Gilgo Beach LISK Serial Killer, Rex Heuermann, charged with 3 murders, July 2023

[investigatefred]

Why would the adult children need an attorney?

I've wondered about that too.

 

[Warwick7]

Honored to share that Othram assisted the Suffolk County Police Department and the FBI in identifying 34-year-old Karen Vergata from Manhattan, NY. Karen is the earliest recorded victim of the Long Island Serial Killer, murdered in 1996.

After 26 years, Fire Island Jane Doe is Identified

AWESOME!!!!!

 

[marble]

Why would the adult children need an attorney?

Well, because it's the smartest thing to do. They have no idea what kinds of challenges they'll be faced with (legal and otherwise). I find it really troubling that there's so much picking apart of his family- by all accounts so far they are victims too and had nothing to do with what their father is accused of. It's nobody's business how they are grieving, which relatives they are in contact with, whether they want to continue to live in the house, whether they've talked to Rex or plan to visit him in jail etc. None of you know the context for any of this and it feels like gawking and victim blaming.

 

[Charlot123]

I thought Natasha Jugo died by suicide? Or was it never fully determined?

I also think we will find that Carmen (Velez?) the woman from East Harlem found on Meadowbrook Pkwy will not be a victim of RH. I do not think he had any business uptown in 1989 nor do I think he would have the desire to go into that territory. 106 & Lexington in those days was very different than today and from his alleged victims and internet searches he picks white women or Asians. JMO.

He probably hunted on the internet for "his type", and I think they are blonde/redhead white women. However, if he found a black/mixed ethnicity woman attractive, and it could be her general diminutive stature + young age, for example, and the opportunity was there (her coming up to his car, no witnesses around), he'd do it. JMO. I think that in 1989, there was less selectivity, as it was pre-online time. We assume that a certain "look" might turn him on, but perhaps, so could a certain voice timbre, or the manner to present herself? In 1989, there could have been way more variability.

 

[Charlot123]

I kinda think whether I would want to live in that house or not is irrelevant. And if AE wants to or not is none of my business.

I can think of a few reasons it might be the best idea for her.

She or her son do not like change, and learning a whole lot about Rex is change enough- moving house might makes things harder to process.

She has advice that she has better odds getting the whole house in divorce, rather than half or none at all, while living in it.

She feels if she leaves it, the tourists will destroy it.

She feels if she leaves it some shady friend or relative of Rex's will do something to it.

She feels like she is being bullied out, and won't be.

Financial abuse and coercive control are real and hideous. Yet I see no evidence that AE wants out of the house. So I don't see any reason to assume the problem is that she can't.

MOO

One more thing. The neighbors didn't like him but might have been sympathetic towards her or the kids. You know how the big world is. If they move out, you bet some inquisitive new neighbors will start gossiping, "oh, I still think she was involved". This is one of the few things I know I can safely bet on. Or worse, someone would start spreading rumors about the kids. Some nosey citizens are merciless. So I think she is right to stay.

 

[Sundog]

Why would the adult children need an attorney?

LE will probably want to interiew them, since they lived with RH and probably sometimes travelled with RH. Also the daughter worked in RH's office. I guess it could be seen as a conflict of interest for the mother to have the same attorney as the adult chidlren.

They are in a difficult position if called to testify, if it is testimony that is against their father/step father or could be perceived as against their father/stepfather. An attorney can guide them through it.

Just guessing on this.

 

[LadyL]

Court documents: Suffolk DA's office has requested cheek swab from Rex Heuermann

After Heuermann’s arrest, his wife, daughter and stepson voluntarily provided cheek swabs for DNA analysis. However, Heuermann still has not.

bronx.news12.com

…

Without a DNA sample taken directly from Heuermann’s mouth, as opposed to items such as a water bottle or partially eaten pizza, forensic biologists at the Suffolk County Crime Lab are limited in how they can testify at trial regarding Heuermann’s DNA profile.

According to the criminal court documents, forensics biologists would only be able to reference the pizza crusts and napkin as believed to be “used or touched” by Heuermann and would not be allowed to say it is his DNA profile.

“If the defendant’s DNA from a buccal swab sample matches the mitochondrial DNA profile developed from the hair recovered from Megan Waterman’s remains, there is scientific evidence of the Defendant’s contact not only with Ms. Waterman and where her remains were discovered, but also with the burlap utilized to restrain and transport her human remains,” Assistant Suffolk County District Attorney Michelle Haddad said in the court filings.

Prosecutors also argued that a denial of a cheek swab could deprive Heuermann of a crucial defense at trial if his DNA from the swab does not match the DNA profile from the pizza crusts and napkin.

The defense, which did not return a request for comment, has until next week to oppose the motion. Otherwise, Heuermann will have to provide a cheek swab by August 15.

so if his lawyers believe him that he 'didn't do this', then they should have no reason to oppose the motion but we know that RH has every reason to refuse to do it

 

[Sundog]

It has also been reported that her father is 90 years old and I would think she would want to stay close to him.

I agree, she may not want to leave the area. Whatever she wants to do right now is up to her. What she might want to do may be different from what I would do, but only she knows what is best for her right now. She probably also wants to stay close to her attorney as she goes through the divorce proceedings. I support her in whatever she decides to do. I only hope that she ends up with options, has the finances and other resources to make the decision that is best for her.

 

[LadyL]

IDK how reliable it is, but her sister was quoted as saying she had not had any contact with her.

This is bizaare.

that was early on ... hopefully have since seen each other

 

[investigatefred]

I think it was a legitimate question, and certainly not meant to gawk at the family, nor victim blame.

After seeing the original question, "Why would the adult children need an attorney?", it prompted me to do a bit of googling.

In most states, there is no parent-child priviledge if one is called to testify against the other.

Only a few states recognize some form of parent-child privilege -- Connecticut, Idaho, Massachusetts, Minnesota (by statute) and New York (by judicial ruling).

So, it is possible and now makes sense that this would likely be one of many reasons why the adult children have retained an attorney. JMO.


Exerpt BBM from:

https://practice.findlaw.com/practice-guide/is-there-a-parent-child-evidentiary-privilege-.html

 

[Yemelyan]

I can't be the only one who is confused by some of the info we're getting from LE, can I ?

1. Why did every prior source we had (family, msm, etc.) say that Megan left her cell phone in her room ? But LE tells us her phone pinged in Massapequa ?

2. We know that Dave Schaller didn't see the vehicle Amber got into on the night she disappeared. Dave himself said so, and continues to say so. So who actually identified RH's car as the vehicle Amber left in the night she disappeared ?

3. If RH was the customer Amber and Dave ripped off the night before Amber disappeared, why on earth would she book a second date with him the following night and NOT bring a phone ? In fact, why would she book a date with him at all ?

4. Why would LE indicate that they were coming out with the info about Vergata because they had already contacted her family members, and yet, her 2 grown sons were apparently clueless.

Not criticizing LE here, just saying that a lot of this just doesn't make sense to me.

I agree that there are some things that seem different than what we've heard. I usually go back to Kolker's book to see if it sheds any lights on things that don't seem to make sense.

1. Kolker's book seems to indicate that Megan took her phone with her the night she disappeared (I agree that other sources seem to say a cellphone was still in the room). Page 222 quotes her boyfriend/pimp Vybe calling a friend to say that Megan was missing: "I've been to the hotel, she's not there, her phone's not there." Page 358 quotes her mother Lorraine saying "Megan's (phone) hasn't been found neither." Is it possible that Megan had more than one cell phone, that she was using to place multiple ads? Thinking here about the same book saying Shannan Gilbert had five cellphones..

2. I think it's possible LE have a different witness id'ing the car from the night Amber disappeared (possibly a neighbor?) since DS's info about it definitely comes from the night of the ruse.

3. Again from page 358 of "Lost Girls" where the surviving family discuss the cellphones, Amber's sister Kim says that "My sister had her phone...but four other people worked off of that phone too. After my sister went missing, there were still phone calls with girls using her ad. You just can't go off phone records, at least not my sister's." So possibly Amber did take a phone with her that night.

As to why she went with him, having pulled the ruse on him the night before, I think it was a combination of desperate need for money and an addict's poor judgment. The book describes Amber as "never sober," having a several hundred dollar per day heroin habit, and also being the "main economic engine" of the house, who supported three other active addicts with her sex work. The book said she usually brought in $1000 per day and all of it went back out to pay for drugs. I think she set caution aside in order to make what she felt she needed to survive. I agree it doesn't make "sense," but I feel like she was putting money above any sense of danger.

 

[Vern]

I’d agree, except that to PAY someone you have to have money.

The idea that the wife was on food stamps, while he was a well-regarded architect working with many city agencies, suggests to me that he kept her in poverty somehow.

Her living in that dilapidated house while they had property in other states is IMO also persuasive that he kept her on a tight leash.

In NY she would’ve not been eligible for food stamps based on her husband’s salary and the ownership of a condo or timeshare in Vegas, along with the South Carolina property. I’m wondering how that happened.

Jmo

Their son is a disabled adult and lives in the home and I am unsure if he is able to work/live on his own; perhaps it is he who receives this support?

 

[Vern]

I've wondered about that too.

Others have mentioned the possibility of them having to be questionned and/or testify, but I have a couple other reasosn that I can think of:

Daughter - was employed in RHs business. She and her income are directly impacted by his actions as are all of his other employees. She may also be looking to protect any intersts she can on this front (pension, 401K etc)??

Son - a disabled adult living within the home. If he is incapable of working and/or living on his own, he also has a direct requirement in having his interests protected (and Mom's too!) by ensuring that the home/financials are not just split 50/50 in any divorce, but that court considers that RH would have a continuing obligation, post-divorce, to help support him via a portion of RH's cut of the pie. I've no doubt that Mom will continue to care for her son - it takes money to house, feed, clothe etc so fight for the entire house and her 50% financial and a % financial for the son too. He needs a non-conflicted advocate in this and I am glad he has one.

 

[FromGermany1]

I wondered about that, also. But I do remember reading somewhere in MSM that AE's sister stated that this was overwhelming for their 90-something aged father, so the sister may have been staying with him trying to help him deal with the situation. And maybe AE and her two adult children moving into the father's home nearby was just too much, so they went back and forth. Just speculating.

Sad, either way, and they likely didn't have the money for both a rental car and a hotel, so chose the former so they could be mobile. Again, just speculating.

The sister is an author of at least 4 books, besides her pharmacist job, and is living with her old father. I saw it on a site re her books, I think.
Certainly it is too much for him to have these 3 family members of RH with their many problems around him, apart from accommodation difficulties.
If their relationship to each other didn't exist, then these new findings (RH = SK) definitely don't help. IMO

 

[kittythehare]

Well, because it's the smartest thing to do. They have no idea what kinds of challenges they'll be faced with (legal and otherwise). I find it really troubling that there's so much picking apart of his family- by all accounts so far they are victims too and had nothing to do with what their father is accused of. It's nobody's

I'm also very uncomfortable with it.
I feel compassion for them and I hope they are guided to do the right thing for them.

But there are still victims out there and more questions than answers.

I believe they are the priority.

 

[kittythehare]

I agree that there are some things that seem different than what we've heard. I usually go back to Kolker's book to see if it sheds any lights on things that don't seem to make sense.

1. Kolker's book seems to indicate that Megan took her phone with her the night she disappeared (I agree that other sources seem to say a cellphone was still in the room). Page 222 quotes her boyfriend/pimp Vybe calling a friend to say that Megan was missing: "I've been to the hotel, she's not there, her phone's not there." Page 358 quotes her mother Lorraine saying "Megan's (phone) hasn't been found neither." Is it possible that Megan had more than one cell phone, that she was using to place multiple ads? Thinking here about the same book saying Shannan Gilbert had five cellphones..

2. I think it's possible LE have a different witness id'ing the car from the night Amber disappeared (possibly a neighbor?) since DS's info about it definitely comes from the night of the ruse.

3. Again from page 358 of "Lost Girls" where the surviving family discuss the cellphones, Amber's sister Kim says that "My sister had her phone...but four other people worked off of that phone too. After my sister went missing, there were still phone calls with girls using her ad. You just can't go off phone records, at least not my sister's." So possibly Amber did take a phone with her that night.

As to why she went with him, having pulled the ruse on him the night before, I think it was a combination of desperate need for money and an addict's poor judgment. The book describes Amber as "never sober," having a several hundred dollar per day heroin habit, and also being the "main economic engine" of the house, who supported three other active addicts with her sex work. The book said she usually brought in $1000 per day and all of it went back out to pay for drugs. I think she set caution aside in order to make what she felt she needed to survive. I agree it doesn't make "sense," but I feel like she was putting money above any sense of danger.

How reliable is Kolker?
I've not read the book.

 

[Yemelyan]

How reliable is Kolker?
I've not read the book.

Personally, I consider him and the book to be extremely reliable because he is not just a person who decided to write a book about true crime, he's a former contributing editor at New York Times Magazine and a former investigations reporter for Bloomberg. He's won awards for his journalism including the 2011 Harry Frank Guggenheim Award for Excellence in Criminal Justice Reporting, which is given by the John Jay College of Criminal Justice. He's also a National Magazine Award finalist. Robert Kolker | Penguin Random House

So could he have gotten some details wrong? Sure, maybe...but if his info in the book dovetails with what LE are now saying in the investigation, then I think I have to accept that some of the other sources over the years have perhaps been wrong or at least not the full story.

 

[Elley Mae]

Neighbors saw less of Heuermann’s son, whom some sources suggested was his stepson.

Everything we know about family of ‘quiet’ Gilgo Beach serial killer suspect Rex Heuermann

Gilgo Beach murder suspect Rex Heuermann is a twice-married architect quietly raising two children — including a son with special needs — in the ramshackle Long Island home he grew up i…

nypost.com

…
Read last two paragraphs.

Gilgo suspect Rex Heuermann was loner who ‘really scared’ peers, ex-classmates say

“He was everybody’s punching bag,” one former classmate said of Rex Heuermann, who graduated from Berner High School in 1981.

nypost.com

…

Mr Heuermann’s DNA was found on one of the victims, while his wife’s hair was found on three of the four women he is connected to.

Sons of newly-identified Gilgo Beach murder victim ‘weren’t warned by police’

Long Island police on Friday identified the victim previously known only as Jane Doe 7

www.independent.co.uk

 

[iamshadow21]

How reliable is Kolker?
I've not read the book.

It's an excellent book, and from what I've read about the case, very reliable. He has a gift for humanising people without turning them into caricatures or glossing over their faults or failings. He talked to as many people as he could who knew the girls, especially their families and friends. He shows this gift equally well with his book Hidden Valley Road, which is about a family with an incredibly high incidence of schizophrenia (six of twelve children). Both are books with sharp, unforgiving realities which can be difficult to read about without heartache, but you never forget the people in them are real, not characters.

MOO

 

[DetectiveDraper]

Neighbors saw less of Heuermann’s son, whom some sources suggested was his stepson.

Everything we know about family of ‘quiet’ Gilgo Beach serial killer suspect Rex Heuermann

Gilgo Beach murder suspect Rex Heuermann is a twice-married architect quietly raising two children — including a son with special needs — in the ramshackle Long Island home he grew up i…

nypost.com

…
Read last two paragraphs.

Gilgo suspect Rex Heuermann was loner who ‘really scared’ peers, ex-classmates say

“He was everybody’s punching bag,” one former classmate said of Rex Heuermann, who graduated from Berner High School in 1981.

nypost.com

…

Mr Heuermann’s DNA was found on one of the victims, while his wife’s hair was found on three of the four women he is connected to.

Sons of newly-identified Gilgo Beach murder victim ‘weren’t warned by police’

Long Island police on Friday identified the victim previously known only as Jane Doe 7

www.independent.co.uk

Her hair being found is really throwing me off. Especially since multiple hairs were found and on different bodies.