IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #6

[Kamille]

Now I am thoroughly confused about the biker. Could it be that he didn't actually go to the Evansdale PD, as in going to the brick and mortar, but that whoever wrote the news article is referring to the actual officers as the EPD?? Otherwise, I have no clue. I thought he had gone home, heard about the girls, and then physically went to the PD (building/location/facility) and reported his sighting. Maybe he went to the lake and spoke to LE there and the article is calling that "went to the Evansdale Police Department."

What I get out of reading that article is that TG stopped by the lake and spoke with officers who were searching on Monday. He then went to the Evansdale PD to make a report, where the officers at the lake probably told him to go because they didn't have anything with them to take a report. Does it say they were the off duty ones?

Anyway, I don't think that the bikes he saw belonged to the girls. I haven't read anywhere where he has stated that the bikes were near the gated area inside that two sided fenced pathway. Only that he saw bikes on the path and had to swerve to miss them. They could have been anywhere on that path based on media articles. Did he ever indicate that they were in the same place as where the girl's bikes were found?

MOO

 

[SapphireSteel]

me - thread #2

07-17-2012, 04:22 PM
SapphireSteel
Registered User Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 329

I hope they're checking this Gamerbinger's basement.


:what:

 

[Jules71]

Please feel free to correct me, but the very first post I can find about Ted G the cyclist/biker was on Sunday, 7/14 at 10:45 pm. In thread 1, #130 Wonderwall said:
"According to a poster on the Facebook Group, the girls bikes were seen on the Gilbertville to Meyers Trail just prior to 12:27 pm on Friday, the biker did not see or hear the girls at that time, the tip was called in to LE, fwiw."

Point being it appears that he DID report it before Monday.

Thank you!! So per that post - he called it in and it was before Monday. Geez now we have 1) called it in, 2) went to the police dept to report it, and 3) approached officers at the lake and reported it.

 

[nikb]

Exactly! It's not like Rover can look up and tell his handler which day the scent is from. It's just the "newest". Doesn't that mean it could be from last Tuesday but the dog can't tell the handler that.

Right?

THANK YOU this has been driving me nuts from the beginnig as well. "Newest" doesn't mean "yesterday at noon" unless I'm way off on how scent dogs do their thing.

 

[Patty G]

This is above the live stream video: "Authorities will be updating the public on the case at 4 p.m. CDT"

Read More: http://wcfcourier.com/updates-the-h...e9a-11e1-80bf-0019bb2963f4.html#ixzz21ThgEjBs

5:00 PM EDT

 

[gregjrichards]

*Press conference at 4pm CT Time in 50 minutes* - watch here live http://wcfcourier.com/twitter-updat...tml_7502e29a-ce9a-11e1-80bf-0019bb2963f4.html

 

[sarx]

THANK YOU this has been driving me nuts from the beginnig as well. "Newest" doesn't mean "yesterday at noon" unless I'm way off on how scent dogs do their thing.

Nope, freshest/newest means just that. Haven't meant a dog yet who could wave their paw 3 times to tell me it was from Wednesday, 4 times for Thursday, etc. That would be handy though.

 

[Sunlight]

It was in the first link I posted about 2 threads ago. Unfortunately, that article is no longer available.

I'm finding out the hard way that each time you go back to an article, it has been edited, updated and completely changes from the first time you post the url. This sucks because it makes it impossible to keep a clean link trail.

I'm so with you on this. I just went back looking for the article/s and they were different. I thought I was going nuts. Where is all the info about the phone call to the daughter, etc.? Where is the info about 12:27? There were sources for this stuff. I just don't get it. And, fwiw, I don't think that spending time on this witness is a waste of time, since that witness is so far the only person who put himself at the location and at the timeframe the kids went missing. I don't believe he was or wasn't involved...This is why a really good central timeline with sources is important. Just sayin'. Moo

 

[Jules71]

So in other words - just because the dogs picked up their scent at the lake doesn't mean it was from them being there on Friday the 13th. Could have been from the day before and the bikes could have been dumped there on Friday.

 

[SapphireSteel]

THANK YOU this has been driving me nuts from the beginnig as well. "Newest" doesn't mean "yesterday at noon" unless I'm way off on how scent dogs do their thing.

Yes, BUT -

(I'm learning wayyyy more about sniffer dogs than I ever thought I would) whatever you eat affects your scent.

Therefore, if a dog is given something the person was wearing the day the went missing, say they'd eaten hotdogs that day, the hotdog scent will be part of what the sniffer dog looks for and alerts to.

But you're right, the dog can't tell us that...they can't say...I got this girl, but not with hotdogs!

I suppose there could be some sort of "control" set up so the dog can indicate which "day" clothing is the right one? Eg Tuesday hot dogs, wednesday Maccas, the dog could indicate it picked up the Maccas? They are pretty smart.

It's a shame they can't talk, really.

 

[threecrazykids]

He waited until he heard that the girls were missing. It was later in the day on Friday. The article you were looking at is showing him talking to LE again. Probably just going over the details again.

I don't know why you think the police aren't using his sighting in the timeline. This is what the 12:20 time is based on. :waitasec:

I think MY confusion comes from the fact that I have yet to hear LE make a comment where they include this witnesses sighting in their timeline. The only 2 times that I have ever actually heard mentioned by Abben is 12:15 and 3 (4 is when he arrived on the scene).

I have yet to hear LE state they are using 12:15 video tape, 12:20 sighting, etc in their "OFFICIAL" timeline.

 

[nikb]

Nope, freshest/newest means just that. Haven't meant a dog yet who could wave their paw 3 times to tell me it was from Wednesday, 4 times for Thursday, etc. That would be handy though.

Thanks for the confirmation. I shouldn't be laughing because this is a very serious situation, but your comment about the paw-wave being handy cracked me up.

 

[hollyblue]

Please feel free to correct me, but the very first post I can find about Ted G the cyclist/biker was on Sunday, 7/14 at 10:45 pm. In thread 1, #130 Wondergirl said:
"According to a poster on the Facebook Group, the girls bikes were seen on the Gilbertville to Meyers Trail just prior to 12:27 pm on Friday, the biker did not see or hear the girls at that time, the tip was called in to LE, fwiw."

Point being it appears that he DID report it before Monday.

BBM: Huh? Isn't this the Cedar Valley Nature Trial they're talking about or are they confusing it with the trail at Meyer's Lake.

 

[sarx]

Yes, BUT -

(I'm learning wayyyy more about sniffer dogs than I ever thought I would) whatever you eat affects your scent.

Therefore, if a dog is given something the person was wearing the day the went missing, say they'd eaten hotdogs that day, the hotdog scent will be part of what the sniffer dog looks for and alerts to.

But you're right, the dog can't tell us that...they can't say...I got this girl, but not with hotdogs!

I suppose there could be some sort of "control" set up so the dog can indicate which "day" clothing is the right one? Eg Tuesday hot dogs, wednesday Maccas, the dog could indicate it picked up the Maccas? They are pretty smart.

It's a shame they can't talk, really.

Scent goes to the DNA level, so while sure, a dog can smell if you had a lot of garlic that day, the underlying scent, "your scent" is always there, and that is what they are working off of, the rest is just kinda noise.

 

[SapphireSteel]

I think MY confusion comes from the fact that I have yet to hear LE make a comment where they include this witnesses sighting in their timeline. The only 2 times that I have ever actually heard mentioned by Abben is 12:15 and 3 (4 is when he arrived on the scene).

I have yet to hear LE state they are using 12:15 video tape, 12:20 sighting, etc in their "OFFICIAL" timeline.

This witness is all over this case.

He's contacted LE several times apparently, and some of his statement's don't mesh with what we know.

Am I correct in believing he is the ONLY witness who actually saw the girls at the lake?

 

[Marilynilpa]

I already posted that article. Which day did he go to the PD to report it? Which day did he approach officers at the lake? IMO those are two separate events (reporting it at the police dept and reporting it to officers at the lake). We are trying to determine which day he did those two things.

BBM

Sorry, it's not uncommon for posts to overlap.

You say "we are trying to determine which day he did those two things." Why? I'm not trying to be snarky, I just really don't see what difference it makes. LE has given no indication at all that they question the biker's sighting of the bikes. LE also has not indicated that the biker failed to report his information to the proper authorities in a timely manner.

Why does it seem the biker's credibility is at issue here? How does that relate to finding Lyric and Elizabeth?

 

[SapphireSteel]

Scent goes to the DNA level, so while sure, a dog can smell if you had a lot of garlic that day, the underlying scent, "your scent" is always there, and that is what they are working off of, the rest is just kinda noise.

True, not arguing at all...but conceivably, a dog could be able to indicate which day's clothing is the one it smelt?

If it was properly set up and controlled?

 

[sarx]

So in other words - just because the dogs picked up their scent at the lake doesn't mean it was from them being there on Friday the 13th. Could have been from the day before and the bikes could have been dumped there on Friday.

Correct, which is why dogs are just a tool, and you need other insight (eye witness, video, Mom saying, and so on).

 

[JaimeInLA]

This witness is all over this case.

He's contacted LE several times apparently, and some of his statement's don't mesh with what we know.

Am I correct in believing he is the ONLY witness who actually saw the girls at the lake?

Agree 100%. We now have documented THREE different times that he contacted LE, AND he also put himself at the scene, right around the time they went missing.

One correction though -- he claims he did NOT see the girls, only their bikes.

 

[Wondergirl]

Please feel free to correct me, but the very first post I can find about Ted G the cyclist/biker was on Sunday, 7/14 at 10:45 pm. In thread 1, #130 Wondergirl said:
"According to a poster on the Facebook Group, the girls bikes were seen on the Gilbertville to Meyers Trail just prior to 12:27 pm on Friday, the biker did not see or hear the girls at that time, the tip was called in to LE, fwiw."

Point being it appears that he DID report it before Monday.

That's correct, Truman, the poster on the FB Group (I believe Ted's daughter whom he had phoned), was concerned THAT DAY, on July 14th, and wanted the family to know the information, thus, she posted on FB so the family would know the information.

Totally NOT hinky at all, IMO. Gut instinct, nothing else.