FOIA information request (George Waters) info and questions.

[Cubby]

Would the fee waiver have been IF files were found? I can't see a cost for records they don't have......

 

[Annasmom]

Would the fee waiver have been IF files were found? I can't see a cost for records they don't have......

Also, how can I agree to a fee when I don't know what the fee is? They asked me to specify how much I was willing to pay...it all seems rather odd.

 

[OzzieMum]

Also, how can I agree to a fee when I don't know what the fee is? They asked me to specify how much I was willing to pay...it all seems rather odd.

Hi Annasmom,

Are they serious? How much are you willing to pay? That sounds a bit shonky to me. I would have thought that there would be set fees for the info/report that you request.

Would LE be able/willing to obtain the info on your behalf?

 

[Annasmom]

Hi Annasmom,

Are they serious? How much are you willing to pay? That sounds a bit shonky to me. I would have thought that there would be set fees for the info/report that you request.

Would LE be able/willing to obtain the info on your behalf?

I said $100 maximum, which I think is all I can afford (and probably all it's worth). No, LE will not help us without new hard evidence. They wish us all the best, but they are overworked, understaffed and underfunded and have to try to deal with a huge workload of current cases.

 

[SideKick]

Has LE ever read the Squibb's?

 

[SideKick]

To receive a copy of a deceased person's passport, you can do the following:

InstructionsThings You'll Need:

Name
Date of birth
Address
ID
Death certificate
Reason for the request

Step 1: Gather all the information that is needed to request a copy of a deceased person's US passport. You will need a copy of the deceased's death certificate, first and last name, address, place of birth, the reason for the passport, your telephone number and a valid ID of the person requesting the copy of the passport.

Step 2: Send a check for the fee of $60 to cover the cost of the copy of the deceased person's U.S. passport. The payment can be made with a personal check or a money order. Make the check out to "Department of State."

Step 3: Place all the above information in a envelope and mail it to the following address:
Department of State
Passport Services
Research and Liaison Section
Room 500
1111 19th St. NW
Washington, DC 20524-1705

Step 4: Seal the envelope with the requested information and place a stamp on it. To ensure a faster and safer delivery, send the mail by priority mail.

Is this viable? Sounds relatively easy to accomplish in getting the original passport with places and dates of travel.

http://www.ehow.com/how_4964765_copy-deceased-persons-passport.html

 

[Cubby]

Annasmom already has a copy of GW's passport application. That is how they found out he applied for a replacement passport claiming the original was destroyed in a fire. The office which issues the passport would not have travel info. The stamps on the passport itself would, and that is what GW destroyed claiming it was lost/destroyed in a fire.

 

[SideKick]

Annasmom already has a copy of GW's passport application. That is how they found out he applied for a replacement passport claiming the original was destroyed in a fire. The office which issues the passport would not have travel info. The stamps on the passport itself would, and that is what GW destroyed claiming it was lost/destroyed in a fire.

I guess I was confused/application vs the real passport. For some odd reason I thought the Passport place would have something to go on, but how if GW had his own passport! time for me to take a break!!
Only the countries visited would have possible info from their customs, portal of entry....If that!

Thanks Cubby!

 

[Cubby]

Sadly, I don't know how we would access the countries port of entry info... I think someone else here who has traveled internationally mentioned it would be very unlikely we could gain that info...... But not having done any international travel outside of Canada, I would really not know since I never needed a passport to get into Canada at the time.

 

[Annasmom]

Sadly, I don't know how we would access the countries port of entry info... I think someone else here who has traveled internationally mentioned it would be very unlikely we could gain that info...... But not having done any international travel outside of Canada, I would really not know since I never needed a passport to get into Canada at the time.

Maybe some customs places keep track of who goes in and out, but the last time I traveled out of the country (summer before last) to Greece, all they did was stamp your passport. No doubt most consulates keep records of visas they give out, but there has never been a visa required for a U.S. citizen traveling to Europe.

 

[Annasmom]

I feel as if I'm always saying "that's impossible" to good ideas from WSers.

 

[Annasmom]

I got another letter from the FBI today saying that I needed to send them a copy of GB's death certificate in order for them to search. I neglected to say that it was Bern who made contact, got all the forms and papers, and sent them to me. So now we're in some kind of queue for the information. I have been thinking about those fees, and now I think probably the fees they're talking about have to do with the cost of copying and mailing any documents they might find...which is only reasonable.

 

[Cubby]

Maybe some customs places keep track of who goes in and out, but the last time I traveled out of the country (summer before last) to Greece, all they did was stamp your passport. No doubt most consulates keep records of visas they give out, but there has never been a visa required for a U.S. citizen traveling to Europe.

Thanks. No, you are not negative.... I think sometimes we just might not see the same possible avenues so I try to ask for someone to expand on the possibility if I am not understanding it.

I wonder if this would then explain GW's calling the Italian Consulate? Maybe be wanted to confirm there was still no need for a visa to travel to Italy at the time?

If so, it is possible GW had a family in Italy willing to adopt Anna, or, (someone refresh my memory - what was the odd area of medicine GW was in trouble for practicing or over treating?) Perhaps there was some kind of medical study or something in Italy pertaining to that field of study which attracted GW. Am I making sense?

 

[Skully]

I got four pieces of mail from the FBI today: Two said that my request for a fee waiver was denied. The other two said they were searching the "indices to our Central Records System for the information you requested, and will inform you of the results as soon as possible" There are separate requests for George Henry Waters II and "Disappearance of Anna Christian Eifee Waters". These are all form letters. Since I don't know what fee they are talking about, I am a little worried about that part of it. I guess, according to what Doogie says, that they now have a file on ME, but I'm not particularly worried about that.

Hi Annasmom,

I just stopped in to see what was new. Glad I did, the fee is for copies. When I talked to the agent, he said just put down $50. Anything over that they will call you to make sure you want to spend the money. I put $100 down on the form when I requested information on GW. I don't know what you wrote on the form, but you can call them and make sure you are getting Anna's file. There is nothing on GW. You can give them the file no. off the letter I gave you. I can't request Anna's file , because she has never been declared deceased. According to the man I spoke with, she would be an adult and would have the right to privacy, yes, that is what he said. If she had a death certificate, and I sent it in, they could give me the file if it hadn't been destroyed. So, you as the parent of the victim can request the file. I would include the birth certificate with the form. If you need the number to call, I can get it off the site. I sent you a copy of the letter stating the file on GW had been destroyed. So attach that if you need to. I also emailed the letter I got from the office of Information policy. I hope you got it, I sent it by email.

Hope this helps, call me if you need to. There was lots going on with the Haleigh case and I got over 50 emails to say I was spot on with the case. I post in the dream thread and posted a date back in March and a drawing more than 14 month ago, both correct. :angel:

Oh, and after the conversation I had with the last agent, you can bet they have a file on me. I hubby is worried they are going to show up at our door, over this last thing.

 

[OzzieMum]

Thanks. No, you are not negative.... I think sometimes we just might not see the same possible avenues so I try to ask for someone to expand on the possibility if I am not understanding it.

I wonder if this would then explain GW's calling the Italian Consulate? Maybe be wanted to confirm there was still no need for a visa to travel to Italy at the time?

If so, it is possible GW had a family in Italy willing to adopt Anna, or, (someone refresh my memory - what was the odd area of medicine GW was in trouble for practicing or over treating?) Perhaps there was some kind of medical study or something in Italy pertaining to that field of study which attracted GW. Am I making sense?

I've had a bit of a look and it appears that you do need a visa now to travel from the US to Italy.

I have found the contact details for the Italian Consulate General in SF (see below) and I think we need to contact them and get some answers. We need to find out if you needed a visa in the '70's to travel to Italy and also if they would still have these records and can we have a search done on GW. Can anyone else think of any other info we may need for the consulate?

If someone wants to give them a call, that would be great or I am happy to send them an email.

I don't know what you all think but I think we should approach the consulate from a genealogical research point of view rather than a missing child point of view which might scare them off answering questions.

Let me know what you think.

Italian Consulate General
2590 Webster Street
San Francisco, CA 94115
Phone: +1 (415) 292-9200
Fax : +1 (415) 931-7205
E-mail: [email protected]

 

[Skully]

I've had a bit of a look and it appears that you do need a visa now to travel from the US to Italy.

I have found the contact details for the Italian Consulate General in SF (see below) and I think we need to contact them and get some answers. We need to find out if you needed a visa in the '70's to travel to Italy and also if they would still have these records and can we have a search done on GW. Can anyone else think of any other info we may need for the consulate?

If someone wants to give them a call, that would be great or I am happy to send them an email.

I don't know what you all think but I think we should approach the consulate from a genealogical research point of view rather than a missing child point of view which might scare them off answering questions.

Let me know what you think.

Italian Consulate General
2590 Webster Street
San Francisco, CA 94115
Phone: +1 (415) 292-9200
Fax : +1 (415) 931-7205
E-mail: [email protected]

Hi Ozzie,

I have emailed them, and they told me that they do not have records that old. Even if they did, they won't release the information, unless I am a cop or FBI working a case, they said this is a police matter. No information is released about an American citizen going to Italy. So that is when they told me to contact the US Embassy in Rome. I haven't done it as yet. Not sure it will help if they don't have records that old. So let me know if you want me to email again, you can pm me with a list of questions, or post here.

 

[Skully]

Dear Ms. xxxx
,
Unfortunately we cannot help you locate an entry records in Italy (of an US citizen) that date over 30 years ago.
Italian privacy laws also might prevent us to disclose such records even if they were available to us.
Such records, if available, can be obtained by the police during a criminal investigation.
I suggest that you contact the American Embassy in Rome that might be able to assist you further with this matter.
Best Regards,
Aldo Mxxx
Italian Consulate San Francisco

 

[Cubby]

and I guess this is another one of those the detective assigned to Annas 'open case' won't do anything unless we find solid evidence.

Is there a way we can confirm they might have records from 73 if we got LE to contact them? Even on the same letter head we had to get them to inquire about the passport issue. It doesn't take long to type print and mail a letter.

A letter from LE might find records older than 30 years old that may not have been destroyed. We've found odd ball stuff like that in other cases which should have been destroyed but was not when we can get LE to make contact.

I say we just get LE to send the letter and see what happens.... we might get lucky and they may find records older than 30 years old.

jmo

 

[OzzieMum]

Hi Ozzie,

I have emailed them, and they told me that they do not have records that old. Even if they did, they won't release the information, unless I am a cop or FBI working a case, they said this is a police matter. No information is released about an American citizen going to Italy. So that is when they told me to contact the US Embassy in Rome. I haven't done it as yet. Not sure it will help if they don't have records that old. So let me know if you want me to email again, you can pm me with a list of questions, or post here.

Thanks Bern.

:banghead: How long does it take to become an FBI agent. Thats apparently what we need, a friendly FBI agent on our team

I think it would definitely be worth trying the US Embassy in Rome, if they know that is regarding a missing US child, they might see it in their hearts to do something.

I would ask them if there is any way that they can check old records to see if GW travelled to to Italy in the '70's and if so, when, where to and how many times and also if he travelled alone.

 

[Annasmom]

Hi Annasmom,

I just stopped in to see what was new. Glad I did, the fee is for copies. When I talked to the agent, he said just put down $50. Anything over that they will call you to make sure you want to spend the money. I put $100 down on the form when I requested information on GW. I don't know what you wrote on the form, but you can call them and make sure you are getting Anna's file. There is nothing on GW. You can give them the file no. off the letter I gave you. I can't request Anna's file , because she has never been declared deceased. According to the man I spoke with, she would be an adult and would have the right to privacy, yes, that is what he said. If she had a death certificate, and I sent it in, they could give me the file if it hadn't been destroyed. So, you as the parent of the victim can request the file. I would include the birth certificate with the form. If you need the number to call, I can get it off the site. I sent you a copy of the letter stating the file on GW had been destroyed. So attach that if you need to. I also emailed the letter I got from the office of Information policy. I hope you got it, I sent it by email.

Hope this helps, call me if you need to. There was lots going on with the Haleigh case and I got over 50 emails to say I was spot on with the case. I post in the dream thread and posted a date back in March and a drawing more than 14 month ago, both correct. :angel:

Oh, and after the conversation I had with the last agent, you can bet they have a file on me. I hubby is worried they are going to show up at our door, over this last thing.

Bern, I already sent off everything except the Brody paper. Thank you so much for doing all this phoning and copying. Yes, I did get everything. We were in a bit of a panic last week, trying to get ready for my niece's "destination" wedding, where we had to practice, pack up the instruments, etc., along with our regular chores. I wish you'd put up a link to the Haleigh information. I'd like to read it, but I'll never be able to find it without a link.:blushing: