Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *mom, stepfather found* #12

[caseface]

I have been down a wormhole learning about the beliefs behind the madness. I'm adjusting my vantage-point on the children. I believe they are in hiding. I think Lori and Chad actually believe these earthquakes/floods are coming in July 2020. The books and beliefs indicate that, at the second coming, the chosen will go to these camps in Rocky Mountains to avoid the catastrophe.

Now, i am sure their personal psychologies are the drivers behind how things are playing out. Perhaps they are not consciously aware that they are being selfish because they have a story that they believe. And that story involves Lori believing she is an important translated being. Now these words aren't psychotic (as i had theorized previously). The belief of translated beings, the coming of the end, having lived previous lives, all come from existing books and beliefs of the AVOW community. She's not making up random stuff. She's getting it from her indoctrination.

If they believe what they are doing enough to take the lives of their spouses, i believe they would stick to the script and send the kids into hiding (unless they are not the chosen). I just don't see any kind of motive for Lori to kill the children. I do see her selling the dog and putting things into storage because they are literally leaving. Doomsday preppers can't bring dogs (another mouth to feed) when the end is coming in a couple of months. They aren't going to need bikes and blankets. They would have to leave behind their most precious things. Perhaps she has an attachment to those things and wants to be able to get them back after the flood or in case there isn't a flood.

Finally, i don't believe the children are deceased because of this: the life insurance policy on CV. No one will say in the media who is actually going to get it. It's clear CV took Lori off but not so sure the Woodcocks were the final beneficiaries. CV likely left it to his children. That way, they get it no matter where they end up. That's the smart thing for him to do. Lori knows this and, without, the child there is no money. She obviously has a need for money, although consciously she believes she is getting the money for the spiritual mission (like Chad perhaps too).

I just don't see a motive in her taking the kids out. I do see, based upon my perusal of their beliefs that the kids are in hiding; however, take this with a grain of salt because anyone crazy enough to take others lives based upon these beliefs are dangerous and the "prophecies" are being updated by a self-proclaimed prophet. Keep in mind, to them, death is just elimination of the veil for some. Alex may have even believed this so much that when he completed his mission, he poisoned himself but it sure looks like everyone who knows anything about what happened to Charles is being disappeared.

MOO

 

[155etta]

Commercial flight would take 3+ hours. Private plane? Similar? Either way, time stamp is 3 hours difference (9:15 to 1:18 p.m. remove 1 hour for Daylight savings time the Idaho was in AZ wasn't in). Commercial flight again has to land in Idaho Falls 40 minutes away. Private (ETA: plane, not jet) could land at Rexburg Municipal 5 minutes away, but we're still grasping at straws - and that's a lot of moving parts to make an alibi for a missed shot.

Yes, lot's of snow. Hazardous weather conditions. Well below freezing and some days below 0˚F.

And honestly, where would they even begin to look without some GPS info. There is SO much desolate wide open space here, not to mention woods, water....

 

[squareandrabbet]

I think it's concerning. She's hiding her tail before she's even begun. She's taken JJ out of a supportive environment and plonked him straight into a new school which doesn't appear to be a special-needs school from what I can see. I imagine the adjustment process would have been a big issue for him, new bed, new house, new town, no dad, no Bailey, no face-timing with Kay and Larry, or Colby, no familiar teachers or friends. And then she's taken him right back out again.

My guess is she put him there to keep him out of her way all day, while she was busy, with no intention of keeping him there or of the school getting his records and finding out about his education plan and his family history. I expect we will find out they were pressuring her for information and she was stalling and then didn't need them any more, they'd fulfilled her purpose. He knew he was going away already, so it wasn't the homeschooling lie she gave. And then she got the lock-up within a week.

I don't think it's a custody issue. She would have treated him better if she wanted him. Her January 2019 disappearing act shows how she felt about him, and getting rid of Bailey. Her gripes about JJ in her police interview also.

The picture is building.

MOO

Thanks, that's much clearer than I had been doing/thinking. I was surprised she didn't just pull him out without saying anything; but maybe the school needed to be told something and she couldn't get out of it? I was thinking, it probably wasn't her conscience poking her to write such a letter, as she seems to have none. Maybe she was afraid that a member of staff was going to see her going about her business around town at some later date, and ask questions?

 

[Deerrun]

<

The recent article's wording leaves a lot to be desired, clarity-wise. "“The person [Brandon] recognized, the person he suspected was the person who did the shooting was the same person who killed Charles Vallow,” Robertson said." But further down we get "he suspected Charles Vallows' killer, Alex Cox, was the one driving that jeep.” So which is it, did he recognize or suspect? One is you saw, the other is you guessed. Still trying to put the timelines together in a way that makes sense. Either Brandon was wrong, or maybe the time on the storage cams was? Or, he did some really amazing time management where he shot at Brandon, sped to the airport, dashed through security to barely make a flight to Idaho Falls, and then drove really fast to Rexburg to immediately start going through the storage unit. Is there a place you could verify past flight times so we can put to rest if it was actually possible for him to

Yes, this stood out to me too me too. It sounds like BB assumed it was Alex

 

[indicolite22]

Or, he did some really amazing time management where he shot at Brandon, sped to the airport, dashed through security to barely make a flight to Idaho Falls, and then drove really fast to Rexburg to immediately start going through the storage unit. Is there a place you could verify past flight times so we can put to rest if it was actually possible for him to fly commercial?

The timeframe was just too short. Calculations have been done a few times:

Commercial flight would take 3+ hours. Private plane? Similar? Either way, time stamp is 3 hours difference (9:15 to 1:18 p.m. remove 1 hour for Daylight savings time the Idaho was in AZ wasn't in). Commercial flight again has to land in Idaho Falls 40 minutes away. Private (ETA: plane, not jet) could land at Rexburg Municipal 5 minutes away, but we're still grasping at straws - and that's a lot of moving parts to make an alibi for a missed shot.

 

[Hippononymous]

I have been down a wormhole learning about the beliefs behind the madness. I'm adjusting my vantage-point on the children. I believe they are in hiding. I think Lori and Chad actually believe these earthquakes/floods are coming in July 2020. The books and beliefs indicate that, at the second coming, the chosen will go to these camps in Rocky Mountains to avoid the catastrophe.

I just don't see any kind of motive for Lori to kill the children.

MOO

I mostly agree with you and think the children are alive somewhere.

However, I also go back to what her motive could be, and that motive is if they know too much about the death toll surrounding the family.

 

[josephinemarch]

Did she know she wasn't the beneficiary? That might have been a nasty surprise. Jmo

You’d think since CV was scared for his own life, a good move would be to MAKE SURE she knew that she was no longer the beneficiary. Does anyone know where it is documented that’s she didn’t know she was no longer the beneficiary?

 

[nopynono]

What I find particularly ironic is that Lori was a hairdresser, when she worked at all. Finding a new job in that profession usually doesn't require moving to another state (especially to a small town in Idaho). So I don't know why she thought it was a good line to use. Or was she telling people she had some other line of work?

I would think something else, she said she got a promotion. What would a hairdresser even get promoted to?

 

[indicolite22]

I mostly agree with you and think the children are alive somewhere.

However, I also go back to what her motive could be, and that motive is if they know too much about the death toll surrounding the family.

Them knowing too much would be a motive for silencing them forever, not keeping them alive.

 

[caseface]

I mostly agree with you and think the children are alive somewhere.

However, I also go back to what her motive could be, and that motive is if they know too much about the death toll surrounding the family.

True. That is definitely a motive if they witnessed anything. From what i understand, there are allegedly networks for hiding in the last days, which have been in preparation for decades, maybe longer. If they are in as deep as they appear to be, they surely have a way to get the children into hiding. And the people taking care of them would never give that information up. They really believe the end is coming. It is interesting, however, that Lori's role in this takes her to Hawaii to wait it out while the kids rough it in the mountains (if any of this is true)

 

[caseface]

Them knowing too much would be a motive for silencing them forever, not keeping them alive.

Unless CV made the beneficiary their child. If that's the case she would have found out after and would do anything to hold on to the child so that she could get that 1 million because the one who has legal custody would get that money.

 

[Hippononymous]

DBM

 

[b2alicia]

Hi Sleuthers, I'm sure I just missed this somehow, but I've been looking for the news report, etc, describing how Lori and Chad were found in Hawaii. But I can't find it. I did see that chilling video of the storage locker, and her letter to JJ's school, but I haven't found anything about them being located in Hawaii. Is there a link, please? Thank you!

 

[tresir2012]

Wow, thanks... some interesting insights indeed, from Brandon's PI, as follows:

“Lori Vallow certainly got Melani involved in this," Robertson said. "By all accounts, the Vallow and the Boudreaux marriages were all idyllic. They were loving couples, they had picture-perfect families. They were like something out of a magazine until they got involved in this kind of cult situation and things started going off the rails.”

That so-called cult centered around Melani Boudreaux and Lori Vallow's religious beliefs, which focused on doomsday ideology. It was through those beliefs Lori Vallow first came in contact with Chad Daybell.

“Chad Daybell was someone who was involved in Lori Vallow’s life for some time – a year or two prior,” Robertson said.

“Some of their beliefs about apocalyptic end times and they all got kind of sucked into this belief system and Chad Daybell seemed to be a leader in that group,” he continued.

Eventually, Lori Vallow, Melani Boudreaux and Cox would all move to Rexburg where Chad Daybell was living.

[...]

While it's too complex for him to have a theory about what happened, Robertson believes it's all centered around their religious beliefs.

“Some of their writings suggested they were going to get rid of their spouses who were non-believers,” he said. "The struggle for all of us is trying to put a rational explanation on irrational acts.”​

When asked if he believes JJ and Tylee are still alive, Robertson said he hopes so.

(He also says that he surveilled them in Rexburg for a while before the police did their welfare check; and did not see either JJ or Tylee during this surveillance.)

This is confirming that MB did move to Rexburg, so that 'sister' reference is confirmed as her IMO. Was Alex and his partner in this prepper group too? This guy seems to indicate that, otherwise why would he move to Rexburg? Makes sense for MB as her new partner was there but why Alex too?

 

[nopynono]

(He also says that he surveilled them in Rexburg for a while before the police did their welfare check; and did not see either JJ or Tylee during this surveillance.)

That to me says this guy isnt that great at his job. He said he saw the moving van get loaded to go to ID, but didnt see the kids there at all. We know the kids were in ID at first by the neighbors account and the schools account. (I've even seen parents say that JJ was in their childs class in ID). Perhaps he meant that he saw them there, and then didnt see them for some time before the welfare check, but the poor wording leaves some doubt.

 

[tresir2012]

In my very humble opinion I don't think the male seen with Lori at the storage unit on Oct 2nd was Alex. The footage is difficult to analyze, but that male seems to be much taller than Lori. It doesn't appear that he is wearing a baseball cap like the other, shorter male we see later. He also walks much slower than the second male, kind of lumbering where the second male walks faster. Comparing photos, Chad seems to be much taller than Lori but Alex is only slightly taller. This is all in my opinion only, would love some additional eyes on it. @RexburgSleuth, was Chad known to wear or not wear baseball caps?

Also, I don't think we are seeing everything in the storage unit. The storage unit that Lori rented was 10x10, the images put out by East Idaho News show a much smaller space. The bikes barely fit. MOO

I think it is likely they have moved the stuff to a smaller unit as nobody is paying for it anymore.

Could someone post the stills of the videos with dates and times so we can compare a bit easier?

 

[indicolite22]

This is what bothers me. From the allegations of CV that she didn’t want to be a mom anymore, she could have divorced him, and left JJ in the care of CV. She could have sent TR to live with CR! She could have still married CD, maybe he could have divorced his wife (rather than what we think happened). They could be in Hawaii, on their honeymoon, without kids, but here’s the huge plus in this scenario: no missing kids! No deceased ex husbands and brothers!! No self imposed house arrest! Imagine that. You could have had everything you want, without making anyone disappear!

She wasn’t the beneficiary to CV’s insurance, so money wasn’t a motive.. I just don’t see how orchestrating his death could help her, one bit. Guess she is completely deluded, antisocial, sociopathic, and truly believed her ex needed to die. ?!?
ETA MOO

Money was the motive with both Lori and Chad. IMO Lori didn't know that she wasn't the beneficiary of Charles' life insurance policy, and Chad took out a policy on Tammy.

 

[BigAl16]

Is it still very snowy in Rexburg? Does anyone think the police will start searching for traces of the kids in places local to where they were last seen?

Anyone who can stay inside in eastern Idaho right now is staying inside. The kids are out for snow days. I don't know about Rexburg specifically, but know it is generally worse in this kind of weather than some of the other towns in the region (the clear exception being the Teton Valley east of Rexburg which gets it worse).

 

[caseface]

I just found out that Idaho, Arizona, and Texas are what is referred to as a "Community Property State" as it pertains to life insurance. From my cursory understanding, spouses MUST be named beneficiary to life insurance. If you want to name someone other than the spouse, you must get them (the spouse) to grant permission in writing. So, even though CV may have named the Woodcocks beneficiary, the law would not honor without Lori's approval or.... a divorce.

Does anyone know more about Life Insurance on this forum. MOO

 

[squareandrabbet]

This is confirming that MB did move to Rexburg, so that 'sister' reference is confirmed as her IMO. Was Alex and his partner in this prepper group too? This guy seems to indicate that, otherwise why would he move to Rexburg? Makes sense for MB as her new partner was there but why Alex too?

Yeah, I'd believe that Brandon's PI knows the movements of Melani in particular, since she is whom he was primarily hired to shadow; and this doesn't seem like information so juicy and potentially damning that he would be unfavorably slanting it in favor of Brandon either. It's pretty much just a plain recitation of facts.

That to me says this guy isnt that great at his job. He said he saw the moving van get loaded to go to ID, but didnt see the kids there at all. We know the kids were in ID at first by the neighbors account and the schools account. (I've even seen parents say that JJ was in their childs class in ID). Perhaps he meant that he saw them there, and then didnt see them for some time before the welfare check, but the poor wording leaves some doubt.

Granted, he did not mention how long he was there surveilling; just that he had gone to Rexburg. 48 hours vs. 7 days, for example, makes a difference.