Identified! Greece - LIVING 4 year old, with Roma couple, Oct'13 - #1

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  • #621
First I want to state that I do not condone human trafficking, kidnapping or any of the above, but this taking a child because they do not look like the parents is just off to me. I feel that if this was happening in the US people would be outraged and come unglued. Not that it is not a good way to find missing children but can you imagine if your child/stepchild etc did not look like you and you were arrested, or had your kid taken from you due to it? Just saying.

They've done a DNA test. M**** is not their child.

From what we've been told by the members who claim knowledge of the Roma people, they do not intermix/marry/procreate with outsiders. If this is true, there would be little chance of the parents having a fair, blond, blue-eyed child. Besides, as stated before, their DNA does not match. She is not their offspring. IMO all outrage should be directed against the people who purchase and/or traffick children.
 
  • #622
I would hope if they're are 8 or 10 possible parents that they've narrowed it down to that maybe they could show their pictures to this little girl and see if they seem familiar to her at all.

Doubtful imo. Apparently she's been with the Roma family for years, ever since she was a toddler. I don't think she'd know her parents unless there is some truth about the stories about illegal adoption and the birth parents visiting Maria at the camp.
 
  • #623
Wish i could find the link.. i read the 10 families ..8 of them have been ruled out.

1 there checkin against lisa irwin
So that leaves 1..
Not look too hopeful
 
  • #624
Is anyone familiar with the Greek child social services? I see this little girl is with (what I've been assuming) a private organization at the moment. If her parents or natural relatives aren't found will she go into foster cafe? Be adopted out right away? Stay with the organization until she ages out? Live in an orphanage type care setting?

I'm so curious as to how this works.

With the publicity this case has gotten, it would not surprise me if there are not several families willing to adopt her.
 
  • #625
First I want to state that I do not condone human trafficking, kidnapping or any of the above, but this taking a child because they do not look like the parents is just off to me. I feel that if this was happening in the US people would be outraged and come unglued. Not that it is not a good way to find missing children but can you imagine if your child/stepchild etc did not look like you and you were arrested, or had your kid taken from you due to it? Just saying.

I agree! I've steered clear mostly from this thread for that reason. My son was adopted and looks nothing like me. I would be beyond furious if I was constantly questioned.

The whole gypsy lumping has really got my panties in a bunch too! My grandmother had me terrified of gypsies as a little girl .., she was always telling me to be careful, hold her hand, don't wander off because I would be stolen by gypsies. I was terrified and brainwashed! Up until I became friends with some and learned they were just people.


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  • #626
They've done a DNA test. M**** is not their child.

From what we've been told by the members who claim knowledge of the Roma people, they do not intermix/marry/procreate with outsiders. If this is true, there would be little chance of the parents having a fair, blond, blue-eyed child. Besides, as stated before, their DNA does not match. She is not their offspring. IMO all outrage should be directed against the people who purchase and/or traffick children.

Yes, and the birth certificate/documentation was sketchy as to who her parents were/are. This came to light even before the DNA results came back.


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  • #627
The Sunday World newspaper claimed the family have lived in Ireland for years but it is understood they regularly go back to Romania.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...aired-blue-eyed-girl-in-Dublin-Roma-camp.html

How do people that are one dollar away from being homeless able to travel the way they do. And is this traveling their way of moving kidnapped/stolen children?


Interesting... and this led me to a couple other links to a story about Ben Needham. The part below, I had not heard before.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...p-say-he-was-like-a-fly-in-a-cup-of-milk.html
The Needham family had commissioned Stratos Bakirtzis, a private detective based in the central Greek city of Thessaloniki, to try and trace Ben, who disappeared from the island of Kos in 1991 when he was aged 21 months.

By December 1995, Mr Bakirtzis's company had found a blonde-haired boy, aged around seven or eight, living in a gipsy camp near the town of Veria.

..."When Greek police asked his family to take him to the local police station, a different child was taken instead without explanation."
Is there a thread for him perhaps? I couldn't find one.

I also take it that no picture of the girl in Ireland has been posted yet?
 
  • #628
I'm very sad. In one of the articles, it shows the Smile offices in Greece, with a board full of missing children. One of them is little blonde, French Fiona Chafoulais. They're not going to find her in Greece. Mom and stepdad have remembered they didn't lose her in a park as they said - they buried her in it somewhere. They just can't remember where.

Apparently, her Mom's likely to receive a four month jail sentence....
 
  • #629
  • #630
This is a general questions about DNA.

For some time I've been watching shows like "Who do you think you are?" I love it, the stories of these people are sometimes like novels!

They run the persons DNA and the result says he/she is 80% European, 10% African and 10% Native American. Sometimes they can even pinpoint it down to nationality in Europe or tribe in Africa etc.

I'm just thinking they should be able to tell more about Maria based on her DNA? Or?

Interesting article imo, concerning the use of hair analysis to determine locations where an unidentified person has lived.

http://www.thestar.com/life/2012/01...p_forensic_investigators_identify_bodies.html


"When water is consumed, it leaves a chemical fingerprint in hair. And because people tend to drink and cook with their local water, which can vary by region, the signature left on the hair will be geographically unique.

“This is a new tool to help investigators who’ve hit a wall. Sometimes they have no idea where to look,” says St-Jean. “You can get DNA from a body that you’ve found, but if that person never wound up in a DNA database, it’s a useless piece of information.”

Researchers can tell where a person has been by studying the hydrogen and oxygen in the hair. Specifically, they analyze stable isotopes — different forms of the same chemical element — in the hair.

Because hair retains isotopic information, and grows about one centimetre each month, it can provide a personal chronology of where a person has been. If a person moves across the country over the course of a year, that movement will be reflected in the last 12cms of hair growth.

The longer the hair, the longer the trail of footsteps. It’s like having a passport that’s been stamped along the way.

So if an unidentified body is found in downtown Toronto, the person’s hair may indicate they’re not from the city, but a resident of a remote community in northern Ontario — a detail that could prove useful to investigators".
 
  • #631
Is it not possible that she could be the result of a hidden pregnancy from within the community itself?
 
  • #632
  • #633
I agree! I've steered clear mostly from this thread for that reason. My son was adopted and looks nothing like me. I would be beyond furious if I was constantly questioned.

The whole gypsy lumping has really got my panties in a bunch too! My grandmother had me terrified of gypsies as a little girl .., she was always telling me to be careful, hold her hand, don't wander off because I would be stolen by gypsies. I was terrified and brainwashed! Up until I became friends with some and learned they were just people.


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Why would you be furious? You adopted him legally and have the proper documentation. I'm often asked about my grandson's ethnicity, he is my blood relative but he is mixed race. IMO, if the asking of questions helps LE find purchased or trafficked children then ask away! The parents who have legal custody have nothing to fear.
 
  • #634
Where did that legend of Gypsies stealing babies originate? Did they, at one point in history, ACTUALLY steal babies? Why?

My only experience with the Roma community was in Rome, when I was trying to board a train and was obviously confused. A very pretty girl walked me to my seat, and then demanded 5 Euros. I was taken aback by her directness, but gave it to her because I was so thankful for her help.

Poor little M____. I would fly over and adopt her in a heartbeat if I thought I had a real chance.
 
  • #635
First I want to state that I do not condone human trafficking, kidnapping or any of the above, but this taking a child because they do not look like the parents is just off to me. I feel that if this was happening in the US people would be outraged and come unglued. Not that it is not a good way to find missing children but can you imagine if your child/stepchild etc did not look like you and you were arrested, or had your kid taken from you due to it? Just saying.

The children were removed because the "parents" could not provide documentation of legal custody, not because the child did not resemble them.
 
  • #636
Where did that legend of Gypsies stealing babies originate? Did they, at one point in history, ACTUALLY steal babies? Why?

My only experience with the Roma community was in Rome, when I was trying to board a train and was obviously confused. A very pretty girl walked me to my seat, and then demanded 5 Euros. I was taken aback by her directness, but gave it to her because I was so thankful for her help.

Poor little M____. I would fly over and adopt her in a heartbeat if I thought I had a real chance.

Good question. It seems to be a very old myth, and it seems to be any nomadic people who are accused of it, not just Roma. There's a similar myth about Irish travellers, and yet I've never come across any actual case where Irish travellers have kidnapped children. I think Arabs have a similar myth about the Bedouin.

Maybe because they were travelling around from community to community, they were looked askance at any time a child went missing. We all know how mysterious some missing child cases are from reading here, so I can see how in centuries past a group who were here today and gone tomorrow might seem to be the solution to such a mystery.
 
  • #637
" One case we have is a photo of a missing child from Canada and we have forwarded this information to check if there’s any link of Maria,” Pardalis told CTV Toronto’s Ashley Rowe.

However, none of the seven children born after 2006 in the RCMP missing persons database resemble Maria"

Read more: http://www.ctvnews.ca/world/photo-o...ers-inquiry-in-canada-1.1505772#ixzz2iTdWUFqC
bbm.

I can't find any Canadian children that even remotely could be considered as possibly being Maria, unless they have pulled that child's info temporarily thinking it might match, which I doubt they would do.
 
  • #638
The children were removed because the "parents" could not provide documentation of legal custody, not because the child did not resemble them.

How often does law enforcement ask for documentation of legal custody? Is it routine? I somehow doubt it.


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  • #639
  • #640
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