ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #17

[Rayemonde]

That would make sense to me, but I don't believe we've ever had confirmation of the time of the receipt or that there was a confirmed sighting or surveillance of Deorr Jr. at the store.

So why would it go from 17 minutes to 4 hours?

 

[giagreen]

So why would it go from 17 minutes to 4 hours?

If possibly ggp and IR never seen DeOrr return from the store.

 

[drjones]

For anybody that's wondering, Klein's exact words are, "We've now expanded the 17 minutes to 4 hours." As @ILOKAL stated, he gives no clarification on that. He does not use the words unaccounted or unattended.

If I had to guess, he means that Deorr was confirmed to be seen alive by somebody outside of the group of 4 POI's about 4 hours before the "search" and 911 call.

He doesn't have to use the exact words, logic would dictate that is his meaning since that is what the 17 minutes was used to describe previously.

 

[bessie]

"Rush transcript" of that portion of the interview.

NE: (???) tie down that timeline, minute-by-minute, hour-by-hour...How is that coming?

KLEIN: We're getting there. Yeah, we're really getting there at this point. We were able to, yeah, uh, we've expanded the 17 minutes -- (turns to look at associates) and I don't think it's out of bounds to talk about -- we've now expanded the 17 minutes to four hours. And uh, we're in that process right now. We'll be leaving Idaho Falls heading north to finish up two or three interviews that we have to do today, uh, that's going to nail down the timeline a little bit more. At first we thought we were looking at a 17 minute situation, but now through witness interviews, and the countless recants, different stories, and new stories...it's very frustrating for us. So we've had to set some of the investigation over here (gestures with hand), and stick with the first witness, first eyes, first hand testimony.

Starts at about 2:00 in the video.

http://www.eastidahonews.com/2016/01/kunz-private-investigator-responds-to-reinwand-interview/

 

[drjones]

For example, a logical interpretation of his comment would be - "Previously we were taking some witness statements at face value and believed we could not determine exactly where Deorr was for about 17 minutes, now since we have discounted some of those statements we now cannot account for Deorr's precise whereabouts for approximately 4 hours."

 

[Rayemonde]

Where did 17 minutes originally come from? Is that how long the parents said they were at the creek before they went to get DeOrr to show him the minnows, or is it how long they said they searched for DeOrr by themselves before calling 911?

 

[bessie]

So why would it go from 17 minutes to 4 hours?

It's not really clear, and personally, I won't jump to the conclusion that no one had seen DeOrr for four hours.

IMO, he's saying that previously they thought the only unconfirmed window in their timeline was the 17 minutes when no one can account for DeOrr. Because stories have been inconsistent, they're now scrapping an entire four hour window, and starting from scratch.

JMO

 

[Bootsctr]

Where did 17 minutes originally come from? Is that how long the parents said they were at the creek before they went to get DeOrr to show him the minnows, or is it how long they said they searched for DeOrr by themselves before calling 911?

It's in the video Bessie posted earlier with the interview of the parents. DK, Sr. states 17 minutes from when he last saw "little DeOrr" and the minnow and more rambling.....

 

[Aeronomy]

That would make sense to me, but I don't believe we've ever had confirmation of the time of the receipt or that there was a confirmed sighting or surveillance of Deorr Jr. at the store.

I don't know if the time was on the receipt, but based on this interview http://www.localnews8.com/news/3-mo...=social&utm_source=facebook_KIFI_Local_News_8 the sheriff states the time was around 10:30/11:00am that they went to Leadore. The article states the cashier and receipt prove the trip there. Since the sheriff gave a roundabout time, I gather even if there is no time on the receipt the cashier was able to give a good estimated timeframe - or it was realized by other means during the 3 previous months such as going through previous receipts from that register to gain a good approximation of time.

As far as DeOrr being with them . . . there's no confirmation of it, but if the parents said he was with them, then I think that may put all 3 of them in that 4 hour window?

 

[bessie]

I don't know if the time was on the receipt, but based on this interview http://www.localnews8.com/news/3-mo...=social&utm_source=facebook_KIFI_Local_News_8 the sheriff states the time was around 10:30/11:00am that they went to Leadore. The article states the cashier and receipt prove the trip there. Since the sheriff gave a roundabout time, I gather even if there is no time on the receipt the cashier was able to give a good estimated timeframe - or it was realized by other means during the 3 previous months such as going through previous receipts from that register to gain a good approximation of time.

As far as DeOrr being with them . . . there's no confirmation of it, but if the parents said he was with them, then I think that may put all 3 of them in that 4 hour window?

02:45
SB: Now I’m not sure…I don’t recall her saying specifically that she remembered the child. She remembered them talking about their child, and they bought some candy and some other items, and we have a dated and time-stamped receipt, so we know they were in the store. And someone while they were fueling up said they thought they saw a child in the back seat, but that hasn’t been ever positively stated that there was a child there, but ya’ know at this point, I’m believing the family!

03:18
TG: Well, and the thing is, a busy day like that camping, nobody’s going to think, I better remember who’s in the store. It just doesn’t work like that.

03:26
SB: Yeah, exactly. It’s not uncommon. It’s a small community, and uh the salesclerk said she was really busy, and she was having difficulty remembering them being in the store, but when she saw them, she said, Oh, I remember talking to you.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...-**NO-DISCUSSION-quot&p=12122056#post12122056

 

[Rayemonde]

Here at around 9 minutes, Vernal says it was 10 minutes from when they last saw DeOrr to when they realised he was missing.

[video=youtube;mwM1oG3z358]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mwM1oG3z358[/video]

 

[Aeronomy]

A really big question for me right now is whether or not IR had seen DeOrr awake...
It might help answer another question I have as far as if the parents were already looking for a place to hide an already deceased DeOrr while on their way to go camping versus scrambling to find somewhere in a shorter amount of time.

 

[Rayemonde]

I couldn't find a reference to 17 minutes in the interviews with the parents... If anyone finds one, please post where we can find it

 

[bessie]

http://www.eastidahonews.com/2016/01/kunz-private-investigator-responds-to-reinwand-interview/

 

[Rayemonde]

A really big question for me right now is whether or not IR had seen DeOrr awake...
It might help answer another question I have as far as if the parents were already looking for a place to hide an already deceased DeOrr while on their way to go camping versus scrambling to find somewhere in a shorter amount of time.

Wow, that's something I hadn't considered... Taking an already deceased DeOrr to the campground, telling IR and ggp that he's sleeping, then leaving him somewhere and saying he wandered off?! That's... Horrible. Chilling.

 

[bluesneakers]

Here at around 9 minutes, Vernal says it was 10 minutes from when they last saw DeOrr to when they realised he was missing.

[video=youtube;mwM1oG3z358]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mwM1oG3z358[/video]

He sure likes to talk.

 

[Bootsctr]

I couldn't find a reference to 17 minutes in the interviews with the parents... If anyone finds one, please post where we can find it

So sorry! Maybe I dreamed it! fftobed:

 

[Rayemonde]

He sure likes to talk.

I tell you what, when I watched this interview before I was giving the parents the full benefit of the doubt and thinking, he's just so nervous and upset and sleep-deprived about his son, that's why he's waffling and acting srangely.... But watching it again and bearing in mind that the sheriff said they've been less than truthful all along... Wow.

Anybody who is new to the case or hasn't watched the full interview or doesn't understand why people have been suspicious of the parents all along, please do take the time to watch the full interview.


Eta, I did get the impression from watching it again that the filthy, bawling DeOrr was a story they had concocted in advance to make people think that DeOrr was at the store. It seems important to them to make people think they went to the store 'as a family'. This would fit in with the new 4 hour timeline... If DeOrr was already gone when they they went to the store.

So why go to the store?

 

[bluesneakers]

I tell you what, when I watched this interview before I was giving the parents the full benefit of the doubt and thinking, he's just so nervous and upset and sleep-deprived about his son, that's why he's waffling and acting srangely.... But watching it again and bearing in mind that the sheriff said they've been less than truthful all along... Wow.

Anybody who is new to the case or hasn't watched the full interview or doesn't understand why people have been suspicious of the parents all along, please do take the time to watch the full interview.

I did the same thing. I remember not liking him and trying so hard to set that aside, but he is so unpleasant in that interview and he just does not stop talking.

 

[ZooSleuth]

For example, a logical interpretation of his comment would be - "Previously we were taking some witness statements at face value and believed we could not determine exactly where Deorr was for about 17 minutes, now since we have discounted some of those statements we now cannot account for Deorr's precise whereabouts for approximately 4 hours."

I agree. My post on the exact wording was directed at the people who took it to mean that the parents left Deorr unattended for 4 hours.