GA - Kendrick Johnson, 17, Suspicious Death, Jan. 10/11, 2013, #2

[iSleuth]

It is far more likely to be a student retrieving a book or jacket or gym bag.....but almost zero possibility that they went there to do anything evil or stealthy......students know full well there are cameras everywhere in the schools. They would have no expectation of any sort of privacy at that hour of the evening.
AND FWIW....most schools use their 'old gym' every evening during basketball, volleyball, wrestling season.....which is all in process in January along with cheer and dance groups, band, theatre, choir etc all of which may use the gym areas regularly

I always worry when I hear words and absolutes like ... Always ... Never... Zero... There is always an exception.



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[BeginnersLuck]

I guess it could be equally condemned if they said yes we have accounted for said student .
People could / would/ might still question it.

But it is the official report and It is my opinion that it is a case of another unsupervised student on campus. Maybe it wasn't even a student from the school?



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Kendrick was seen going toward the area of the mats on video and never seen again on video. Hours later this person enters the school. What would he have to do with anything related to Kendrick?

Students are not all supervised at all times in high school. I will note again, this was a school of 3000 students and 170 staff. They are not supervised walking to and from where they are going. It's not possible.

 

[Montjoy]

I always worry when I hear words and absolutes like ... Always ... Never... Zero... There is always an exception.

OT -- and BBM.

Bit of an irony there! Hard to escape some absolutes. Some things are either one thing or another -- not both.

 

[Karmady]

OT -- and BBM.

Bit of an irony there! Hard to escape some absolutes. Some things are either one thing or another -- not both.

Disagree. I never speak in absolutes

 

[Tawny]

Kendrick was seen going toward the area of the mats on video and never seen again on video. Hours later this person enters the school. What would he have to do with anything related to Kendrick?

Students are not all supervised at all times in high school. I will note again, this was a school of 3000 students and 170 staff. They are not supervised walking to and from where they are going. It's not possible.

Not possible and not remotely reasonable. These are teenagers, going about their daily business. Why are we expecting them to have adult chaperones every moment of the day?

KJ's death was tragic but not at all common, so to expect adults to supervise teenagers at every waking moment as they go to and from class and extracurriculars is, well it's a little silly.

 

[iSleuth]

Not possible and not remotely reasonable. These are teenagers, going about their daily business. Why are we expecting them to have adult chaperones every moment of the day?

KJ's death was tragic but not at all common, so to expect adults to supervise teenagers at every waking moment as they go to and from class and extracurriculars is, well it's a little silly.

With a 1:17 ratio of teacher : student population the aim in general is yes to have students supervised by adults at all times.

You can't have it both ways. I am sure the school system wouldn't snicker and say that it's silly to supervise their students. Or that they do not try their best to maintain a safe and secure school campus even at night.
Same thing with visitors. These procedures are really intense since 9/11 since SandyHook . Etc serious matters

You know I keep trying to look at this tragic case from all sides . But mostly I am critical of the school. - how could that happen- I think they were totally stuck. If it was a freak Accident or even if he was murdered there ... Because the students were unattended. Anything could have happened.




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[Tawny]

I do not doubt the school does their best to maintain safety and security, but I have to disagree that teenagers are expected to be led by the hand at all minutes of the day.

Young kids like kindergartners follow in single file lines, sometimes holding hands, to and from classes and such. That is expected. I personally wouldn't expect the same for kids who are almost adults. JMO!!

 

[Kimberlyd125]

I do not doubt the school does their best to maintain safety and security, but I have to disagree that teenagers are expected to be led by the hand at all minutes of the day.

Young kids like kindergartners follow in single file lines, sometimes holding hands, to and from classes and such. That is expected. I personally wouldn't expect the same for kids who are almost adults. JMO!!

No way high school aged children should be supervised at all times.
That's just crazy to me.

 

[iSleuth]

I do not doubt the school does their best to maintain safety and security, but I have to disagree that teenagers are expected to be led by the hand at all minutes of the day.

Young kids like kindergartners follow in single file lines, sometimes holding hands, to and from classes and such. That is expected. I personally wouldn't expect the same for kids who are almost adults. JMO!!

One would hope. But there are big cognitive and maturational differences at these ages- hs student's brains are not fully developed, their frontal lobes and reasoning aren't fully there. Which is why there are cases and questions if a person should be charged as an adult or a child.

And no one suggested HS students being led from classes chaperoned ( although I know of several instances where they are) the onus is not on the students - it's on the teachers and staff. Everyone knows this, this is why we poor souls get stuck with hall duty, and cafe duty, and library duty in addition to our normal work day. To help supervise and keep people safe. Yes accidents can happen, yes freak accidents happen on the field and such . Ambulances are called to school campuses and someone is there to be responsible - write an accident report - so and so got hit in the head with a bat etc. These are all significant aspects working within a school- it is a big part of what we are paid for.
Believe me they may gloss over things in reports- but I bet people were held responsible. just because LE said they are protecting students or members in their school community and not releasing doesn't mean that there was no disciplinary action and or fall out. We just may not hear about it for quite a while .
All the above is just my opinion. Ty


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[Tawny]

One would hope. But there are big cognitive and maturational differences at these ages- hs student's brains are not fully developed, their frontal lobes and reasoning aren't fully there.

RSBM

This part here is the biggest reason I absolutely believe that poor KJ may have made a terribly bad decision in going into the mat after his shoes. :twocents:

 

[iSleuth]

RSBM

This part here is the biggest reason I absolutely believe that poor KJ may have made a terribly bad decision in going into the mat after his shoes. :twocents:

Absolutely



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[iSleuth]

Just now... Case in point to our discussion of who had responsibility in this day and age.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...announcement-about-rape-case-inquiry/3697199/

NATION
Ohio superintendent, coaches charged in teen rape case

Marisol Bello, USA TODAY
1 minutes ago
Google Plus
more

Keith Srakocic, AP
Ohio Attorney General Mike DeWine takes a question at a news conference where he more
Four Ohio school officials were indicted Monday on charges that they obstructed an investigation of student athletes in the rape of a 16-year-old girl last year.


Steubenville City School Superintendent Michael McVey, the principal of an elementary school, a football coach and a wrestling coach are due in court on Dec. 6.
A grand jury investigating how school officials handled the investigation of the rape indicted McVey on five counts of tampering with evidence, obstruction and falsification.

“People made bad choices”
Ohio Attorney General Mike DeWine
The grand jury looked into whether adults such as teachers or coaches knew of the rape but failed to report it as required by state law.

"People made bad choices," Ohio Attorney General Mike DeWine said. "This grand jury says there has to be accountability.

"What you have here is an attempt to protect an institution or protect someone when what should have happened is the person doing that should have been worrying about the actual victim," he said. "People were not worried about the victim."


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[BeginnersLuck]

Just now... Case in point to our discussion of who had responsibility in this day and age.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...announcement-about-rape-case-inquiry/3697199/

NATION
Ohio superintendent, coaches charged in teen rape case

Marisol Bello, USA TODAY
1 minutes ago
Google Plus
more

Keith Srakocic, AP
Ohio Attorney General Mike DeWine takes a question at a news conference where he more
Four Ohio school officials were indicted Monday on charges that they obstructed an investigation of student athletes in the rape of a 16-year-old girl last year.


Steubenville City School Superintendent Michael McVey, the principal of an elementary school, a football coach and a wrestling coach are due in court on Dec. 6.
A grand jury investigating how school officials handled the investigation of the rape indicted McVey on five counts of tampering with evidence, obstruction and falsification.

“People made bad choices”
Ohio Attorney General Mike DeWine
The grand jury looked into whether adults such as teachers or coaches knew of the rape but failed to report it as required by state law.

"People made bad choices," Ohio Attorney General Mike DeWine said. "This grand jury says there has to be accountability.

"What you have here is an attempt to protect an institution or protect someone when what should have happened is the person doing that should have been worrying about the actual victim," he said. "People were not worried about the victim."


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The two cases are not comparable. The case that you are referring to has been found criminal in nature. The actions of those in the case you cited are criminal. There was no criminal negligence in this case. No one intentionally or deliberately did anything to cause or cover up KJ's death. IMO

 

[iSleuth]

The two cases are not comparable. The case that you are referring to has been found criminal in nature. The actions of those in the case you cited are criminal. There was no criminal negligence in this case. No one intentionally or deliberately did anything to cause or cover up KJ's death. IMO

Everything can be compared. Even apples and oranges . All comparisons ask for similarities and differences. Size /form /color /context...any others you can construct .
Just because two things and or events have differences it does nt mean there are not things to observe.

The best part of the comparisons here I think is that even though the heinous crimes the students committed happened totally off campus the district superiors were still all responsible for the students and the jury convicted them.
Also we have Unsupervised kids who you would think would know better.
About KJ -I know some of you may think otherwise, but, I am on the fence. Maybe it was an accident . But the one thing I'm not on the fence about is some kind of cover up. Not a conspiracy perhaps but ... We are entitled to our own opinions- we are entitled to even bad opinions.


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[Sherp]

I don't think there is a cover up. If there were, it would now involve 3000 High School students , school IT people, Admin and teachers, the Local Sheriff's Office, the State Georgia Bureau of Investigation, highly influential people of the town and the local FBI guy whose one son was away on a trip for school sports and one is on film in another part of the school. Impossible and improbable.

 

[Karmady]

Everything can be compared. Even apples and oranges . All comparisons ask for similarities and differences. Size /form /color /context...any others you can construct .
Just because two things and or events have differences it does nt mean there are not things to observe.

The best part of the comparisons here I think is that even though the heinous crimes the students committed happened totally off campus the district superiors were still all responsible for the students and the jury convicted them. Also we have Unsupervised kids who you would think would know better.
About KJ -I know some of you may think otherwise, but, I am on the fence. Maybe it was an accident . But the one thing I'm not on the fence about is some kind of cover up. Not a conspiracy perhaps but ... We are entitled to our own opinions- we are entitled to even bad opinions.


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It might be a good comparison if that's what happened. But it isn't. The district superiors are not being held liable or responsible for the students. They have been indicted (not found guilty by a jury) for their own crimes committed after the fact. Not for the students' acts. Apples and canaries, imo. I could compare them, but why would I bother? (that's a rhetorical question, btw )
jmo

 

[iSleuth]

Everything can be compared. Even apples and oranges . All comparisons ask for similarities and differences. Size /form /color /context...any others you can construct .
Just because two things and or events have differences it does nt mean there are not things to observe.

The best part of the comparisons here I think is that even though the heinous crimes the students committed happened totally off campus the district superiors were still all responsible for the students and the jury convicted them.
Also we have Unsupervised kids who you would think would know better.
About KJ -I know some of you may think otherwise, but, I am on the fence. Maybe it was an accident . But the one thing I'm not on the fence about is some kind of cover up. Not a conspiracy perhaps but ... We are entitled to our own opinions- we are entitled to even bad opinions.


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I should have said some sort of cover ( your ____) up happened. Definitely not involving 3000 people and possibly protecting such highly influential residents of the town. Protecting the reputation of the " prestigious" school district which is deeply tied not only to the future of the school but also town property values too.
If your school system has problems it is not good .

It would not be the first time an institution took matters into their own hands - illegally from the inside and tampered with information to change and protect perceptions for powerful people.

It's kind of funny how people think and fantasize about how schools work and how innocent or not their own students are too . it has amazed me for years .

Believe me when I say the district is more worried about safety , law suits and how the standardized tests affect their jobs and reputation than they are about anything else.



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[Tawny]

But this school didn't take matters into its own hands, they called police and the police called GBI immediately...

 

[Kimberlyd125]

But this school didn't take matters into its own hands, they called police and the police called GBI immediately...

Yes they did! A fact that people seem to want to overlook.

 

[Yoda]

Yes they did! A fact that people seem to want to overlook.

Link please.