FL - Somer Thompson, 7, Orange Park, 19 Oct 2009 #37

[Calliope]

That and maybe something they found on her clothes or shoes? They even said they were using shovels at JH's house on Gano and then we had the digging at the burned out house. That never made sense to me.

Having a bit of a brain farct on the specifics, but on one of the forensic shows a while back they solved the rape/murder of a young girl by small beads of metal found on her body/clothing. The man that kidnapped, raped and murdered her was a welder (or did some sort of welding activity as a hobby... can't recall exactly what).

What do we know about JH's hobbies or activities other than gaming and child (dear God)? Could it be something they found on her clothing or body that would be specific to those particular locations?

 

[Calliope]

Do you think that they will announce right away? Or do you think they will wait awhile?

Not that I think that the child is OK, not in the tiniest tiniest bit, but the million dollar bail seems excessive for the third degree felony charge.

I don't want to see him on the streets ever, but third degree doesn't seem to warrant such a big bail, does it? That's what makes me think that they are going to charge him with the murder.

Or maybe it's so much because each picture is a third degree felony? IDK

I posted links earlier in the thread which lead me to believe he shouldn't have been assigned bail at all.

I'll see if I can find it and repost.

ETA: here

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4820537&postcount=215"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Found Deceased FL- Somer Renee Thompson, Orange Park, Thread #38[/ame]

Very odd that he wouldn't accept the offer of an attorney, considering the seriousness of the charges and the amount of the bond. I'm sure he qualifies. I would like to see a transcript of the detention/bail hearing.

http://www4.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode18/usc_sec_18_00003142----000-.html

(3) Subject to rebuttal by the person, it shall be presumed that no condition or combination of conditions will reasonably assure the appearance of the person as required and the safety of the community if the judicial officer finds that there is probable cause to believe that the person committed—

(A) an offense for which a maximum term of imprisonment of ten years or more is prescribed in the Controlled Substances Act (21 U.S.C. 801 et seq.), the Controlled Substances Import and Export Act (21 U.S.C. 951 et seq.), or chapter 705 of title 46;

(B) an offense under section 924 (c), 956 (a), or 2332b of this title;

(C) an offense listed in section 2332b (g)(5)(B) of title 18, United States Code, for which a maximum term of imprisonment of 10 years or more is prescribed;

(D) an offense under chapter 77 of this title for which a maximum term of imprisonment of 20 years or more is prescribed; or

(E) an offense involving a minor victim under section 1201, 1591, 2241, 2242, 2244 (a)(1), 2245, 2251, 2251A, 2252 (a)(1), 2252 (a)(2), 2252 (a)(3), 2252A (a)(1), 2252A (a)(2), 2252A (a)(3), 2252A (a)(4), 2260, 2421, 2422, 2423, or 2425 of this title.

(i) Contents of Detention Order.— In a detention order issued under subsection (e) of this section, the judicial officer shall—

(1) include written findings of fact and a written statement of the reasons for the detention;

(2) direct that the person be committed to the custody of the Attorney General for confinement in a corrections facility separate, to the extent practicable, from persons awaiting or serving sentences or being held in custody pending appeal;

(3) direct that the person be afforded reasonable opportunity for private consultation with counsel; and

(4) direct that, on order of a court of the United States or on request of an attorney for the Government, the person in charge of the corrections facility in which the person is confined deliver the person to a United States marshal for the purpose of an appearance in connection with a court proceeding.


It would seem that the charges against him fall under some of those listed in 3E above (underlined and linked), and the way it reads to me he can (and should) be held without bail. Again, he was taken into custody by Federal agents, and what he's accused of clearly fall under Federal statutes, yet it's not clear to me that he'll be tried in Federal or state court.

 

[NSC]

Cases of POI named but no arrest, just to name a few....there are a ton out there:

Madeline McCann - BTW< eyes for lies thinks parents are innocent.
http://www.truecrimereport.com/2009/05/police_name_convicted_pedophil.php


The Grohne Case - also was not perp, obviously
http://www.ajr.org/article.asp?id=4042

Juan Bolanas Case-
http://www.startribune.com/local/east/70383832.html?elr

Neveah Buchannan - No arrests made to date
http://www.toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20090528/NEWS02/905289997/0/NEWS

Shannon Sherill
Not a suspect but has not been eliminated as a POI
http://www.indy.com/posts/person-of-interest-in-23-year-old-missing-child-case

Jeanine Nicarico Case - Wrongfully Convicted WRONG person -
http://www.talkleft.com/story/2009/7/31/5642/06267

 

[NSC]

Let me show you just a few cases where SHERIFF'S offices have gunned down a POI/SUSPECT/WRONGPERP for election reasons -- I am SORRY but I believe this Jarred Harrell is being named as a POI, because "it fits" convienantly for the Sheriff and his upcoming election, followed on the heels of a very violent week in Jacksonville
-Rape of girl left in woods
-attempted kidnapping of an 11 year old girl
-murder of christian high school student

THIS is called PR nightmare for the Sheriff and this is DAMAGE control!!!! I am VERY politically active and I understand how the game works!!!

Cook County Sheriff
Jacyln Dwaliby Case-Tried to pin it on Step-Dad:
http://www.law.northwestern.edu/wrongfulconvictions/exonerations/7MenOut.html

Will County Sheriff
Riley Fox case-Tried to Pin it on Dad
https://antipolygraph.org/cgi-bin/forums/YaBB.pl?num=1146566231


Dupage County Sheriff
Jeanine Nicarico:
[ame]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeanine_Nicarico_murder_case[/ame]
Special Note:
Seven DuPage County law enforcement officials, three prosecutors and four deputies, were indicted by a grand jury in December 1996 on charges of conspiracy to convict Cruz despite being aware of exculpatory evidence. After numerous proceedings, in June 1999 all seven had been acquitted for framing the men
(OF COURSE THEY GOT OFF FOR FRAMING THEM - CORRUPTION)


You see you MUST understand how Sheriff's offices are under funded etc etc.. RE-ELECTION is key to them..

Would you like me to go on? I could fill up 30 pages here SHOWING the INEPTNESS and CORRUPTION in Sheriff's offices where people have been framed or pinned for ones own reputation and re-elecability

 

[Calliope]

Cases of POI named but no arrest, just to name a few....there are a ton out there:

Madeline McCann - BTW< eyes for lies thinks parents are innocent.
http://www.truecrimereport.com/2009/05/police_name_convicted_pedophil.php


The Grohne Case - also was not perp, obviously
http://www.ajr.org/article.asp?id=4042

Juan Bolanas Case-
http://www.startribune.com/local/east/70383832.html?elr

Neveah Buchannan - No arrests made to date
http://www.toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20090528/NEWS02/905289997/0/NEWS

Shannon Sherill
Not a suspect but has not been eliminated as a POI
http://www.indy.com/posts/person-of-interest-in-23-year-old-missing-child-case

Jeanine Nicarico Case - Wrongfully Convicted WRONG person -
http://www.talkleft.com/story/2009/7/31/5642/06267

http://news.duke.edu/lacrosseincident/

 

[believe09]

I get your examples, but for this guy I am thinking he looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, so....JMHO. We will see as the investigation moves forward, I suppose.

 

[NSC]

One more thing and I won't ask any questions for a while - just read...this person had a dog that Somer petted. Did she pet the dog a lot? Was this a long-haired animal...because they shed so much. Do you think they might have found a long hair on her? That they could trace back?

I wonder also if any neighbors who saw this guy smoking and watching the kids ever called or thought it was suspicious. Wow, he appeared on the scene quickly! I just hope and pray they find the killer soon.

I think if they had this dog hair on Somer - they would have been going door to door on the usual route home looking for this "mystery dog" asking neighbors and taking samples--

I have to say, it makes me ill that this person is going to be convicted in a court of public opinion of murdering Somer. Shake your heads and research how many people innocent of crimes this has happened to in similar cases - I posted a few but there are TONS out there. Is he guilty of having child ? We don't know because he has not gone to his TRIAL yet - Remember, innocent until proven guilty in this country-- If he is guilty he needs to be locked up. FOR SURE. However, we have not heard anything except he is a POI - because the circumstances FIT - I will say it again, this comes on the heels of a lot of public pressure due to a very violent week in Jacksonville. How convienent the timing is on this. The Sheriff is up for re-election this year... this ought to keep people satisfied for awhile and court of public opinion is now satisfied with old Sheriff B. They got their man, right?? Pressure is off. I have to wonder if JH is a POI because he could be a potential witness they would like to speak with but not that of the perp.

 

[NSC]

I have not read the extradition articles on ________ (J.H.) but it was my guess that he may have fought being brought to Fl based on the possibility that he would not get a fair trial here. After all, the media has done so much coverage already, and there are people screaming for the death penalty - plus so many terrible comments which we would never say here about what people think should be done to him. So I may be wrong but maybe he or his lawyer feels he might not have much of a chance of finding an impartial jury here, if he indeed is the suspect, and if it is brought to trial.

Public sentiment either for or against a suspect would certainly be improper.

I agree. They should have had enough information to make an arrest in Somer's case first before just naming him a POI --- but why not name him a SUSPECT then??? -- UNLESS, they thought the extradition would be more complicated on charges of first degree murder. If they bring him back to JAX and charge him first thing I will reconsider my stance. But if they don't - I stand by my pawn theory. :snooty:

 

[NSC]

That and maybe something they found on her clothes or shoes? They even said they were using shovels at JH's house on Gano and then we had the digging at the burned out house. That never made sense to me.

It is possible that if Somer had any dirt on her shoes or any residue at all that they are taking Samples to see if it matches up to that particular yard - Same for the Gano home. I think they need to rule out everything they can and they can't do that with out checking unfamiliar places first. JMO.

 

[sadnpod]

Hello everyone...

Ive been reading along...

I personally think this JH person fits too perfectly for public opinion. I am visiting NC at the moment. It appears from all the congrats being passed around that he is already convicted by the public, and from what family says in NE FL, the same is true there.

What if Somer was not sexually assaulted by JH? What if the only DNA they found was on the outside of her body? What if JH's trash was also dumped with the same trash as somer was found in? Couldnt a good defense attny instill a reasonable doubt?

Public opinion has convicted Misty Cummings. Shes in jail on drug charges, which seems to make everyone feel like justice has been served. Not me.

Public opinion has convicted OJ. Hes in jail for armed robbery, which again seems to make everyone feel like justice has been served. Not me.

I get the feeling we are headed in that direction again. Im gonna need alot more EVIDENCE that connects him to somer than what has been told at this point.

I wont be satisfied if they IMPLY he did this, but alas... we dont have enough evidence to convict, so everyone... just be happy we got him... hes in jail for child .. rest easy.

If this is what happens, I will be even more convinced that the perp is getting away with it and is probably sporting "dupers delight" on their mug, and can finally stop wearing purple.

 

[NSC]

That's what I think too.

I go the next step then if that DNA did not match up what could possess a sheriff to still name him a POI?

He would be publicly ridiculed and ran out of LE for it.

Oh on the contrary good Dr He will string it along for election purposes. He never named him a suspect, he didn't arrest JH for the murder of Somer - he was only a POI and lookie lookie - the Sheriff is working SO hard to catch the murderer, no I think he will be viewed as "doing his job" -- JMO of course

 

[Ms Suzanne]

You know,if his DNA was found on Somer.Out of all the people and all the people in the neighborhood.How did hid DNA get directly on her in any way.I do think he is a very good suspect.

 

[NSC]

I would just like to say that I don't think the murderer (if not locked up) would take a chance doing this again during an open investigation, and I am so glad because that would mean the other Thompson children are safe, the family does not have to worry that they are in danger. This has been such a big conern all along.

I was impressed to know that law enforcement actually stayed with them for three weeks, which shows how much they cared. I am confident they continue, in whatever way they deem possible, to give them ongoing support.

"Or they just might not do this ever again" --- where did I hear that and from whom :waitasec: I will have to check my notes on who said but I always thought that was a strange comment when I heard it spoken :twocents:

 

[BeanE]

Just an aside from a lawyer regarding 'innocent until proven guilty':

Innocent until proven guilty is a legal device to require the prosecutor to prove his case (in this case beyond a reasonable doubt). But we don't have to make that assumption since we aren't the jury. In the case of most accuseds there's actually a presumption they're probably guilty. Which is why bail is required and jail is given to those "innocent until proven guilty" who are flight risks and who can't make bail.

(no, we weren't discussing this case)

And from our WS member, criminal defense attorney Richard Hornsby (rhornsby):

Actually, the "presumption of innocence" until proven guilty is not found anywhere in the U.S. Constitution (nor is the root word "innocent" - ).

In any event, it is a rule of jurisprudence that applies to the person on trial - not a person who is being pointed at by the person on trial to raise the reasonable doubt (also not mentioned anywhere in the US Constitution) that someone else may be the culprit.

If that other suspect is ever put on trial, they too would be able to then claim innocent until proven guilty and try to raise reasonable doubt that the other person did it - even though the other person was acquitted.

"Better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer", expressed by the English jurist William Blackstone in his Commentaries on the Laws of England, published in the 1760s.

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4741990"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Motion to Take Deposition to Perpetuate Testimony of Jill Kerley[/ame]

 

[NSC]

Do you think that they will announce right away? Or do you think they will wait awhile?

Not that I think that the child is OK, not in the tiniest tiniest bit, but the million dollar bail seems excessive for the third degree felony charge.

I don't want to see him on the streets ever, but third degree doesn't seem to warrant such a big bail, does it? That's what makes me think that they are going to charge him with the murder.

Or maybe it's so much because each picture is a third degree felony? IDK

Apples to Orange - Tomatoes to TomaTOES -- Remember that alleged robbery at DT home that had the wrong address, those 4 kids have no bail -- When I look at how the bail process works in FL I am always mystified -on all the cases and sick things I have seen while sifting through records- :waitasec: -- You would think a pending murder arrest would indicate no bail at all -- A Million dollars isn't that much money, to me anyway -- so he needs to come up with 100,000 -- people come up with that all the time to get out of jail.

 

[sadnpod]

You know,if his DNA was found on Somer.Out of all the people and all the people in the neighborhood.How did hid DNA get directly on her in any way.I do think he is a very good suspect.

OT I feel misty and OJ are guilty.They are also in jail for other things they should not have been doing.

Well, if his trash was picked up and dumped into the same trash as she was found in, his dna and things from his house could easily be on somer, and yes, so could a lot of other neighbors.

IN this country, FEELING someone is guilty is not enough to convict them. Putting them in jail for other things is all well and good when they are guilty of other things...

But IMO, does not cause a warm fuzzy for me.

IF JH killed somer, being jailed for child is not good enough for me.

But, ( Just my opinion).. I think it will be good enough for a lot of people.

 

[sadnpod]

"Or they just might not do this ever again" --- where did I hear that and from whom :waitasec: I will have to check my notes on who said but I always thought that was a strange comment when I heard it spoken :twocents:

IIRC.. I think it was Freed. DT's Attorney.

 

[Ms Suzanne]

Cases of POI named but no arrest, just to name a few....there are a ton out there:

Madeline McCann - BTW< eyes for lies thinks parents are innocent.
http://www.truecrimereport.com/2009/05/police_name_convicted_pedophil.php


The Grohne Case - also was not perp, obviously
http://www.ajr.org/article.asp?id=4042

Juan Bolanas Case-
http://www.startribune.com/local/east/70383832.html?elr

Neveah Buchannan - No arrests made to date
http://www.toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20090528/NEWS02/905289997/0/NEWS

Shannon Sherill
Not a suspect but has not been eliminated as a POI
http://www.indy.com/posts/person-of-interest-in-23-year-old-missing-child-case

Jeanine Nicarico Case - Wrongfully Convicted WRONG person -
http://www.talkleft.com/story/2009/7/31/5642/06267

Maybe they think they have the suspects in jail in Nevaeh's case so they are not doing anything.I do think something needs to be done in Nevaeh Buchanan.s case.more attention,states attorney,new investigator,something does need to be done.They need to be pushed to do something.It's very sad.In Somers case I do think this guy is a very good suspect.I was shocked though it wasn't the crew members.I guess we'll see what enfolds.I just pray justice is done for Somer and Nevaeh.

 

[NSC]

I get your examples, but for this guy I am thinking he looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, so....JMHO. We will see as the investigation moves forward, I suppose.

Yes, but look at how many other cases that it looks like a duck etc..

Thanks Caliope, you see where I am going right? I don't think as responsible sleuthers it is right to convict this guy in the public opinion masses. Show me SOLID DNA evidence and SOLID evidence and I will concede.

In some of the other cases I listed, they gunned straight for the parents without ever really following other leads. In the end, they lost all around. The parents were victimized by being wrongfully accused while loosing their child and the real murderer still roams free. In the Jaclyn case which is complicated they believed it was a relative whom I believe is now deceased. The Fox case is more than disturbing to me. And in the Jeanine case innocent men were sentenced to death - the right person is set to die next week I believe. How many lives were ruined -- it is adding injury to insult. I can't help but wonder in this case if beasler really is doing is job but in a VERY strategic way. :waitasec:

 

[Ms Suzanne]

Well, if his trash was picked up and dumped into the same trash as she was found in, his dna and things from his house could easily be on somer, and yes, so could a lot of other neighbors.

IN this country, FEELING someone is guilty is not enough to convict them. Putting them in jail for other things is all well and good when they are guilty of other things...

But IMO, does not cause a warm fuzzy for me.

IF JH killed somer, being jailed for child is not good enough for me.

But, ( Just my opinion).. I think it will be good enough for a lot of people.

His DNA possibly directly on her body with sexual assault done to her and he was caught doing child pornagraphy.I don't think this looks too good for him at all.