Gilgo Beach LISK Serial Killer, Rex Heuermann, charged with 3 murders, July 2023

[Ruminations]

I think at this point, LISK is used like the Redhead Murders... Whether it's one offender or several, it's grouping a series of crimes together by location, date, victim appearance and lifestyle, the signatures of the crime and disposal of victims, and so on in a way to try to make sense of it.

RH is definitely A LISK... but the ONLY LISK? We don't know yet.

MOO

If the competing serial killer theory is confirmed...

...part of the competition will be who gets the title of the 'real' LISK?

MOO

 

[Jurisprudence]

Wasn’t Melissa the first of the G4 girls that they determined had been murdered first? If so, they could be withholding more details if there was something different about the method of killing that was not present with the other three (this is just my thinking). If this is the case, then LE may be withholding that information from the public in order to make sure everything is even more airtight.

BBM

Wow! brilliant. Now you really just gave me hope. Hope that there may be some through-line to a possible deviation in method with MBB that links to other unsolved cases. I realize we have no facts to back it up but it's a wonderful and hopeful thought. And, it's always good to have hope. Thanks!

jmo

 

[Ann99]

By all accounts, she's still living

Oh. That’s right. She ( RH Mom) must be in her 90’s
So did RH, Mom and 1st wife all live together in 1996? Or that near time frame.
That definitely could have been a stress point. Maybe the reason marriage #1 didn’t last.
Also the start of a new business. More stress.
Maybe this was the beginning.

 

[Jurisprudence]

Maureen was killed two years earlier than Melissa.

I thought @SonsOfCain stated Melissa but meant Maureen because obviously RH is already charged in Melissa's death and we were talking about potential charges for Maureen.

It would make sense that there might be something different with Maureen that is causing them to hold back if you consider the theory that these people supposedly evolve over time and hone "their craft".

One can hope.

jmo

 

[CuriousCricket]

It's interesting that SCPD and NYSP haven't addressed if Karen Vergata is a victim of Heuermanns yet Othrams posts here about the identification give the impression that she is indeed.

Interesting. I had not realized that Othrams post here indicates that.

My brain has tumbled around wondering why her name was kept secret and why the Task Force went straight into the secrecy of the Grand Jury almost immediately after her name was learned.

I also kept remembering DA Tierney saying they knew they were being watched, but I couldn't figure out HOW they knew they were being watched.

But he told us in the first Press Conference after RH's arrest.

RH was identified March 14, 2022. Karen Vergata was identified in September and her family notified in October, according to transcript of press conference. It was at that time the Task Force decided to go into the confidentiality/secrecy of the Grand Jury. AND they took Vergata's identity with them.

By that time RH had been a suspect since March 14. They had been executing warrants and collecting into on him. Among the information were his cell phone records. The Task Force knew about his searches for their progress on the case, according to Tierney at the first press conference.

So, does the decision to take Karen Vergata's ID into the Grand Jury with the Gilgo 4 investigation signify they can link her to RH?

 

[hazel324]

I saw this too and this is just completely BAFFLING to me.

Why they did not obtain a warrant to obtain his DNA via Buccal Swab on arrest is confounding. Why did they wait? They'd been tailing his for some time already at that point.

On another note, it solves the mystery surrounding the hearing #623

jmo

That's why I queried what the "motion" for buccal swab was a few days ago...I was confused why they'd be asking for one then

I just assumed they'd have warrant for one on arrest. LE had spent months getting warrants for all cell records, online searches, the properties and just about everything else connected to him...so I was surprised this hasn't been tied up in advance too

 

[citizen_sleuth]

Interesting. I had not realized that Othrams post here indicates that.

My brain has tumbled around wondering why her name was kept secret and why the Task Force went straight into the secrecy of the Grand Jury almost immediately after her name was learned.

I also kept remembering DA Tierney saying they knew they were being watched, but I couldn't figure out HOW they knew they were being watched.

But he told us in the first Press Conference after RH's arrest.

RH was identified March 14, 2022. Karen Vergata was identified in September and her family notified in October, according to transcript of press conference. It was at that time the Task Force decided to go into the confidentiality/secrecy of the Grand Jury. AND they took Vergata's identity with them.

By that time RH had been a suspect since March 14. They had been executing warrants and collecting into on him. Among the information were his cell phone records. The Task Force knew about his searches for their progress on the case, according to Tierney at the first press conference.

So, does the decision to take Karen Vergata's ID into the Grand Jury with the Gilgo 4 investigation signify they can link her to RH?

This is completely MOO but I couldn't help but wonder, why would the Task Force wait until after RH's arrest to announce Fire Island Jane Doe (Karen) had been identified unless they believed that doing so would jeopardize their case against RH (i.e., tipping him off because he could possibly be responsible for Karen's death)?

 

[fred&edna]

This is completely MOO but I couldn't help but wonder, why would the Task Force wait until after RH's arrest to announce Fire Island Jane Doe (Karen) had been identified unless they believed that doing so would jeopardize their case against RH (i.e., tipping him off because he could possibly be responsible for Karen's death)?

I really like the way your brain works!!

 

[Dhighsmith]

This is completely MOO but I couldn't help but wonder, why would the Task Force wait until after RH's arrest to announce Fire Island Jane Doe (Karen) had been identified unless they believed that doing so would jeopardize their case against RH (i.e., tipping him off because he could possibly be responsible for Karen's death)?

MOO As the DA has alluded to I believe they were controlling the story while observing RH behavior and possible reaction. They did notify family of her ID, which was the correct action.

 

[Jimmytoast]

This is completely MOO but I couldn't help but wonder, why would the Task Force wait until after RH's arrest to announce Fire Island Jane Doe (Karen) had been identified unless they believed that doing so would jeopardize their case against RH (i.e., tipping him off because he could possibly be responsible for Karen's death)?

That’s exactly what I assumed also. Makes the most sense

 

[fred&edna]

MOO As the DA has alluded to I believe they were controlling the story while observing RH behavior and possible reaction. They did notify family of her ID, which was the correct action.

Apparently, some members of the family didn't know of her ID until (fairly) recently. It doesn't appear her father knew before his death. My conclusion per some of the recent posts and links on her WS thread.

Possible Victim: Fire Island Jane Doe, UP9098, found Davis Park Apr 1996 & Ocean Parkway Apr 2011 - Karen Vergata

Interesting. I wonder if she spent time in FL: https://sun-sentinel.newspapers.com/article/108956620/fort-lauderdale-news/

www.websleuths.com

 

[Dhighsmith]

I realize there’s likely no answer to the situation but this case and so many others as in Robert Pickton from Canada and the recent arrest of man in Reno Nevada brings me back to question of what actions could better protect these women who are obviously at risk constantly from unknown predators?

 

[Deleted member 117884]

I realize there’s likely no answer to the situation but this case and so many others as in Robert Pickton from Canada and the recent arrest of man in Reno Nevada brings me back to question of what actions could better protect these women who are obviously at risk constantly from unknown predators?

My answer doesn't really help because it takes a long time and apparently is unrealistic, but the best solution is that men don't prey on victims.

Yes, I know women prey on victims too, so, sure, include them as well.

Don't prey on people, people!

I know, I know, unrealistic.


jmo

 

[DetectiveDraper]

Our late great @Foxfire said they can start killing as young as 14-15.

I’ve seen some pretty young budding SKs here over the years.

Going to read post history now. It's always crazy when someone from this forum passes.

 

[Dhighsmith]

My answer doesn't really help because it takes a long time and apparently is unrealistic, but the best solution is that men don't prey on victims.

Yes, I know women prey on victims too, so, sure, include them as well.

Don't prey on people, people!

I know, I know, unrealistic.


jmo

No more unrealistic than me asking my question, you’re are right though as humans we should be better than all this.

 

[hazel324]

This is completely MOO but I couldn't help but wonder, why would the Task Force wait until after RH's arrest to announce Fire Island Jane Doe (Karen) had been identified unless they believed that doing so would jeopardize their case against RH (i.e., tipping him off because he could possibly be responsible for Karen's death)?

I think they just decided not to announce anything Gilgo related in case it spooked him (whether he did it or not) as it would be confirmation investigation work was ongoing.

Conversely, maybe they toyed with making the announcement before the arrest...since they were monitoring his movements LE could see what reaction he made (if any) regarding online searches etc.

Deciding that they had (more than) enough evidence they went for arrest first. We know they intentionally did it away from home and were aware he had guns...so erred on the side of caution - my thoughts

 

[dotr]

I realize there’s likely no answer to the situation but this case and so many others as in Robert Pickton from Canada and the recent arrest of man in Reno Nevada brings me back to question of what actions could better protect these women who are obviously at risk constantly from unknown predators?

Not unlike having ''diamonds on the soles of their shoes'', thinking of SW having little transmitters tucked into shoes that sends real time tracking data to a special private receiver that can be erased immediately, or be pre-arranged to be opened if something goes wrong.
If the perp keeps the shoe, he can be located too.
speculation. imo.fwiw

Sex Workers in Canada Are Offering Up Their DNA So Their Bodies Can One Day Be Identified

Police in Edmonton, Alberta have identified the remains of Corrie Ottenbreit, a sex worker who vanished more than a decade ago. She was found close to the remains of three other women and police fear a serial killer may be at work.

www.vice.com

2015
''Since 2003, officers with KARE, one of the only projects of its kind in the country, have met with people who live and work on the streets to ask them if they'd like to provide DNA samples for their database. It has grown to 1,200 names — including girls as young as 12. An RCMP Inspector told VICE News that women are adding themselves to the list every day. Recently, KARE has expanded its mandate and officers review files of missing vulnerable persons throughout the province. According to one officer involved with KARE, while murder rates in the Edmonton area have gone down, the number of women who vanish "remains steady."

 

[DeDee]

Live Stream c/o USA Today of the presser (YT link at bottom of page):

Gilgo Beach press conference live stream: Authorities share update on killings

Officials are set to announce an update in the investigation of the Gilgo Beach killings after the arrest of suspect Rex Heuermann last month.

eu.usatoday.com

How bittersweet the day for Karen's family. RIP - we got him!

 

[imstilla.grandma]

My theory is he dumped the bodies to throw off jurisdictions some parts found in Nassau county some found in Suffolk county and I also think he did this to also make it harder to ID the victims. Karen's torso has never been found. To my knowledge only her skull and legs were found.

In April 1996, the legs of an unidentified woman were recovered inside of a black garbage bag at Blue Point Beach in Suffolk County, New York. Later, in April 2011, the woman’s skull was recovered near Ocean Parkway west of Tobay Beach in Nassau County, New York. The woman’s torso and hands were never recovered.

Investigators determine the woman was white and likely between the ages of 18 and 50. They discovered several scars on the decedent’s right leg including a 3 1/2” on the lateral mid-leg area, a 1” linear scar on the lateral mid to lower leg, and a ½” scar on the medial ankle. The woman’s left leg had a 2" surgical scar with adjacent suture scars on the medial left ankle. The woman had red nail polish on all toes that, at the time of her discovery in 1996, was noted to be from a recent pedicure.

In 2022, the Suffolk County Police Department in collaboration with the FBI teamed with Othram to determine if advanced DNA testing could help to identify Fire Island Jane Doe. Forensic evidence was sent to Othram’s laboratory in The Woodlands, Texas. Othram scientists developed a suitable DNA extract from the forensic evidence and then used Forensic-Grade Genome Sequencing® to build a comprehensive genealogical profile. After successfully completing the process, the DNA profile was delivered to the FBI's forensic genetic genealogy team and the FBI team performed the necessary work to generate investigative leads.

The FBI team working with Suffolk County Police Department continued the investigation and were eventually able to confirmed the identity of Fire Island Jane Doe as Karen Vergata of Manhattan, New York. Vergata was 34 years old at the time of her death. Vergata was missing since Valentine's Day in 1996.

After 26 years, Fire Island Jane Doe is Identified

Suffolk County Police Department and the FBI Team with Othram to Identify a 1996 Gilgo Beach Murder Victim

dnasolves.com

 

[margarita25]

My theory is he dumped the bodies to throw off jurisdictions some parts found in Nassau county some found in Suffolk county and I also think he did this to also make it harder to ID the victims. Karen's torso has never been found. To my knowledge only her skull and legs were found.

Our late great @Foxfire used to refer to this as “jurisdictional (linkage) blindness”