FL FL - Weeki Wachee, WhtFem UP12589, 20-30, SK victim, in shallow grave, Mar'81

[Migmuu]

Did you get a hold of the detective?

No, not yet. I'm looking for an email address just in case I can't get him by phone over the weekend

 

[Migmuu]

Looks like the timeline for Patricia Action matches up after all. The NamUs profile was modified on the 11th and it changed the estimated year of death from ''1979 - 1980'' to ''1978 - 1980''.

It's really starting to look like this could be her

 

[Sleuthster]

Looks like the timeline for Patricia Action matches up after all. The NamUs profile was modified on the 11th and it changed the estimated year of death from ''1979 - 1980'' to ''1978 - 1980''.

It's really starting to look like this could be her

I'm keeping my fingers crossed!


There is sort of personal. I was blown away when I started reading on this case. Only a couple months before Patricia Action disappeared I was 11 and home alone in Oldsmar, told my mother I was sick. I wasn't. Suddenly there was a sound at the door like someone trying to unlock it. I looked out the window and there was a man in a workers out fit. Older man. There was a pest control car in the next driveway (townhouses). I yelled out from the other side of the door that my mother was in the shower. Come back later. He said he was an electrician sent to fix something. I repeated come back. He then started cussing and said he knew i was lying and to open the &$#@ door and make it easier. I bolted the top, ran to the kitchen and called my mom who was working at the mall not far screaming to her what was happening. She said, I'll be there grab the biggest knife we have and stay in the kitchen.

He proceeded to get the bottom unlocked with some kind of key but couldn't get the deadbolt. So he went around back and tried to get in. My mother pulled up soon after and he saw her and took off as she ran after his car screaming and hiting it. In the end it took PCSO an HOUR to respond and all they could tell us was that the pest control car was reported stolen then night before.

I saw a pic of the father after looking at this case, and the fact that JR lived in West Tampa by Oldsmar at the time and Pops was an electrician along with the time frame I believe it was them. There was a younger guy in the car my mom said in the passenger's seat. I had not thought about this in years. It all came back when I saw this.

I want to know that these women are identified and that if this is Patty she is identified and her family have closure. I also want to know if she was part of their sick serial killer rampage.

Please let me know if you find out anything from the detective. Thank you.

 

[Migmuu]

That is horrifying. Good on you for not opening the door.

If you're right and the man who tried to attack you was Mansfield Sr. and his son was in the car ... Wow. That sounds like they may have worked together on some of the assaults. Makes me wonder if they worked as a team on at least a few of the murders.

I sent the email to Boylan around 5 or 6 hours ago. If I don't get a response over the weekend, he'll probably reply on Monday. I'm going to call again on Monday anyway since that's when he's back in

 

[Sleuthster]

That is horrifying. Good on you for not opening the door.

If you're right and the man who tried to attack you was Mansfield Sr. and his son was in the car ... Wow. That sounds like they may have worked together on some of the assaults. Makes me wonder if they worked as a team on at least a few of the murders.

I sent the email to Boylan around 5 or 6 hours ago. If I don't get a response over the weekend, he'll probably reply on Monday. I'm going to call again on Monday anyway since that's when he's back in

In one of the news articles Mansfield Sr told an inmate he was incarcarated with in 1981 that he killed a girl that he abducted from a KOA campground. This is the campground Eileen Ziegler was abducted from and ultimately killed. He had too much info about the crime IMO. So it is possible/probable that he was involved. The son however plead out to all 4 murders and the murder in California.

So either he did it, the father did it and Billy Jr just figured he'd take the rap. or they where both in it together. This would make sense because Billy Jr was caught pretty quickly for the Cali murder. Also, Sandra Graham was seen leaving the bar with Billy Mansfield Jr. Some one ID'd him leaving the bar but he left the state before they could question him according to the news articles I posted prior about Sandra's case. To me it seems like he made some mistakes in those cases but not in the others because they don't even have an idea of the 2 doe's ID's. So that makes me believe he had help in some of the crimes. Billy Jr does not appear to be the mastermind. Not to mention that the 4 bodies where buried on Billy Sr's property so he had to have some knowledge at the least.

 

[Sleuthster]

With my case, I believe it was random. I had left the townhouse to go check the mail that morning maybe a half hour before. You had to walk down to the main road which was right in view of Tampa Rd to check the mailboxes. It was too coincidental that I had done this shortly before. If it was them I figure they where planing to grab someone, that's why they had stolen the pest control vehicle late the night before, and saw me going or coming back from the mail box that day and figured I'd be easy prey.

 

[alllads]

Wow Sleuthster, your story is terrifying! The scary thing is that the whole Mansfield property was never dug up, only that area. And I read in some article (wish I could remember, sorry!) that there had been more tips called in about the property, but police couldn't do much because the caller couldn't/wouldn't say if the potential body was inside the house, in the ground, where in the ground... Supposedly there were limited search rights because the house technically also belongs to the Mrs Mansfield (wife/mother), who claims to know absolutely nothing about all the bodies buried only feet from her house...

Especially considering it was two generations, I would not at all be surprised that there were more victims. There were also a few women who were raped but not killed, and since some people do not report being raped out of fear, I'm guessing there are also way more rape victims...

Considering the circumstances, I would think that even if Patricia isn't THIS UID, there is a chance that she could be another unlocated victim of Mansfield's...

 

[Sleuthster]

I never thought about that. I know they had search warrants which where about to expire when they found the bodies. Billy Mansfield Jr had been seen at the bar a couple years before Sandra Graham disappeared and was identified by other patrons. This is how they got the warrant.

You're right they didn't search the whole area of the news reports are right and there could be more. It was 1981 when the bodies where found. I wonder if Mrs. Mansfield is still alive or if there's a new owner for the property. I wouldn't want to be the owner if there is. It would be creepy knowing what was found there and the possibility that there are others.

 

[Sleuthster]

Also, there where multiple unsolved homicides that occurred in 1977 in Pasco County of women that PSCO website indicates may have all been connected with each other. Their bodies where all dumped in Wesley Chapel. I wonder what the C.O.D was on them and if there's DNA in CODIS. I wonder if they have bother Jr. and Sr. dna in CODIS. There may be others.

 

[carbuff]

I would think that finding several bodies on a piece of properties would constitute probable cause to look for others, no matter who owned the property. Assuming they wanted to look.

 

[alllads]

I would think that finding several bodies on a piece of properties would constitute probable cause to look for others, no matter who owned the property. Assuming they wanted to look.

I'll try to find where I read it. I don't think it's the case that they didn't look at all, but didn't look in all areas of the property (it wasn't a tiny property, 5 acres). Found it, it was in the "When Angels Wept book someone linked upthread. Obviously not the most reliable source, but from articles also, basically a lot of digging was done, but not EVERYTHING, and I think there may well have been more.

Apparently they stopped digging in mid-April 1980. They also originally expected to find more bodies than just 4...
http://www.nytimes.com/1981/03/26/us/florida-police-seek-more-bodies-in-5-acre-junkyard.html As far as I can tell, the digging was prompted by one tip, which presumably indicated that there could be up to 6 bodies. In the article I've linked they say they'll level the house if they have to, but as far as I know it was never leveled.

 

[carbuff]

Ah, thanks, that clears things up. Five acres is a lot to search properly.

 

[Shin Masamura]

The drawings remind me of Cynthia Gooding & Teresa Alfonso. But they went missing together in 1974 in Marathon and might be too young. Eerie resemblance though.

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/218dffl.html
http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/2dffl.html

http://z10.invisionfree.com/usedtobedoe/index.php?act=Attach&type=post&id=22014446

Wow, what a resemblance!

 

[Migmuu]

I still haven't gotten a reply to my e-mail and I can't seem to get in contact with him by phone. I just left a voicemail.

If I don't get a reply today, I'm just going to call the Clearwater PD (which is in charge of Patricia's case).

 

[Migmuu]

Just got off the phone with Det. Boylan. He says we are ''on the right track'': Patricia has actually been on their list of potential matches for a while now and his team is working on getting DNA/dentals to compare to this UID.

The other unidentified woman found on the property is going to show up on NamUs soon, too.

 

[Migmuu]

I just checked NamUs and saw that the other unidentified victim has been added.
I'm kind of confused. It looks like the information for UP#12579 was switched to the new profile, UP#12589. This Doe was found in March 1981. I think whoever entered the case into NamUs probably just got the date confused with the other Doe.

Nothing major has changed with UP#12589 (formerly 12579). However, the information about the pinkish cloth is gone and the 'Clothing and Accessories' section now says that the remains were wrapped in a red and green blanket.

Here are the stats for UP#12579:
White female, 20 - 30 years old. Estimated to be 64 inches (5'4) in height. She died between 1978 and 1980. Dentals are available and entered, DNA is not available.
Besides that, there's nothing unique that can help identify her.

ETA: Carl, can you please change the title with the updated case number and date change (Mar'81)?
ETA again: Thanks!!

 

[Sleuthster]

I just checked NamUs and saw that the other unidentified victim has been added.
I'm kind of confused. It looks like the information for UP#12579 was switched to the new profile, UP#12589. This Doe was found in March 1981. I think whoever entered the case into NamUs probably just got the date confused with the other Doe.

Nothing major has changed with UP#12589 (formerly 12579). However, the information about the pinkish cloth is gone and the 'Clothing and Accessories' section now says that the remains were wrapped in a red and green blanket.

Here are the stats for UP#12579:
White female, 20 - 30 years old. Estimated to be 64 inches (5'4) in height. She died between 1978 and 1980. Dentals are available and entered, DNA is not available.
Besides that, there's nothing unique that can help identify her.

ETA: Carl, can you please change the title with the updated case number and date change (Mar'81)?
ETA again: Thanks!!

DNA not avail? Shame, they'll have to go by dentals or is it possible they can exhume the remains and get DNA? Does anyone know?

 

[Sleuthster]

Possible for UP# 12579

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/2874dffl.html

Sharon Anne Harrer
Missing since November 26, 1979 from St. Petersburg, Florida
Classification: Endangered Missing

Vital Statistics

Date Of Birth: August 20, 1959
Age at Time of Disappearance: 19 years old
Height and Weight at Time of Disappearance: White female. Blond hair; blue eyes.
Distinguishing Characteristics: 5'4"; 98 lbs.
Marks, Scars: Tattoo on buttocks.
Circumstances of Disappearance
Harper was last seen in on November 26, 1979 at DJ's Pioneer Club in Madeira Beach.

She got into a Cadillac with a man who called himself Robert Crawford. They were never seen again.

 

[Sleuthster]

Sharon Harrer disappeared from a club/bar, she left with a man who apparently gave a fake name and Billy Mansfield live in St. Pete for a time according to news articles. I wonder what Mansfield JR and SR drove at the time. Then again it could have been stolen.

She is also the right height and age range.

 

[CarlK90245]

I became aware of these two cases last year when I was contacted by a relative of Sharon Harrer. During our exchange, she indicated that she thought Sharon might be one of the two unidentified victims found in Weeki Wachee Florida. I had not heard of any such unidentified victims. I looked into this, and found the above-linked article, and I realized that there were no NamUs or DoeNet casefiles for these two unidentified females.

But I had moved on to other things, and this issue slipped my mind until I saw the newly added casefiles.

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/h/harper_sharon.html

Looking at the details, Sharon looks like a very strong possible match for either of the two Jane Does. Her height is right. Her age is within range. And the circumstances of her disappearance look very similar to Mansfield's M.O. Sharon worked at a nightclub/bar. And Mansfield picked up one of his other victims at a bar.

Sharon still isn't listed in NamUs. I will try to contact this relative of Sharon again to let her know that there are new NamUs UP casefiles for these two victims, and I will suggest that she contact authorities to try to arrange a comparison.


ETA: Yes, she is in NamUs. (MP 17770)
https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/17770/0/