General Discussion Thread #4

[Coldpizza]

Forgive my ignorance, but I don't know how threads like this are started. Is it possible to change the thread title, when the next one is started, to include Reeva's name: "Oscar Pistorius charged with murdering his girlfriend, Reeva Steenkamp #5"?

Too often, the victims fade and the perpetrators remain...

I agree and consider it done.

 

[Pisto_lius]

An interesting report about testosteron

Allegations that Pistorius, who has been charged with premeditated murder, has used steroids first emerged last week in the wake of his arrest. [.....]

“The [police] have not confirmed from a forensic perspective if indeed the substance is what the detective claims it to be,” said Khalid Galant, chief executive of South African Institute for Drug-Free Sport. “If any of the substances found are indeed established to be banned in sport, SA Institute for Drug-Free Sport will evaluate the evidence within the context of the anti-doping laws of sport. This evaluation will only occur after the criminal case has concluded.” [.....]

Testosterone is an anabolic steroid administered either orally or through injection. It helps increase muscle size, strength and power as it copies the effect of testosterone that occurs naturally in the body. Depending on the amount taken, it remains in an athlete's system from anything from one day to three months. Floyd Landis is reported to have failed a test for testosterone in the 2006 Tour de France.

While the drug regime surrounding the London Games was the most comprehensive in Olympic history, those involved in the anti-doping agencies stress it is not in competition testing that is the key to catching dopers. Doping regimes have become increasingly sophisticated - most doping occurs out of competition - and in the case of testosterone what is called micro-dosing has become common, taking small amounts that make it easier to avoid a positive test.

Last summer Victor Conte, the man behind the Balco scandal, was in London claiming that there is little point in testing athletes during the summer when competition is in full swing, rather the focus has to be out of competition because that is when the majority of doping takes place. [.....]

Testosterone occurs naturally in the body but if an athlete has four times the accepted normal amount, it is deemed to be a doping offence.

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...r-pistorius-contain-testosterone-8502857.html

 

[Estelle]

An interesting report about testosteron

Should allegations of the use of performance-enhancing drugs be proved, Pistorius would face being stripped of the two gold medals and one silver he won at the London 2012 Paralympics.

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...r-pistorius-contain-testosterone-8502857.html

Police investigating the death of RS have reportedly revealed that they had found OP's prized trophies strewn across the floor of his home on the night RS was shot dead. The awards, some of which were broken, may point to a row between OP and RS before he ‘accidentally’ shot her four times. Police are still trying to establish whether the awards might have ended up around his home during an alleged dispute, because normally the trophies would have been in a good condition and showcased on shelves or in cabinets.

http://zeenews.india.com/sports/oth...oor-on-night-of-steenkamps-murder_758203.html

It is my hunch that on the night of the murder, the main reason that RS had an argument with OP could have been that she caught OP using performance-enhancing drugs, and her admiration for OP's athletic achievements was gone so she threw his trophies around breaking some of them. She may have then threatened to expose him to authorities.

IMO this would explain OP's possible motive for murdering RS more than just jealousy.

After all, what would OP value most of all? His two gold and one silver medal and losing them?

 

[MURDERER_SERVANT]

Well those tweets might be written to FH as well ,but what makes me think it was forwarded to OP is that ,

1- 13 Oct " Light travel faster than sound.This is why some people appear bright before they speak."

http://www.sapeople.com/2012/10/10/south-africa-oscar-pistorius-video-jay-leno-show-345/
QUOTE
For South Africans who missed Oscar Pistorius’ appearance on Jay Leno’s show, it’ll be aired on CNBC Africa on Thursday night (11 October) at 10


2- 15 Dec " I broke rules than i broke records. "
I rather think that OP and his records are meant here..Don't know if FH had any any kind of record known.

All of those tweets apparently reflect that WL hasn't forgotten his ex love and that is more important than to whom they were written actually imo.

BTW
I'm wondering what is OH, in that tweet ? OH, you are dating my ex?
I first thought OP meant here but I might be wrong...

 

[kittychi]

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...r-pistorius-contain-testosterone-8502857.html

Police investigating the death of RS have reportedly revealed that they had found OP's prized trophies strewn across the floor of his home on the night RS was shot dead. The awards, some of which were broken, may point to a row between OP and RS before he ‘accidentally’ shot her four times. Police are still trying to establish whether the awards might have ended up around his home during an alleged dispute, because normally the trophies would have been in a good condition and showcased on shelves or in cabinets.

http://zeenews.india.com/sports/oth...oor-on-night-of-steenkamps-murder_758203.html

It is my hunch that on the night of the murder, the main reason that RS had an argument with OP could have been that she caught OP using performance-enhancing drugs, and her admiration for OP's athletic achievements was gone so she threw his trophies around breaking some of them. She may have then threatened to expose him to authorities.

IMO this would explain OP's possible motive for murdering RS more than just jealousy.

After all, what would OP value most of all? His two gold and one silver medal and losing them?

I have thought the same thing, Estelle.

He had a lot to lose if RS discovered he was using. Maybe to him that loss would be even worse than being accused of premeditated murder. After all, there is still a chance for him to be found not-guilty of murder and then he would be free to continue his life as it was. But if he was exposed doing drugs, he would have lost everything with no chance to redeem himself.

IMO, this would be a very strong motive driver to "get rid of her," moreso than a jealous rage.

His behavior and attitude since the murder say a lot about what he values: his life and lifestyle, rather than regret for murdering someone, even if by accident. IMO he has spent much more energy with his accident story than any regret or sorrow that it happened.

 

[Pisto_lius]

Why OP's DT and some people who were first at the scene claim Reeva was still breathing when OP carried her downstairs?

Let me try to explain it very simple:

Remember: OP picked up Reeva’s body, carried her downstairs and placed her on the ground downstairs.

“She was still breathing, making a gurgling sound”, Botha recalled a witness saying.

“Miss Steenkamp was said to be still breathing as security guards, neighbours and Mr Pistorius' family gathered, and he tried to give her mouth-to-mouth resuscitation”, media reported.

When a dead body is moved, it may be that the residual air in the lungs escapes and hereby advised the vocal cords in motion. It then sounds like breathing or moaning.

Here you find the same explanation:

When death is near
At any time there may be an audible sigh or moan. These sounds are caused by air passing over the relaxed vocal cords causing them to vibrate and sound. This is not a sign of pain or distress. The lower jaw may move as if your loved one is trying to speak.

The last breath
After your loved one has died, you may notice what appears to be a few additional “breaths,” as the lungs empty of air.
http://www.holyredeemer.com/Main/Public/TheDyingProcess.aspx

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[Pisto_lius]

Why Perumal's statements are not a guarantee for the truth?

1. Perumal is part of OP's DT
2. Perumal is paid by OP

From this it can be concluded that as long as possible Perumal (and OP's whole DT) will tell nothing else than what we have heard from OP's affidavit.

If it would help OP, they also would say Reeva jumped four times in front of the barrel of OP's pistol and he (OP) was so frightened that his fingers automatically pressed the trigger.

The indictment and witnesses statements make it clear it’s more than unlikely Reeva would be alive until OP laid her body on the ground downstairs:

- Reeva's death caused by multiple gunshot wounds - one of this hit her head – and she died "just after" 3:00 a.m. (according to the indictment).

- OP claimed in his affidavit he woke up "during the early morning hours". He (and his DT) knew why this statement was so unprecisely. A few minutes later he fired the shots.

- Witnesses heard shots "just after" 3:00 a.m.

- Christo Menelaou heard what sounded like three thunderclaps at 3:08 a.m.

- OP called the female neighbour "shortly after" 3:00 a.m. She arrived at the house at exactly 3:20 a.m.

- It took more than 30 minutes since the shooting till paramedics arrived (3:42 a.m.)

Would anyone say forty minutes after 3:00 a.m. means "just after" 3:00 a.m.?


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[Pisto_lius]

There was an interesting discussion in the BH that showed that what was said by OP's DT about the autopsy report probably doesn't correspond to the autopsy report.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/bl...istorius-bail-hearing-day-three-live-coverage

Roux told the autopsy report showed that Reeva's bladder was empty at the time she was killed. (Perumal told the same in the BBC interview.)

Nel answered: There is no evidence before court about [Reeva's] empty bladder.

12.02 p.m. Nair asks about her empty bladder. Couldn't she have emptied it an hour before?

No, says Roux. There was no urine in there at all.

12.04 p.m. Could she have emptied her bladder due to the trauma of the events, Nair asks.

Roux says it's a possibility.

In a case without witnesses, you have lots of possibilities, he says. But Pistorius has presented a version and it makes good sense.

Perumal was in court, carrying a large map with document and expected to provide testimony in defence.

http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/Oscar-Pistorius-at-court-for-bail-hearing-20130219

But he DIDN't testified. Why not? Why the DT didn't presented the autopsy report? Maybe because they knew their claim wasn't true?

None of the media reported about these (and other) interesting discussion although OP's DT hereby clearly showed that their versions are just one of many possibilities and , of course, they each chose the one which would be the best for OP's defence.

But that doesn't mean everything OP's DT said was so and not otherwise.


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[kittychi]

Pisto_lius, thank you for keeping in touch. You are among my very favorite posters!

 

[MURDERER_SERVANT]

Roux says it's a possibility.

In a case without witnesses, you have lots of possibilities, he says. But Pistorius has presented a version and it makes good sense.


But that doesn't mean everything OP's DT said was so and not otherwise.


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How about Reeva's version of events ??!! Just because she's killed and can't speak for her version of events and the case has no witnesses never makes OP's wonderful story a reality even if it makes good (!) sense to some....Such an unfair statement...:facepalm:

JMO

 

[Pisto_lius]

The exorbitant price of justice

What separates over 46 000 awaiting-trial prisoners from Oscar Pistorius (or Glenn Agliotti and J Arthur Brown) is that they cannot afford to pay for lawyers, says Nathan Geffen.

Johannesburg - Oscar Pistorius’s bail application supposedly showed how the justice system works. But actually, his hearing and release on bail were exceptional.

Compare Pistorius’s case to Dudley Lee’s. Lee was charged with fraud and counterfeiting. He spent four years in Pollsmoor as an awaiting-trial prisoner. After about 70 court hearings, he was acquitted and released. In prison, he became ill with TB and lost his life savings. Today, he survives on a state pension of R1 260 a month. This is not unusual. There are over 46 000 awaiting-trial prisoners, at least one of whom has been behind bars for over nine years.

What separates them from Pistorius (or Glenn Agliotti and J Arthur Brown) is that they cannot afford to pay for lawyers or bail. Lee was represented (the constitution guarantees that right), but only for a few hours here and there by lawyers paid mainly by Legal Aid South Africa.

http://www.iol.co.za/the-star/the-exorbitant-price-of-justice-1.1575149#.Ui63K9K-2So

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[Estelle]

The exorbitant price of justice


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Chequebook justice!

 

[whiterum]

How about Reeva's version of events ??!! Just because she's killed and can't speak for her version of events and the case has no witnesses never makes OP's wonderful story a reality even if it makes good (!) sense to some....Such an unfair statement...:facepalm:

JMO

You are right M_S , Reeva will give her version of events through the testimony of those who heard her verbally defending herself in arguments that night, also when she was heard to scream out in fear and in pain before and between shots.

If the judge finds these ear witnesses credible, keeping in mind they have no reason to lie, their only reason for telling what they heard would be to see justice done for the one they heard scream out to them that night, whereas OP has every reason to lie through his teeth. What they heard alone is proof that he knew there was no intruder in that toilet, he knew who he was shooting through that door.

So in the end it could be Reeva's own voice that could convict him of premeditated murder, prove his version to make no sense whatsoever and expose it as nothing more than a pack of self-preserving lies.

 

[Estelle]

Do you think that the Prosecution will ask OP to describe the noise he heard?

If so, what do you think he would say?

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Do you think that the Prosecution will ask OP to describe the noise he heard?

If so, what do you think he would say?

He certainly will assert until the very last, he had tried to revive RS.



-Justice for Reeva -

 

[Lemon Tree]

Do you think that the Prosecution will ask OP to describe the noise he heard?

If so, what do you think he would say?

IMO, OP will say: "I can't really remember, but it wasn't a usual sound."

 

[whiterum]

He certainly will assert until the very last, he had tried to revive RS.



-Justice for Reeva -

Of course he will, he expects in his android like logic, evident in the wording of his affidavit that he will present himself now as a heroic saviour and will dupe people into thinking 'poor him, he tried his best to revive his love' :boohoo: and not the reality that ' he got his gun and pumped three bullets into his GF through his toilet door' :furious:

 

[Interested Bystander]

Reeva had been staying with OP for a few days, as far as I can determine, but it seems he had organised to go out with his boyfriends on the evening of the 13th. Reeva asked him to stay at home for a quiet dinner, which he did. She had bought him a card and a present but, in fact, we do not know whether he had bought her anything as the murder took place during the night of the 13th/14th. OP would not have handed a present to her, I would have thought, before they arose on the 14th. Maybe he had bought her a present, maybe not. I wonder if the PT will ask whether he did. It could be indicative of his lack of feeling if he had not. I am sure a present would have surfaced during the subsequent search of his property if there had been one. Do we know what was planned for the evening of 14th Feb? I cannot find anything.

 

[kittychi]

Reeva had been staying with OP for a few days, as far as I can determine, but it seems he had organised to go out with his boyfriends on the evening of the 13th. Reeva asked him to stay at home for a quiet dinner, which he did. She had bought him a card and a present but, in fact, we do not know whether he had bought her anything as the murder took place during the night of the 13th/14th. OP would not have handed a present to her, I would have thought, before they arose on the 14th. Maybe he had bought her a present, maybe not. I wonder if the PT will ask whether he did. It could be indicative of his lack of feeling if he had not. I am sure a present would have surfaced during the subsequent search of his property if there had been one. Do we know what was planned for the evening of 14th Feb? I cannot find anything.

BBM1: iMO, if OP had a gift for RS, we would know because it would have been paraded all over the place by now, it would have been part of his affi. We would have 100 8 x 10 glossies of it, taken from all angles, located in every nook and cranny on the Internet. (Young people: "glossies" is a term we used to use to describe photographs, usually 'official' police photographs, back in the day. )

BBM2: I find nothing about the 14th either. If OP felt he was really her significant other, he may have wanted to support RS by attending the talk she was to give about abusive relationships. Or at least do something special for Valentine' s Day later on in the evening. Again, IMO, we would know if OP had anything special planned as he and his DT would have milked it to death by now. : (

:razz:

 

[Pisto_lius]

Reeva had been staying with OP for a few days, as far as I can determine, but it seems he had organised to go out with his boyfriends on the evening of the 13th. Reeva asked him to stay at home for a quiet dinner, which he did. She had bought him a card and a present but, in fact, we do not know whether he had bought her anything as the murder took place during the night of the 13th/14th. OP would not have handed a present to her, I would have thought, before they arose on the 14th. Maybe he had bought her a present, maybe not. I wonder if the PT will ask whether he did. It could be indicative of his lack of feeling if he had not. I am sure a present would have surfaced during the subsequent search of his property if there had been one. Do we know what was planned for the evening of 14th Feb? I cannot find anything.

BIB - Reeva had two appointments for 14 Febr

1. A speech about domestic violence at Sandown High School at Johannesburg
http://www.heavy.com/news/2013/02/reeva-steenkamp-domestic-violence-speech//


2. A Valentine's meeting with her Mini-friends

Sandton Auto MINI ‏@SandtonMini 13 Feb – 2:42 p.m.
All MINI Drivers come in and enjoy a yummy cupcake with us all day tomorrow. We are celebrating our love for our MINI's ❤ @MiniDriversSA
Retweetet von Candy McKenna

MINI DRIVERS SA ‏@MiniDriversSA 13 Feb – 3:30 p.m.
We call it the MINI Cupcake Day with SANDTON AUTO MINI ❤! All MINI drivers come in and enjoy a yummy cupcake with us at Sandton Auto MINI
Retweetet von Candy McKenna

Candy McKenna ‏@candymck 13 Feb – 6:05 p.m.
“@SandtonMini: pic.twitter.com/DqLNEyHD” come have a cupcake 2mwr ladies @reevasteenkamp @gi_myers @TheSamlet @chanellezackey ❤

Reeva's last tweet
Reeva Steenkamp ‏@reevasteenkamp 13 Feb – 7:41 p.m.
@candymck @SandtonMini I'm there like a bear!!! Yayyyy!!!! X

Sandton Auto MINI ‏@SandtonMini 14 Feb – 8.56 a.m.
Our MINI Friend how our hearts r breaking!! We are eating cupcakes for u 2day! U will be so missed. @reevasteenkamp pic.twitter.com/pxtAdOYg
Retweetet von Candy McKenna

I guess her speech at the school would be scheduled for the morning - that's common for those things - and the meeting with her Mini friends for the afternoon or evening.

But notice the time of Reeva's last tweet = 13 Feb – 7:41 p.m.. That's the time between OP's phone contacts with Alex Pilakoutas and Graham Binge (20:10 - 20:45). So, it seems OP ignored Reeva for hours and because it got too boring for her she sent some messages and maybe made some calls.

Reeva was excited for the meeting with her Mini friends and wanted to keep it. She had other plans for the whole Valentine's day than to spend this day with OP. Perhaps she met with him on 13 Feb to tell him she will end the relationship. But she had prepared a Valentine's gift for him days before she had taken this decision. Her Valentine's gift should be her farewell gift....


Reeva's nickname for OP

Reeva wrote "Ozzy" on her Valentine's gift. And all media reported this was HER nickname for OP. But that's not true - ALL his friends and many of his supporters call him "Ozzy" or "OZZ", you can find this in a number of tweets and on websites, e.g.

http://whoswho.co.za/oscar-pistorius-5404
http://abcnews.go.com/International/...8622162&page=2
http://tsminteractive.com/10-things-...car-pistorius/

Would you call your boyfriend/lover with the same nickname as his friends do? Rather uncreative IMO

And I totally agree with kittychi's excellent post :
If OP had a gift for Reeva, we would know because it would have been paraded all over the place by now, it would have been part of his affi.
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