IA IA - Johnny Gosch, 12, West Des Moines, 5 Sept 1982 #4

[Armchair63]

Searching for Johnny: 40 Years Later

The disappearance of Johnny Gosch is one of Iowa's longest running, and most notorious mysteries.

www.kcci.com

In 1982, the 12-year-old paperboy in West Des Moines vanished without a trace.
Gosch was last seen alive in the early morning hours of Sept. 5, 1982.

 

[I Survived]

I don't understand the visitation because the parents had split up and the mom was now living in an apartment. How did the visitors find the mom?

Probably using a phone book, if what she said is true.

 

[Satch]

Why would Noreen lie about the visit from Johnny?

I am not sure about her statements about some other things. But an incident like that would be very powerful, and never forgotten.

Satch

 

[cenazoic]

First, none of us know whether he really visited her or not. That said:

If he didn’t, I think saying Noreen is ‘lying’ about the visit is putting it too strongly. A lie is a deliberate attempt to deceive. I think she believes it, and therefore, it’s not a lie.

 

[Satch]

First, none of us know whether he really visited her or not. That said:

If he didn’t, I think saying Noreen is ‘lying’ about the visit is putting it too strongly. A lie is a deliberate attempt to deceive. I think she believes it, and therefore, it’s not a lie.

Agree,

Some say that she actually "drempt" the visit. I had some dreams, and even a few nightmares that I can remember from my childhood. Do you think Johnny came to visit her or not? Could she have dreamed about it? Anything is possible.

Satch

 

[Sweetluv]

If he did visit or not is a great question. I do agree, what would she get out of lying that he did visit? But, maybe out of grief and despair, she wanted to believe so badly that he was alive, she actually tricked her mind into thinking this visit really did happen.

 

[FergusMcDuck]

I think she lied.

What would she get out of it? Well, look at where she first "revealed" the visit, two years after it supposedly happened. It was 1999, at Paul Bonacci's civil trial. Paul (the con artist who claimed he had participated in Johnny's kidnapping) had sued a number of people and institutions for being part of the Franklin Credit Union (a conspiracy theory/hoax from the 80s satanic panic era). The suit had been dismissed for all except one - Lawrence King, former director of the Franklin Credit Union, and the only reason it wasn't dismissed is that he didn't challenge it. That's because he was already imprisoned and destitute after having been caught embezzling from the bank. So Paul and his lawyer, far-right Nebraska politician John DeCamp, used the trial to air their conspiracy theories unopposed.

And that's where Noreen comes in. She had met with Paul years before and believed him - though Noreen had pretty much believed everyone who came to her claiming to have knowledge about Johnny. She fully bought into the idea that Johnny had been taken into a Pizzagate/Qanon-style elite p*******e ring, and cooperated with DeCamp. If you read her testimony at the Bonacci civil trial, that's what she's doing - supporting the conspiracy theory. After having outlined the whole thing, DeCamp asks her if she has any evidence for it, and she says yes: "my son visited me and confirmed Bonacci's story exactly."

I've seen claims that she was forced into saying it by the judge, since she was under oath, but that's not true. Everyone was there voluntarily, and the one questioning her was her friend and ally DeCamp. And she always intended to say it - she and DeCamp even tease early in her testimony that she has a bombshell to reveal. Johnny's visit was meant to boost Bonacci's story, that was the point and that was what she had to gain - support for the conspiracy theory she had bought into.

The last parts of her testimony is full on conspiracy theory screed. Mind control. MKUlktra. Satanic p*******es in the military. Things you usually see on poorly designed websites with malware-warnings, or email forwards from less discerning relatives. Bonacci won the lawsuit and a million in damages from King - not because he convinced the judge, but because it was a default decision since King never challenged it. Of course, King never paid. He didn't have the money and never would again.

Of course, if she was tricked by someone, I'd say the list of suspects is exactly one person long.

 

[emem1138]

I do not think that Noreen lied about Johnny visiting. I also do not believe that he visited. But, I believe that Noreen believes he visited.

 

[Vern]

I do not think that Noreen lied about Johnny visiting. I also do not believe that he visited. But, I believe that Noreen believes he visited.

I am in agreement with your thoughts on this.

 

[Vern]

I do not think that Noreen lied about Johnny visiting. I also do not believe that he visited. But, I believe that Noreen believes he visited.

DBM; double posting.

 

[typical_vacation]

I live under a mile from johnnys house — I’ve only been here for about 3 years so I obviously was not around for the incident , but I am happy to answer any questions anyone has about the area.

 

[loveplace]

I do not think that Noreen lied about Johnny visiting. I also do not believe that he visited. But, I believe that Noreen believes he visited.

I totally agree. Trauma and complicated grieving can cause unusual effects on a person in my opinion.

 

[John/Jane Doe]

@Caring1 Hey could you post the current list of NamUs exclusions for John "Johnny" David Gosch? I would greatly appreciate it.

 

[Caring1]

@Caring1 Hey could you post the current list of NamUs exclusions for John "Johnny" David Gosch? I would greatly appreciate it.

48 Unidentified Person Exclusions

 

[Mindshock]

Did Yellow Bag ever state the exact (or approximate) location his attempted abduction occurred?

 

[dotr]

1st Milk Carton Kid: The Disappearance of Johnny Gosch

"Kidnappers weren't done yet with Des Moines, Iowa."

www.kcra.com

Jan 25 2023
''witnesses say *** car pulled up to the boy asked directions and drove away. There's another neighbor who said that he looked out the window at the corner of 42nd and Marquardt and that he saw *** car take off almost like peel out on the 42nd street from Marquardt, maybe *** mile from the interstate highway bob rushing, told tv eight news today, the two witnesses gave conflicting descriptions of the man. The fact that there were no good solid eyewitnesses just added to the complication of the case added to the mystery.''

 

[ekardh]

Does anyone think anything can be read into the fact that Johnny, Eugene and Marc all disappeared within two years of each other?

 

[I Survived]

Does anyone think anything can be read into the fact that Johnny, Eugene and Marc all disappeared within two years of each other?

Yes.
My very humble opinion: the kidnapper was looking for boys around the age of Johnny & co. He hid them somewhere to abuse them. When the kids were grown up too much for his taste he killed them.

 

[ekardh]

Yes.
My very humble opinion: the kidnapper was looking for boys around the age of Johnny & co. He hid them somewhere to abuse them. When the kids were grown up too much for his taste he killed them.

That's certainly one theory. I was thinking it could've been someone who was only in town at certain times of the year, or someone who was incarcerated on unrelated charges.

There was a spate of attacks on paper boys in Des Moines in the 80s. Des Moines is a small area, it's hard to believe that these attacks were all carried out by different perpetrators. Some of these attacks were clearly disorganised, whereas Johnny, Eugene and Marc all vanished without a trace. Of course, we know that serial predators are not successful every time.

 

[scruffydog]

Yes.
My very humble opinion: the kidnapper was looking for boys around the age of Johnny & co. He hid them somewhere to abuse them. When the kids were grown up too much for his taste he killed them.

I agree very much that it's no coincidence that these boys of the same age all disappeared. However-I doubt very much that any of them lived to adulthood unfortunately. For one reason-I think that at some point, 3 or more strong young men could have overtaken their captor and escaped. In my opinion, they were most likely sexually abused and killed rather quickly. People are sick.