GA - Kendrick Johnson, 17, Suspicious Death, Jan. 10/11, 2013, #1

[FrayedKnot]

I posted the correct one twice, as did gxm once. Maybe you just missed them :loveyou:

No, I saw them, but those were the ones you said were altered.......:waitasec:

 

[Linda7NJ]

Trying to shove an unconscious, strapping 17-year old head first into the mat would be near impossible… much more unlikely than the athlete getting into the mat on his own volition. Besides, the livor mortis shows that KJ's body was not moved and that he died in the inverted position.

IMO Livor mortis is not immediate.


Lividity is important to the investigator for two reasons. First, it can provide investigators with a general understanding of the time since death. These estimates are influenced by things such as temperature, body mass, conditions at the crime scene, and other factors. Suffice it to say I’m only giving you very general time frames but for your novel they should be fine. Lividity is generally seen within the first 1-2 hours following death. It will typically become fully developed within 3-4 hours but could still be altered if the body position changed. After 12 hours the lividity becomes fixed meaning it will not change.

http://forensics4fiction.com/2011/06/06/estimating-the-time-of-death-livor-mortis/


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[BeginnersLuck]

ok....

I have looked and looked for the report from the death scene so I could review it again. Do you happen to have it handy?

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Are there no other entrances? No direct access to the locker rooms? Everyone must enter and exit through those doors????


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That is another thing.. School gyms always have more than one exit/Entrance.. They have to because of fire codes and such..

Plus we can not see who was in the GYM before him..

 

[gxm]

Are there no other entrances? No direct access to the locker rooms? Everyone must enter and exit through those doors????


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IIRC, yes, there were only two entrances. Also, the gym no longer exists so it will be interesting how any further investigation will be conducted. I read that it was torn down but don't have the link handy so JMO, OMO, MOO.

 

[FrayedKnot]

Ten minutes later, he was captured walking into the gym. The video cuts to other students playing basketball. It’s unclear how much time elapsed.

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...rolled-up-mat-article-1.1502537#ixzz2jHYEkXrM

Ugh. I need a nap! This link ALSO shows kids in the gym before KJ enters.....

:banghead:

 

[vlpate]

I have looked and looked for the report from the death scene so I could review it again. Do you happen to have it handy?

sorry, had to remove b/c it leads to my blog. I have it there but I have it embedded.

 

[Linda7NJ]

IMO simply being in the inverted position would effect Livor mortis as would the elevated temperate, it's my opinion he could have been killed, hidden from view behind the mats and moved like an hour later. No one would know the difference.

I'm not saying that's what happened. I'm saying its possible.


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[vlpate]

Ugh. I need a nap! This link ALSO shows kids in the gym before KJ enters.....

:banghead:

I guess so...because if you stop the video (which is not why I posted the link, I posted because even the article says the video cuts to the kids playing basketball), you will see the players disappear as he walks through. Magically, gone. I can't help anymore than that, sorry.

 

[FrayedKnot]

Where do you see kids already in the gym when he walks in? At the :16 second mark the kid in a green shirt appears out of nowhere and that is probably due to the time lapse - he just appears, - not from the left or the right... he's just suddenly there. The reports from the beginning, even the official reports say there was no one in the gym when KJ entered except the kid who went before him. http://youtu.be/k2ITbSHnGF8

Now THIS is the one I originally saw. The gym is empty, then just as KJ is about to exit the frame, you see other kids "appear". But the kids and KJ do appear together for a split second. It appears this is edited/altered. I thought so when I first saw it.

The one from your first link with the kids already playing in the gym before KJ arrives looks more "real". :twocents:

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

http://onlineathens.com/local-news/...l-student-becomes-trapped-wrestling-mats-dies

I have not found anything that says that it was torn down just that is was the old gym. Not saying that is not the case, I just have not found it yet if there is.

 

[gxm]

IMO Livor mortis is not immediate.


Lividity is important to the investigator for two reasons. First, it can provide investigators with a general understanding of the time since death. These estimates are influenced by things such as temperature, body mass, conditions at the crime scene, and other factors. Suffice it to say I’m only giving you very general time frames but for your novel they should be fine. Lividity is generally seen within the first 1-2 hours following death. It will typically become fully developed within 3-4 hours but could still be altered if the body position changed. After 12 hours the lividity becomes fixed meaning it will not change.

http://forensics4fiction.com/2011/06/06/estimating-the-time-of-death-livor-mortis/


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Livor mortis is used to tell if a body was moved. There is no physical evidence that the body was moved. It's why KJ's face was so unrecognizable. It appears that he was always in an inverted position. Further, to the best of my knowledge, the second autopsy did not refute that KJ died in an inverted position. IMO if one begins looking at what the lawyers and their hired pathologist aren't saying, one gets a clearer picture.

 

[Linda7NJ]

But why would the person walk away, unless they got called away or were late to class? Still, the video shows him going in alone. I just don't see foul play here. Either way, it's still an accident.

I would never presume to know anyone's motive for murder. It just never makes sense to me.

How would it be an accident if someone walked away?


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[gxm]

http://onlineathens.com/local-news/...l-student-becomes-trapped-wrestling-mats-dies

I have not found anything that says that it was torn down just that is was the old gym. Not saying that is not the case, I just have not found it yet if there is.

It might have been on here that a local said the "old gym" was torn down a couple of months after KJ died. Sorry, I'm too lazy to go back and look so JMO, OMO, MOO.

 

[Linda7NJ]

Livor mortis is used to tell if a body was moved. There is no physical evidence that the body was moved. It's why KJ's face was so unrecognizable. It appears that he was always in an inverted position. Further, to the best of my knowledge, the second autopsy did not refute that KJ died in an inverted position. IMO if one begins looking at what the lawyers and their hired pathologist aren't saying, one gets a clearer picture.

I'm sorry the picture still remains clear as mud to me.


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[gxm]

I would never presume to know anyone's motive for murder. It just never makes sense to me.

How would it be an accident if someone walked away?


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If they were called away or if they were late to class and left without realizing that KJ was stuck. Keep in mind that I don't believe anyone was with him or that he was lured into the mat. I think it was bad judgment and he just didn't realize that he could get stuck and not get out.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

It might have been on here that a local said the "old gym" was torn down a couple of months after KJ died. Sorry, I'm too lazy to go back and look so JMO, OMO, MOO.

I would think that with this case that would be National news and easy to find..

 

[Linda7NJ]

Livor mortis is used to tell if a body was moved. There is no physical evidence that the body was moved. It's why KJ's face was so unrecognizable. It appears that he was always in an inverted position. Further, to the best of my knowledge, the second autopsy did not refute that KJ died in an inverted position. IMO if one begins looking at what the lawyers and their hired pathologist aren't saying, one gets a clearer picture.

It was unrecognizable because he was inverted. it's really a shame the brain and lungs couldn't be examined at the second autopsy.
There is a huge question as to the lung weight in the first.... They were too light to have died inverted...
That leads me to believe it is a possibility .


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[Linda7NJ]

If they were called away or if they were late to class and left without realizing that KJ was stuck. Keep in mind that I don't believe anyone was with him or that he was lured into the mat. I think it was bad judgment and he just didn't realize that he could get stuck and not get out.

It's a fair assessment. It surely could be an accident.
I simply put myself in his mothers shoes and would NEED a concrete answer that was consistent and cohesive. She's not getting that. She deserves that. The community does...We all do.


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[FrayedKnot]

http://onlineathens.com/local-news/...l-student-becomes-trapped-wrestling-mats-dies

I have not found anything that says that it was torn down just that is was the old gym. Not saying that is not the case, I just have not found it yet if there is.

There was a local that posted on here a few weeks back. She said that the gym had been torn down, and IIRC, that there were some definite issues with the LCSD being a bit shady. Going back to find her posts.....