ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #21

[neesaki]

SB said they searched the vehicles but he was afraid they might have missed a compartment. The only vehicle with enough compartments to have maybe missed one is the camper, IMO.
If they were going under the assumption that Deorr had wandered off when they searched the camper, then it makes sense that they wouldn't have done a "are there any hidden compartments ?" searches.
If the camper was removed from the campground before cadaver dogs were brought in and Deorr was hidden in a covert compartment in the camper there would be no hits.
So...lots of unanswered questions about the camper IMO.

And how much time lapsed after the time the camper left the campground and they did the search, perhaps a more thorough search as you mention.

 

[persimmon]

I would love peoples' thoughts about:

IF the parents do, in fact KNOW where DeOrr is, why WOULDN'T they tell LE (especially after all this time)? I wonder if they've shared things with family they haven't shared with LE?

I doubt they have shared things with family..jmo. Sharing mean involving family in a crime to some degree. Also, I feel the family has been sincere in their desire to search and help JM and VDK. Of course, I am purely speculating but that's my feeling.

I would say reasons for not talking are:

1. Fear of being charged with crime and prison
2. Fear of family and friend judgement/anger/etc
3. Personal shame and denial

All jmho

 

[giagreen]

He stopped talking with LE? I got the impression that he was being quite cooperative.



He's gone back to the campsite with SB, he's taken two polygraphs and he's allowed his home to be searched several times. Yes, he has an attorney, but that doesn't mean he's stopped talking to the police. Do you have a link?

http://www.ksl.com/?sid=36029241&nid=157&fm=most_popular&s_cid=popular-2

At around 8:20 sb says his statements have been pretty consistent but that they also haven't talked to him a whole lot and he got a lawyer. Of course that doesn't mean he stopped cooperating at that time but I'm not sure why els they wouldn't of talked to him more to double check his story.

http://www.eastidahonews.com/2016/01/sheriff-i-just-pray-little-deorr-will-be-found/

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[persimmon]

I'm glad you asked as I've been thinking about this for some time but haven't really found the right opportunity on WebSleuths to share my thoughts (until now, that is!).

Early on in the case I watched social media sites and read comments from Jessica's and Vernal's family and friends and they were downright RABID in nature. Now, don't get me wrong, a lot of the public comments were out of line, but even simple innuendo such as "I dunno, sounds fishy to me" would receive a barrage of hateful comments from the family and friends. Subtle threats like, "it's a good thing you don't live in my state, otherwise..." This gave me the impression that if, let's say, Jessica and/or Vernal "confessed" anything to family, this family would keep this knowledge to themselves and deal with it in their own manner. The family (Jessica included) has had several run ins with the law and have many money judgements against them (it's all public record), so I don't imagine that they have high regard for law enforcement. My feeling is if the family has knowledge of a crime, hell would freeze over before they would give Jessica and Vernal (two of their very own) over to the authorities. JMO.

Do you think they would draw the line with a crime against a child? I sort of thing that would be the difference...almost like the most hardened of criminals do in prison settings. Jmo

 

[SweetT]

Have you ever owned a camper? I have. And so have several of my friends and family, some of whom have made modifications and/or remodeling. You can't tell what is in a camper from the outside, so even if we have a picture, it won't tell us anything about the interior or whether modifications have been made to it. Hidden compartments CAN be incorporated into them. There have been times when we found small areas that we didn't realize existed when we bought a camper. We've talked about making hidden compartments in our own camper (because it would be kinda cool) and how it wouldn't be difficult to do so.

The underneath of some campers are enclosed to help insulate against very cold weather. This is something that could also be modified especially if a person makes changes or repairs to the holding tanks for water and/or sewage. Which is why I asked about the camper. The older it is, the more likely modifications or remodeling has been done.

Personally, I also seriously doubt the camper was used for such an awful purpose, but then again I've read threads here about people who do terrible, awful things like hiding their deceased children in walls, garages, freezers, etc. So it isn't out of the realm of possibility to consider this angle in regards to the camper. It was there, there's the potential ability to hide a child or evidence of a crime until the perpetrator could conveniently dispose of it.

My camper had tons of storage compartments...Like you could take so much stuff in there and have it not seen. We took huge down comforters, dishes, silverware, coffee pots, pots pans groceries, pillows, clothes..

 

[ConcernedCitizenID]

Do you think they would draw the line with a crime against a child? I sort of thing that would be the difference...almost like the most hardened of criminals do in prison settings. Jmo

I would certainly hope so, but who knows? There really is no way of measuring the depth of dysfunction in any one family. What's perfectly normal for you may be total craziness to me. It's amazing what people grow up with and come to think is acceptable. For instance, in my family when my folks were angry with each other, they would give the silent treatment...FOR DAYS ON END. In my husband's family, his parents would shout it out and then move on immediately, no hard feelings.

Life is a strange, bizarre journey, indeed!

 

[SweetT]

In short, because his death was the result of something they had a part in either intentionally or accidentally. If intentional, it's a no-brainer why they aren't talking. If it was accidental, fear that they'd still be prosecuted because of negligence of some sort. Just my short opinion.

Right, without a body, cause of death is going to be hard to prove and after a long period of exposure to elements etc everything is up for the imagination...look at Casey Anthony. Had Caylee been found very shortly after she was killed I think we may have had a whole different out come on that one.

 

[pepelepolecat]

At around 8:20 sb says his statements have been pretty consistent but that they also haven't talked to him a whole lot and he got a lawyer. Of course that doesn't mean he stopped cooperating at that time but I'm not sure why els they wouldn't of talked to him more to double check his story.

http://www.eastidahonews.com/2016/01/sheriff-i-just-pray-little-deorr-will-be-found/

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Well, they may not have talked to him all that much because they just don't feel he has any helpful information. If they searched his home and searched the vehicle he rode in and did two polys, I'm sure they have at least a reasonably good idea of what he does or doesn't know and how he could or couldn't help. I haven't seen or heard anything to indicate he is no longer talking at all to the police. Thanks for the link!

 

[Rayemonde]

I doubt the parents have confessed to family members... But family members probably know them well enough to be suspicious that they are lying. And family members might know if there was any past neglect or abuse of DeOrr, if the parents had made any strange comments such as saying they regretted having kids, if they seemed genuinely grief-stricken after the camping trip and if they really did do everything they could to find DeOrr.

But I agree with Concerned Citizen that the family would probably stick up for the parents and help to protect them.

JMO.

 

[ILOKAL]

And how much time lapsed after the time the camper left the campground and they did the search, perhaps a more thorough search as you mention.

Did Bowerman say LE searched the vehicle that first night? Didn't Vernal say they were with SAR at the campsite until about 4:00 AM on July 11th?

 

[giagreen]

Well, they may not have talked to him all that much because they just don't feel he has any helpful information. If they searched his home and searched the vehicle he rode in and did two polys, I'm sure they have at least a reasonably good idea of what he does or doesn't know and how he could or couldn't help. I haven't seen or heard anything to indicate he is no longer talking at all to the police. Thanks for the link!

Right. That's what I'd think also. But then you add in Kleins comments then I don't believe that's the case.

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[ConcernedCitizenID]

Right. That's what I'd think also. But then you add in Kleins comments then I don't believe that's the case.

I absolutely appreciate Klein's work and the information he has provided the public, but I am personally more willing to believe what law enforcement has to say about the case over Klein (or Vilt, for that matter). LE has named the parents as suspects and said that, thus far, Isaac's story has been the most believable and consistent out of the four POI's. I don't have any reason not to take him at his word. :dunno:

 

[giagreen]

I absolutely appreciate Klein's work and the information he has provided the public, but I am personally more willing to believe what law enforcement has to say about the case over Klein (or Vilt, for that matter). LE has named the parents as suspects and said that, thus far, Isaac's story has been the most believable and consistent out of the four POI's. I don't have any reason not to take him at his word. :dunno:

That's not what I was saying at all or referring to.

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[Rayemonde]

Yeah... Personally I don't see any reason to suspect ggp or IR until LE tell us otherwise.

 

[Rayemonde]

That's not what I was saying at all or referring to.

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What were you saying, then?

 

[ConcernedCitizenID]

That's not what I was saying at all or referring to.

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OK, help me out here...are you referring to when Klein said he thinks Isaac has "direct knowledge" of what happened? If so, my answer is still the same - Klein said that, LE did not and I tend to err on the side of caution and will stick with LE on this one.

 

[Little Ol Me]

Did Bowerman say LE searched the vehicle that first night? Didn't Vernal say they were with SAR at the campsite until about 4:00 AM on July 11th?

NE:, Their vehicles, tents, everything there was probably searched? (First day)

SB. We searched every place a small child could hide, or crawl, climb into.

There was also traking dogs there. I'm more than satisfied the camper was thoroughly searched.
[video=youtube;FV-h82eVQ1M]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FV-h82eVQ1M[/video]

 

[courtneyb]

What if naming the parents suspects was a tactic to try to get them to talk because they suspect One of the others at the campsite was responsible and they thought naming them suspects would make them say, "no, wait... This is what happened...we helped cover it up because..."

They left Deorr with one of them while they were off doing... Whatever.

Or something.

I personally think the parents are responsible directly, but this case is just so frustrating and I'm grasping. [emoji19]


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[Rayemonde]

NE:, Their vehicles, tents, everything there was probably searched? (First day)

SB. We searched every place a small child could hide, or crawl, climb into.

There was also traking dogs there. I'm more than satisfied the camper was thoroughly searched.

I sure hope so, but the sheriff's wording there made me think of the Sylar Taylor and Jaryd Atadero cases where search and rescue did a massive search but failed to find the remains - because they were only looking in places that a toddler could have got by themselves.

 

[Mickshawn]

I'm glad you asked as I've been thinking about this for some time but haven't really found the right opportunity on WebSleuths to share my thoughts (until now, that is!).

Early on in the case I watched social media sites and read comments from Jessica's and Vernal's family and friends and they were downright RABID in nature. Now, don't get me wrong, a lot of the public comments were out of line, but even simple innuendo such as "I dunno, sounds fishy to me" would receive a barrage of hateful comments from the family and friends. Subtle threats like, "it's a good thing you don't live in my state, otherwise..." This gave me the impression that if, let's say, Jessica and/or Vernal "confessed" anything to family, this family would keep this knowledge to themselves and deal with it in their own manner. The family (Jessica included) has had several run ins with the law and have many money judgements against them (it's all public record), so I don't imagine that they have high regard for law enforcement. My feeling is if the family has knowledge of a crime, hell would freeze over before they would give Jessica and Vernal (two of their very own) over to the authorities. JMO.

Good Post!! But what if J and V's confession is the key to finding DeOrr and bringing him in??.....I thought that is what they all want so badly....You mean, they'd leave him out there in the elements all alone forever to save the parents' necks?

I realize this is a huge thing for family (if they, too, are holding info)......It's so emotional I can barely wrap my head around any of it!