IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #6

[tlneedham]

Weird-I've never seen white paddle boats before! Anyway, if you notice, the shipping weight on those are 110 lbs, 140 lbs--not the easiest things to lug around.

And I agree--that's not a getaway vehicle. Even with 2 others peddling they usually move slightly faster than molasses.

 

[MotherOcean]

Seems to me that the prime reason for a 10 year old to have a cell phone would be for safety/emergency when out alone. It makes no sense that she would have left it behind.

It makes sense to me!! Kids that age have to be reminded and reminded and reminded of all kinds of things... brush your teeth dear, you have to wear shoes to town dear, don't forget that dang phone... we bought it for a reason... dear. That is my life. All day long.

 

[Sunlight]

I highly doubt the kidnapper at that late hour would say oh yeah, they're over there by the lake, just saw them. Nah. I also don't believe that witness really saw them at that time, since I believe what happened, happened much earlier, whatever it was...My take is that possibly another witness said they saw someone on the lake in the area in a paddleboat or a fisherman at a "certain" time in order to give credibility to his/her own sighting of whatever he/she saw. Something to corroborate something. Of course, Tammy is a witness too, so it could be that they want to corroborate something she saw...or the guy she spoke with. Moo

 

[Sere-nity]

Weird-I've never seen white paddle boats before! Anyway, if you notice, the shipping weight on those are 110 lbs, 140 lbs--not the easiest things to lug around.

And I agree--that's not a getaway vehicle. Even with 2 others peddling they usually move slightly faster than molasses.

Agreed on the speed, but if the girls went willingly then why speed?

 

[MotherOcean]

I missed this. I have not heard about a floating rope tied to a brick.

ETA: Found an article - http://wcfcourier.com/news/local/su...cle_0bf2e65e-cfc3-11e1-9030-001a4bcf887a.html

Hmmm... this article states it was found in an area in Waterloo. Sorry. I thought it was found in an area closer to Meyers Lake. Oh well, as horrible as it is to think about, I had thought it may be a clue. Thanks for the article.

 

[otto]

No, no, no. A canoe or a kayak is a canoe or a kayak. THIS is a paddleboat: http://www.walmart.com/ip/14550414?...1=g&wl2=&wl3=14096064790&wl4=&wl5=pla&veh=sem

Here, paddlers are people that paddle canoes and kayaks. I suppose a paddleboat might be a pedal-type boat ... hard to say.

 

[JaimeInLA]

Agreed on the speed, but if the girls went willingly then why speed?

Because a kidnapper couldn't risk being out in the open, slowly moving across the lake with 2 girls. I can't think of anything MORE visible than being in the middle of a body of water, surrounded by houses and people fishing, running, biking. He would have literally been a sitting duck. If the parents had shown up, they could have had the police there to arrest him before he even reached the shore.

 

[Jules71]

I highly doubt the kidnapper at that late hour would say oh yeah, they're over there by the lake, just saw them. Nah. I also don't believe that witness really saw them at that time, since I believe what happenened, happened much earlier, whatever it was...My take is that possibly another witness said they saw someone on the lake in the area in a paddleboat or a fisherman at a "certain" time in order to give credibility to his/her own siting of whatever he/she saw. Something to corroborate something. Of course, Tammy is a witness too, so it could be that they want to corroborate something she saw...or the guy she spoke with. Moo

But it could be, this person (if he is involved in some kind of plan) said he saw the girls in order to place them at the lake that day - when in fact they really weren't, so to throw off the investigation.

Or as someone else said - maybe this person does not exist.

 

[Sunlight]

I believe the girls were at the location of the bikes, because I believe in the dogs power of tracking. Two different dogs tracked them from the bikes, and into the woods (and by the shore). Of course, they could have gone into the woods to pee and then gone to the shore to go for a short paddleboat ride to another part of the shore that is sheltered by trees and boathouses that one can see on the map...That could have happened closer to 2:30 if the girls had first been down that way earlier (when TG swerved) and then they may have left and realized they forgot the purse by the water and cycled back (when the watering the lawn people saw them) and then perhaps gotten the "ride" after they parked the bikes, on a paddleboat...or other method of abduction at that time, which would match what the guy that spoke with Tammy saw. moo

 

[liz b.]

Which is one little 'clue' that has been niggling at me. Why didn't she take her cell? Most young girls have it attached to them every time they leave the home. Did she forget it or did she leave it home on purpose?

I know of a couple cases where the girl purposely left the cell at home because they planned to run off that day. [ One that comes to mind is the 14 yr old from Oxnard calif who ran off to mexico with her older boyfriend. She had a child with him and came home voluntarily 2 yrs later or so IIRC]

I thought this too... but, why would she run off with Elizabeth ? MOO

 

[TGIRecovered]

I highly doubt the kidnapper at that late hour would say oh yeah, they're over there by the lake, just saw them. Nah. I also don't believe that witness really saw them at that time, since I believe what happenened, happened much earlier, whatever it was...My take is that possibly another witness said they saw someone on the lake in the area in a paddleboat or a fisherman at a "certain" time in order to give credibility to his/her own siting of whatever he/she saw. Something to corroborate something.

Yeah, you are right, that doesn't seem like a smart thing to do if he had anything to hide, but maybe he was shocked to suddenly run into someone who was already there, asking about the girls.

LE may very well know who this is and have already spoken with him, but it seems weird that news media has gotten to everyone else with a witness report except him. MOO

 

[RoseRed]

(Although if you would like to buy me the flamingo , I can provide my addy

LOL are you one of those campers that sets up flamingos all around his RV. Luv it , but we are too lazy to go to that much work setting up camp.

 

[Jules71]

I believe the girls were at the location of the bikes, because I believe in the dogs power of tracking. Two different dogs tracked them from the bikes, and into the woods (and by the shore).

But from what I understand from discussing this today is that the scent the dogs tracked could have been from the day before or some other time. I just don't know for sure.

 

[MotherOcean]

I'm wondering if the person with the paddleboat and the man who told Aunt Tammy that he saw the girls at 2:30 could be the same person. Maybe that lead came from her.

If it is the same man and he is not coming forward, I would be skeptical about whether he really did see the girls at 2:30. Could it be possible that Aunt Tammy actually ran in to the kidnapper at the lake after the girls were taken but before the bikes were discovered?

Other witnesses such as the "watering his plants" man have spoken out publicly thru the news media but I don't recall seeing any interviews with the guy Tammy talked to at the lake!
:moo:

According to a post somewhere in this thread, Tammy stated through the media that LE have the name and contact info. for the man she talked to at the lake that afternoon. I believe she gave that info. during the NG interview.

 

[nikb]

look here- these re paddle boats AKA pedal boats- linked for informational purposes only

http://www.wayfair.com/Pedal-Boats-...LbkTcSBB&pcrid=742853824_mtrckid_1580emw10627

(Although if you would like to buy me the flamingo , I can provide my addy

OK thank you! This is what I thought and what I was picturing, I just wanted to make sure it wasn't some regional difference in terminology.

Oh my.. they make one that's a flamingo??? (yes I saw it, but I still can't believe it exists )

 

[ShyViolet]

I have said this before, but it just seems a bit too coincidental for me that Aunt Tammy said someone told her he saw them there, and that is where their bikes turned up.

ETA-It seems that either he really did see them, and if someone made it up it was because they knew the bikes would be found there

 

[liz b.]

According to a post somewhere in this thread, Tammy stated through the media that LE have the name and contact info. for the man she talked to at the lake that afternoon. I believe she gave that info. during the NG interview.

Yes, I remember reading that too... Tammy said that LE had his name...also, I recall reading that someone was with her when she spoke to him...this is what was reported.This is what she said,supposedly...MOO

 

[Mjskit]

Sounds like Gma left Heather's to go meet Tammy to run errands and called Misty to tell her the kids were out riding and hadn't returned and that she (Misty) and Heather needed to go find their own kids, because she had stuff to do with Tammy and that Tammy was already at her (Gma's) house in Waterloo. Misty went to Heathers. Gma and Tammy were doing whatever they were doing in Waterloo and got the call from Drew to come back. Since they were supposed to have left for Waterloo by 1:30 and were running late, Gma called Misty at 2:00, having already left. What is unclear is exactly what time Gma was driving around looking for the girls before she left. Maybe from 1:30-2:00? Which means by the time they (Gma and Tammy) came back after Drew called them, the police had been contacted and Tammy was saying go check the lake maybe by 3:00. Sounds reasonable to me. It is Heather and Drew that were the most alarmed and Heather contacted LE...good thing. Just trying to decipher this stuff. MOO

Makes sense. I am sooo glad there are people like you here. I would never have figured that out. Thank you!

 

[katydid23]

I thought this too... but, why would she run off with Elizabeth ? MOO

I am wondering if she might have had some secret plans to run away with the 'help' of a family friend. And maybe she did not plan for Elizabeth to be involved, she just rode off with her so grandma would not be concerned. But once she got to where she was meeting her 'friend', then things went sideways.

 

[nervous_nellie]

I have said this before, but it just seems a bit too coincidental for me that Aunt Tammy said someone told her he saw them there, and that is where their bikes turned up.

i agree, but the only reason i find hard to believe is that if this person actually saw the girls he would have seen them much later than what would fit the "time line" which isnt set in stone but it just doesnt fit right imo... kwim? im so confused with all of the statements and times that almost means that some of these things would almost be occurring simultaneously to make it all fit together - or maybe i just need sleep...lol