did he go so far? To convince everyone he was ISIS and/or to show how gay he wasn't?

Yes, what put him over the line? Could it be the HIV? Seems so possible if true

 

[Tricia]

No more Obama bashing.

Look at the title if this thread. It's not about you and your politics.

I don't know how much clearer I can make thia statement.