Found Deceased IL - Andrew Freund, 5, Crystal Lake, 17 April 2019 *Arrests* - #3

[Thora_Jay]

Do you have a list of meds prescribed to her?
Tysm

I posted the 2 prescriptions she said were stolen. No clue what else she took.

I would not know a list of her medications, only the 2 she told the Officers. She did not mention any others.

Adderall and Suboxin both bottles with her name and info on them.

 

[Trudie]

When my kids were prescribed medications, it was still in their names. Even though I was the adult that picked them up and paid for them, the prescriptions were in their names, even when they were toddlers.

Right.
I’m curious about the Rx JC had.
Very dangerous to use Suboxone & Adderal, as my earlier link explains.
I’ve searched for a list of JC’s meds, but can’t find any info except the theft report. Idk how or why her prescribed meds would be released to the public.
AJ & P were both in the age range for Adderal to be prescribed.
Tysm

 

[Trudie]

I posted the 2 prescriptions she said were stolen. No clue what else she took.

I would not know a list of her medications, only the 2 she told the Officers. She did not mention any others.

Adderall and Suboxin both bottles with her name and info on them.

Right, I read police report, I missed her name was on both. Ty

 

[kaen]

How would a child who was not even in school yet, be prescribed adderal? How would they treat such a young child for ADHD? And why?

Isn't adrenal for helping someone get their work done and their tasks done, without being confused and distracted? I am not sure why a young child , who was not yet in school, would need addrral.

Adderall is an amphetamine. I would think that she would be the one taking it more so than him.

Although I have seen Adderall (in various forms) used with school age children predominantly, I do know that there are children who wind up on medication before they turn school age. Usually, younger children on it are in a program(s) and need it for focus or behavioral adjustments (not touching others, sitting still, working on projects). It is less common that a 4-5 year old not in a structured program would be given Adderrall as opposed to Ritalin for ADD/ADHD. Most doctors start with Ritalin as it is the granddaddy of these medications. Kids who are dx'd at an early age usually have severe symptoms or a parent who struggles with behaviorally modifying problem behaviors. More and more doctors are trying to manage younger children's behaviors through play/talk therapy and giving parents tools to manage the issues and stressors they have.

If he was medicated for ADD/ADHD, he would have to be seen for follow ups every 6 months or so.

 

[Thora_Jay]

Right.
I’m curious about the Rx JC had.
Very dangerous to use Suboxone & Adderal, as my earlier link explains.
I’ve searched for a list of JC’s meds, but can’t find any info except the theft report. Idk how or why her prescribed meds would be released to the public.
AJ & P were both in the age range for Adderal to be prescribed.
Tysm

BBM
As I said, I listened to the communications from 12/18/18.

I just tried to edit this and I cannot fix it the bold is supposed to be just what I am responding to on Trudie’s post. Now everything I am typing here is bolder. I hate trying to post from my phone.

 

[katydid23]

Adderall is an amphetamine. I would think that she would be the one taking it more so than him.

Although I have seen Adderall (in various forms) used with school age children predominantly, I do know that there are children who wind up on medication before they turn school age. Usually, younger children on it are in a program(s) and need it for focus or behavioral adjustments (not touching others, sitting still, working on projects). It is less common that a 4-5 year old not in a structured program would be given Adderrall as opposed to Ritalin for ADD/ADHD. Most doctors start with Ritalin as it is the granddaddy of these medications. Kids who are dx'd at an early age usually have severe symptoms or a parent who struggles with behaviorally modifying problem behaviors. More and more doctors are trying to manage younger children's behaviors through play/talk therapy and giving parents tools to manage the issues and stressors they have.

If he was medicated for ADD/ADHD, he would have to be seen for follow ups every 6 months or so.

YES, that's what I am saying. AJ was apparently not in an organised school program yet. So I dont see him being tested for ADHD.

I used to work in an elementary school, and there was a pre-K attached to our campus. One of my jobs was to sit in the nurses' office on the 2 days she was not there, and help administer the medications. It was primarily Ritalin and we also helped kids check their blood sugar.

There were a few Kindergarten kids on ADHD meds---but even then there was controversy about them being on it so young.

I just can't see AJ's mom being able to get him tested and prescribed meds when he hadn't even been in an organised school setting yet. The parents who succeeded had to prove to the doctors that their kids were unable to sit still and follow instructions in class.

JMO

 

[Thora_Jay]

Right, I read police report, I missed her name was on both. Ty

It was not on the report. It was in the police communications. I went back to the 12/18 audio transmissions today and posted what was said. It was about 2 hours of communications. Including her arrest on that date and the police taking the children to the station and then to child services. I only posted a few things from the burglary.

 

[Trudie]

YES, that's what I am saying. AJ was apparently not in an organised school program yet. So I dont see him being tested for ADHD.

I used to work in an elementary school, and there was a pre-K attached to our campus. One of my jobs was to sit in the nurses' office on the 2 days she was not there, and help administer the medications. It was primarily Ritalin and we also helped kids check their blood sugar.

There were a few Kindergarten kids on ADHD meds---but even then there was controversy about them being on it so young.

I just can't see AJ's mom being able to get him tested and prescribed meds when he hadn't even been in an organised school setting yet. The parents who succeeded had to prove to the doctors that their kids were unable to sit still and follow instructions in class.

JMO

I understand completely. At the same time, I can’t see a doctor writing a heroin addict Adderal. They use it to counter heroin, allowing them to double up on heroin usage. Extremely dangerous. With the Casper system, pharmacists catch skeptical prescriptions.
As far as AJ not being tested, idk. From what I’ve read, I think she considered him a problem child, moo. Therefore, I would not be surprised if she had his doctor prescribe Adderal or Ritalin.
The AAP diagnoses at age 4.
https://www.webmd.com/add-adhd/childhood-adhd/features/adhd-in-preschoolers#1
Furthermore, kids born to women that used opioids during pregnancy have a high rate of ADHD.
Behavior and Attention Problems in Eight-Year-Old Children with Prenatal Opiate and Poly-Substance Exposure: A Longitudinal Study

 

[Trudie]

It was not on the report. It was in the police communications. I went back to the 12/18 audio transmissions today and posted what was said. It was about 2 hours of communications. Including her arrest on that date and the police taking the children to the station and then to child services.

Gotcha, I’m going to listen in a few minutes, tysm.

 

[katydid23]

Right.
I’m curious about the Rx JC had.
Very dangerous to use Suboxone & Adderal, as my earlier link explains.
I’ve searched for a list of JC’s meds, but can’t find any info except the theft report. Idk how or why her prescribed meds would be released to the public.
AJ & P were both in the age range for Adderal to be prescribed.
Tysm

But if it was prescribed to AJ, it would have HIS name on the prescription, not hers.

 

[BlinkOfAnI]

Gotcha, I’m going to listen in a few minutes, tysm.

Would you mind sharing the link? I just caught up on the last couple days and there seems to be some confusion on what is verifiable fact (link provided) and what is conjecture/rumor when it comes to medication used by JC. I must have missed it. TIA

 

[kaen]

I understand completely. At the same time, I can’t see a doctor writing a heroin addict Adderal. They use it to counter heroin, allowing them to double up on heroin usage. Extremely dangerous. With the Casper system, pharmacists catch skeptical prescriptions.
As far as AJ not being tested, idk. From what I’ve read, I think she considered him a problem child, moo. Therefore, I would not be surprised if she had his doctor prescribe Adderal or Ritalin.
The AAP diagnoses at age 4.
https://www.webmd.com/add-adhd/childhood-adhd/features/adhd-in-preschoolers#1
Furthermore, kids born to women that used opioids during pregnancy have a high rate of ADHD.
Behavior and Attention Problems in Eight-Year-Old Children with Prenatal Opiate and Poly-Substance Exposure: A Longitudinal Study

Yes, as young as 4 can get a dx. It would be hard for them to get a dx without him having more than 2 people evaluating his behavior (scale tests used to measure behavior in relation to the condition). I can't be sure at all b/c I didn't know him. It would be a stretch though, imo. No doubt the terategenic effects of opiod/poly-substance use are present in children and are seen as potentially causal to behavioral issues. If this was the case, not only is it one more way that poor AJ got abused by his mom but also another issue that could have made him the target of her ire.

 

[kaen]

It was not on the report. It was in the police communications. I went back to the 12/18 audio transmissions today and posted what was said. It was about 2 hours of communications. Including her arrest on that date and the police taking the children to the station and then to child services. I only posted a few things from the burglary.

Thank you for doing so much leg work and listening.

 

[Trudie]

But if it was prescribed to AJ, it would have HIS name on the prescription, not hers.

I know. I have not seen the Rx bottle to know if it was in her name or not.
It is moo that Adderal was not prescribed to her, a known heroin addict. I’m on hold with my local big box pharmacy, I’m going to ask the pharmacist his opinion, only for my self satisfaction.
I know an Rx bears the name of the patient, not a parent.
IMO, if, IF a doctor prescribed Suboxone & Adderall to JC, he’s in big trouble & the “I didn’t know what I was doing” excuse will be her defense, backed by science.

 

[Shadowtrix]

Gotcha, I’m going to listen in a few minutes, tysm.

Sorry if it's been posted already but where can I listen to this?

 

[Thora_Jay]

You are so very welcome Kaen you made my day! Big cyber hug to you. I truly appreciate the fact that you took the time to tell me that.

It was a long 2 hours listening lol. It is the best subscription service I have ever paid for. I have had that for many years and it is very handy.

Gotta hit the sack to get up at 3 am to get ready for my 10 hour work day oh boy.

 

[gitana1]

YES, that's what I am saying. AJ was apparently not in an organised school program yet. So I dont see him being tested for ADHD.

I used to work in an elementary school, and there was a pre-K attached to our campus. One of my jobs was to sit in the nurses' office on the 2 days she was not there, and help administer the medications. It was primarily Ritalin and we also helped kids check their blood sugar.

There were a few Kindergarten kids on ADHD meds---but even then there was controversy about them being on it so young.

I just can't see AJ's mom being able to get him tested and prescribed meds when he hadn't even been in an organised school setting yet. The parents who succeeded had to prove to the doctors that their kids were unable to sit still and follow instructions in class.

JMO

I don't know. There's a whole racket with shifty doctors who are no better than drug pushers. Drug addicts know who to go to. They make a lot of money giving out prescriptions to addicts.

The ex of a client of mine is an opiate addict. When he started dating her she quickly took him to her dealer's doctor who prescribed her suboxone and Norcos and prescribed him Norcos. These are totally healthy people in their 20's.

 

[BlinkOfAnI]

YES, that's what I am saying. AJ was apparently not in an organised school program yet. So I dont see him being tested for ADHD.

I used to work in an elementary school, and there was a pre-K attached to our campus. One of my jobs was to sit in the nurses' office on the 2 days she was not there, and help administer the medications. It was primarily Ritalin and we also helped kids check their blood sugar.

There were a few Kindergarten kids on ADHD meds---but even then there was controversy about them being on it so young.

I just can't see AJ's mom being able to get him tested and prescribed meds when he hadn't even been in an organised school setting yet. The parents who succeeded had to prove to the doctors that their kids were unable to sit still and follow instructions in class.

JMO

Agree. While there are exceptions to the rule a doctor prescribing medication for a pediatric diagnosis of ADD/ADHD etc generally includes a teacher/s to fill out paperwork in reference to a child's observed behavior. Also general RE: prescriptions by law have the actual name of the person they are prescribed to regardless of age.

 

[BlinkOfAnI]

I don't know. There's a whole racket with shifty doctors who are no better than drug pushers. Drug addicts know who to go to. They make a lot of money giving out prescriptions to addicts.

The ex of a client of mine is an opiate addict. When he started dating her she quickly took him to her dealer's doctor who prescribed her suboxone and Norcos and prescribed him Norcos. These are totally healthy people in their 20's.

That is the truth! And those doctor names are well known as they come up time after time in PSI's.

 

[Trudie]

Idk how it got so misinterpreted that anyone thinks an Rx is in the name of any person other than the patient.
I questioned was the Adderal for AJ or JC, of course JC made the police report. An Rx could belong to anyone in the household & be stolen, or reported as stolen, by the reporting person.