IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #6

[JaimeInLA]

It would be important if either of the girls were expected to testify at DM's trial. However, I remember reading somewhere that DM was expected to plead guilty just the day before the girls went missing. Apparently, he requested a jury trial at that time (just the day before).

True, but he also had 2 accomplices who had pre trial meetings on that same day. Perhaps the girls were supposed to testify against the accomplices as part of his guilty plea deal.

 

[katydid23]

It would be important if either of the girls were expected to testify at DM's trial. However, I remember reading somewhere that DM was expected to plead guilty just the day before the girls went missing. Apparently, he requested a jury trial at that time (just the day before).

That is such a huge coincidence that it is hard for me to ignore it. The day before the girls go missing he asks for a jury trial. It really makes me wonder if someone is sending him a message to keep his mouth shut.

 

[GrainneDhu]

Great to know. Thanks. Glad your friend go the UD on the dog.

She has gone on to title 4 or 5 more dogs since then. And ever since then, she schedules her doctor appointments for Mondays!

 

[Gracelin]

I thought it was her. I just wanted to see if other people thought so. I didn't notice her the first time as I was busy watching and listening to the grandmother. So, I began watching videos again to look at the people and surroundings instead and that is when I noticed her. She appears to deliberately walk in camera view only to turn her back on it??? But, stays close enough to hear what is being said. Or, perhaps close enough to be inviting herself to be interviewed???

It looked like when she bends to pet the cat she also picks something up off the ground..

 

[SapphireSteel]

First of all. :welcome: to WS. Great first post.


As to the speculation you see here about witnesses and paddle boaters, that is all it is. Speculation, brain storming, possible scenarios.

If the girls were abducted, then someone in that very small circle of potential perps is the guilty party. So it makes sense to look at and discuss the few people that we know were present at the time the girls went missing.

We are only brainstorming, thinking out loud, and NOT really accusing anyone. Just bringing up questions and possible scenarios. I doubt the bicyclist had anything to do with the crime. I am about 98% certain he is innocent. But there is always that 2% of a possibility that he inserted himself into the scene because he cannot help himself, or because he needed an excuse in case they find his prints or DNA on the purse of bikes. :smile: Just kidding, kind of...

I like it!!!

We are NOT slinging chit, we are BRAIN STORMING.

:goodpost:

 

[SapphireSteel]

It looked like when she bends to pet the cat she also picks something up off the ground..

Gramma must've dropped one.

 

[JaimeInLA]

That is such a huge coincidence that it is hard for me to ignore it. The day before the girls go missing he asks for a jury trial. It really makes me wonder if someone is sending him a message to keep his mouth shut.

AND the accomplices had pre-trial meetings on the morning of the abduction. Chances of that being coincidental, in my opinion, are about 0%.

 

[Mjskit]

First, welcome to WS! Great first post! I do agree with everything you said, so thank you for saying it.

I also want to add that people seem so fast to accuse witnesses of changing times and details, but not so quick in figuring out that the info that is given to LE is what is important, not the info given to us by shoddy reporting. We have no idea of how consistent or inconsistent stories are, since we are only hearing them through varying degrees of reporting.

That is why I listen only to LE. If they say 12:15 is when the girls were seen last then what I go by. Grandma says 11:30 and that might be when she saw them last but not when last seen. LE has NEVER said the abduction happened between 12:15 at 12:27. Just because the bikes (if the bikes were theirs) were laying on the trail doesn't mean they disappeared right then. Other than LE stating they have evidence the only fact LE has stated is the time of 12:15. Everything else is pure conjecture.

I am still learning the ropes here on WS. I hope no one is offended.

 

[sreshowtime]

Seen on their bikes in the video...near Lafayette Street.

near , not on, ahh...okay...hmm I am still interested to the east, in that green space between Lafayette and Gilbert, and its proximity to Arbutus..and the homes around in there

 

[GrainneDhu]

My ex would eat lots of garlic to the point he reeked and finally he stopped the garlic binge but it was really really bad to be around him and he couldn't smell it I believe as he wasn't bothered by it at all.

Well, it is true that the Asian tracklayer could probably have been tracked by a human.

I'm half Korean and love good kim-chee but this guy was way over my consumption level. Way, way over. Like your ex, I'm pretty sure this guy no longer smelled it himself.

Heck, he was probably putting more and more garlic on his food in order to be able to taste it.

 

[GrainneDhu]

why have a press conf if no info and no questions answered...just give a press release of the facts and any further new info they are willing to let us know.
They're getting painful to watch...
JMO

I just pray more is going on in the background than what we can see

Publicity.

 

[nervous_nellie]

what im still fuzzy about is how sure the family was that the girls would not have gone to that park, but yet they went there to search for them - what caused them to look at this park if the girls never went there -- what prompted them to look there?

 

[StacyMarie83]

something that is always in the back of my mind is kids that kill other kids and I came across this story so I thought I'd post. Maybe I grew up watching too many lifetime movies and afterschool specials lol But you never know and it's a scary! I know it's probably not this, in this case, since there are two girls, but you never know the age of the perp(s) :-/

Murderous Children: 12 Year Old Lionel Tate Killed a 6 Year Old Girl
http://antonia-monacelli.hubpages.com/hub/Murderous-Children-Lionel-Tate

 

[GrainneDhu]

From what I read yesterday in looking this up, they also have different levels of kidnapping...for first degree, there has to be a sexual motive, for example; ransom kidnapping is second degree, for some reason...very strange.

Back when those distinctions were put into place, it was assumed that in a kidnapping for ransom, the victim would be treated fairly well. Not as traumatised as a victim kidnapped for sexual purposes.

I honestly can't remember a kidnapping for ransom in Iowa within the last 30 years, maybe longer. I think people who wanted money that badly figured out that it's easier to get away with robbing banks than it is to get away with kidnapping for ransom.

 

[GateKeeper]

Is there a timeline somewhere? TIA

Nice to see you Sarx!

 

[GrainneDhu]

no snark intended but they imo all say that...

Actually, she earlier said that her first polygraph was inconclusive.

Not that it means anything, since polygraphs are woo-woo science. <grumble>

 

[GrainneDhu]

I think they say whatever helps their investigation. In the case of little Breeann Rodriguez, they told the parents they failed and the perp was a neighbor living 5 or 6 houses down.

It's just an investigative tool, so they can lie about it and the reason I don't give it too much merit when the subject releases the what they were told. imo

In the Amber DuBois case, her stepfather took something like 8 polygraphs and every single one was inconclusive.

He was not guilty; he just had a strong emotional response to the situation.

 

[Ryloga]

True, but he also had 2 accomplices who had pre trial meetings on that same day. Perhaps the girls were supposed to testify against the accomplices as part of his guilty plea deal.

I hadn't heard about the accomplices.

Surely, with a case of that magnitude, an accomplice would have more threatening witnesses to want to silence than a child, right? Maybe the girls weren't the witnesses. Maybe dads change in plea was a threat to the others? IDK....poor babies.

 

[Jules71]

Can anyone tell me with 100% certainty what day/time TG reported the bike sighting, the location he saw the bikes, if they were for sure the missing girls' bikes, and if he reported it in person to the police dept, called it in, or only reported it to the LE searching at the lake? No? Ok, that is why we are still discussing it. We are not tearing apart a potential witness. We are trying to nail down the details.

IF the girls were on video at 12:15 by Grandma's and IF TG saw the bikes at 12:27'ish - how did the bikes get there so fast? Were the girls abducted from the lake by their bikes? Or were the abducted from somewhere else and the bikes were planted?

And if LE wants to hear from someone paddle boating between 12-1, they must think the abduction happened between that time?

 

[vasportsmom]

what im still fuzzy about is how sure the family was that the girls would not have gone to that park, but yet they went there to search for them - what caused them to look at this park if the girls never went there -- what prompted them to look there?

That's a very good question. They have said over and over that the girls would never go that far yet they started their search there very quickly. I know LE has said there is no ransom note but what is there was a "blackmail" call and/or note.


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