George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin General discussion #5

[JeannaT]

I think you are talking about a case where two people were breaking into the neighbor's house (not the homeowner's). In TX, I don't think dispatcher is going to give advice to not shoot someone breaking into owner's house. These people broke into neighbor's house, not the owner's. Dispatcher told the owner to not go outside and shoot them. The owner says he is going outside, went outside, shot and killed both men. Grand jury refused to indict, and that was that.

I remember that case, too, that old geezer took that guy out.

I think this was a different case, but I don't want to take this conversation further off topic than I already did -

 

[twall]

Also the State did not include Manslaughter on their charge, it's either Guilty of 2nd degree murder or not.

http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/07/12/2892510/more-evidence-released-in-zimmerman.html

It can still be added.

 

[jjenny]

I remember that case, too, that old geezer took that guy out.

I think this was a different case, but I don't want to take this conversation further off topic than I already did -

I have no knowledge of the case like that.
It would be pretty stupid to give someone in TX advice to not shoot an intruder breaking into a house. You can be dead 10 times over before police arrive.

 

[missmazzy]

Does anyone else find it weird that it seems most of these witnesses only heard "help" twice??

I mean, we know for a fact that we heard it much more often from the 911 call, right?

No, because we don't always remember everything when we are excited. Either that, or some people came in at different times of the incident.

 

[sacrablue]

911 is to summon help. Not to be told what lawful decisions you should make by a dispatcher. He wasn't calling for advice on how he should behave, he was calling to get a cop on the scene.

He was told to stop within the restrictions set on him and George replied OK.
You can't make it any clearer.

 

[Chester_from_THM]

Does anyone else find it weird that it seems most of these witnesses only heard "help" twice??

I mean, we know for a fact that we heard it much more often from the 911 call, right?

To me, this just shows how unreliable eye and ear witnesses are.

There is a lot of research on this, and many bad convictions based on this type of evidence.

I remember once I saw an Oprah show, where the audience was being filmed before the start of the show, waiting in line to get into the studio.

A guy grabbed a woman's purse and ran off.

When the audience go into the studio, the show started with asking people what they witnessed. No one came close to describing the perp correctly.

I know this is just anecdotal, but it was a clear demonstration to me that people are mainly terrible at remembering/describing events. Add rain, night time, it just gets more unreliable.

All MOO.

 

[Just K]

My personal opinion, JG is not credible. Due to his embellishments.

 

[Karmady]

According to testimony, I haven't seen evidence that TM was ever 'down', meaning on the bottom.

Until after he was shot.

 

[popsicle]

Is there a single witness attached to this case that still lives in that development?? So far I think everyone I have heard has moved away.

 

[Lovelymountains]

No proof it wasn't either.

I'm sorry about this, I wanted to respond to another post, but somehow my computer didn't pick up the post to which I wished to respond. So here it is, all by itself meaning nothing. I've tried to delete it but that doesn't work either. I probably need a new computer.

 

[missmazzy]

Slightly OT..I just creeped myself out when I realized that these last two trials have actually shown or allowed us to hear a murder taking place.

 

[iluvmua]

Is there a single witness attached to this case that still lives in that development?? So far I think everyone I have heard has moved away.

that's what I was wondering as well.

 

[Karmady]

To me, this just shows how unreliable eye and ear witnesses are.

There is a lot of research on this, and many bad convictions based on this type of evidence.

I remember once I saw an Oprah show, where the audience was being filmed before the start of the show, waiting in line to get into the studio.

A guy grabbed a woman's purse and ran off.

When the audience go into the studio, the show started with asking people what they witnessed. No one came close to describing the perp correctly.

I know this is just anecdotal, but it was a clear demonstration to me that people are mainly terrible at remembering/describing events. Add rain, night time, it just gets more unreliable.

All MOO.

He just said he wasn't paying attention to that. He's not claiming they didn't happen.

 

[sickofitAll]

I feel that this witness is holding back...He is probably scared of the media backlash...

 

[Just K]

To me, this just shows how unreliable eye and ear witnesses are.

There is a lot of research on this, and many bad convictions based on this type of evidence.

I remember once I saw an Oprah show, where the audience was being filmed before the start of the show, waiting in line to get into the studio.

A guy grabbed a woman's purse and ran off.

When the audience go into the studio, the show started with asking people what they witnessed. No one came close to describing the perp correctly.

I know this is just anecdotal, but it was a clear demonstration to me that people are mainly terrible at remembering/describing events. Add rain, night time, it just gets more unreliable.

All MOO.

JG saw the two initially from the side...meaning he saw the sides of the two figures. The side of GZ's jacket was dark gray. And, how could he see that the one on top had darker skin when it was so dark he couldn't see if they were even people... how could he see whose skin was darker?

 

[iluvmua]

JMO, but if it was George on the tape screaming for help, you can tell how desperate he was for someone to come out to help him.

Sounds like he really was in fear of his life that night, if it was indeed him.

 

[JeannaT]

My personal opinion, JG is not credible. Due to his embellishments.

???

I don't think I've heard any other witness be MORE careful to only report what he actually saw and not speculate at all what was going on, beyond what he actually witnessed.

 

[popsicle]

I find John to be the most believable of all the eye/ear witnesses thus far.

 

[Boodles]

It hasn't been proven that TM was scared though, even from RJ.

And we can't ask Trayvon the question. However, Rachel said he said GZ was following him.

Would you be afraid if you were walking by yourself in the dark and a stranger kept following and staring at you, both by car then by foot? This is a sincere question. I would.

 

[cityslick]

JG saw the two initially from the side...meaning he saw the sides of the two figures. The side of GZ's jacket was dark gray. And, how could he see that the one on top had darker skin when it was so dark he couldn't see if they were even people... how could he see whose skin was darker?

I'm not even sure the state is arguing anymore that TM wasn't on top during this time.