IL-Chicago Police Officer Says She Feared Using Gun While Being Beaten Oct. 2016

[human]

I thought PCP was passe.

What's up with that? 2 exremes. Heroin puts you to sleep and PCP makes you manic.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

Depends on the dose. Small doses can calm you. High doses have a much different effect.

http://drugabuse.com/library/the-effects-of-pcp-use/

A low dose of PCP between 1 and 5 mg will lead to symptoms including:

Numbness and relaxation.
A sense of well-being and euphoria.
Problems concentrating.
Slurred speech.
Loss of motor coordination.
Misperceptions of abilities including strength, speed, and invulnerability.
Odd, erratic, or unexpected behaviors.

Someone witnessing the effects of PCP use may observe the person staring blankly or showing rapid eye movements. In some cases, the person using PCP will be perfectly still for long periods without responding to stimulation.
A higher dose of PCP can lead to other effects including:

Seeing things that are not present.
Hearing things that are not there.
Delusions of grandeur with inflated sense of importance.
Higher blood pressure and heart rate.
Breathing problems.
Raised body temperature.
Anxiety, panic, and feeling extreme worry.

 

[ohreally]

How could someone not respond to 20 tazes and all of that pepper mace? Is there proof of that?

Its just my opinion, but I think the first report of being tazed 20 times is a misprint in the paper. Since the first report I have read two times and several times in other articles.
From what I have read it only takes a second to reload a taser so I guess it is possible, but I do question the first reporting.
Does anyone know if it has been mentioned by any official at a presser how many times he was tazed?

 

[JohnPaul]

When those who protect and serve us feel they are unable to protect themselves we are in big trouble folks.

i am not really surprised it has come to this,

LE officers have basically been raped of their abilities to protect both themselves and the public,

that power has now been given to the criminals, and IMO its only going to get worse

 

[ohreally]

This isn't the first time a law enforcement officer didn't respond to protect themselves because of the "Ferguson effect". In August 2015 a detective hesitated because of the headlines. He was beaten with his own gun. Lucky he wasn't shot by his own gun.
It is quite scary to think an officer is willing to give up thier life in a justified shooting to protect thier family and community from those that will riot, burn parts of the city and threaten the officers family. Facts mean nothing to these rioters.

 

[Caffeine]

This is sad on so many levels.

Officers are now risking death/ permanent impediments just because they are scared of using a gun on someone, likely with a lengthy rap sheet, who is savagely beating them...

All because the scrutiny will be on them.

It's unfortunate that things are starting to favor criminals these days.

 

[Dogface]

Also, for those asking about where are the cases of people protesting justified shootings when a cop has been beat....as someone who has trained extensively in gun self defense, you are suppose to use your gun before the threat reaches you, once someone is attacking you, it's very difficult to regain the upper hand, or to safely get your weapon out and use it effectively if you are under direct physical violence. How are you suppose to pull your weapon, and discharge it, while having someone punch you?

 

[K_Z]

The extraordinary tragedy here is that this perp is still alive and drawing air.

He should be dead. His actions, IMO, mean that he deserves to be dead. His death during this "violent encounter" would actually BE justice, not just "justifiable", IMO. I hate that we are going to waste any more tax dollars on this piece of filth, with his rap sheet a mile long, and waves of victims.

IMO, his life, as he has chosen to live it, has absolutely no value at all, not even to him. I will never apologize for feeling that way. Yes, the officer's lives ARE more valuable than his, IMO-- tremendously more valuable. Police officers are very expensive, highly trained ASSETS. They have a duty to protect their own lives, as well as a duty and a responsibility to protect their partners and the law abiding public. And that means not hesitating to use deadly force in necessary circumstances.

That said, none of these 3 officers involved can ever work on the streets again, IMO. They are simply too dangerous to their partners, and the general public, because they hesitated to use deadly force when it was very clearly warranted. They have lost their ability to make appropriate decisions in very dangerous and violent situations, and no longer are willing to use deadly force to protect themselves or others. They have all exhibited a combat stress reaction that renders them unfit for further duty, IMO. Maybe they could fly a desk for a while, but they can't ever be in a position to carry out street level policing in these war torn neighborhoods again.

Make no mistake-- street level police officers in these horrible and deadly areas are combatants, just the same as military soldiers in a war zone, IMO. Hesitation and restraint, when deadly force is needed and necessary, is fatal to themselves, their partners, and the public. It's safer to be a military infantry soldier, than it is to be a police officer in these deadly, violent, criminal-infested areas we euphemistically call "neighborhoods."

Hopefully, P. Huffs will be let out of jail and/ or prison quickly, so that he can rapidly become one of the fatal Chicago gang shooting statistics. Because it's clear that policing, the justice system, and the city administrative system, has utterly and completely failed P. Huffs, and the citizens of Chicago, especially in these gang warfare areas.

I'm glad the officers are still alive. They need to be offered a disability retirement, full medical for life, and released back to their families. Hopefully, they are young enough to choose a new career, IMO.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

Holdup. She is a 17 year veteran of the force with an impeccable record. I'm not sure her hanging up her badge is the answer.

JMO

 

[human]

Since the other partners were close enough to taze, why did they not shoot him in the arm or leg?

 

[bluesneakers]

I thought PCP was passe.

What's up with that? 2 exremes. Heroin puts you to sleep and PCP makes you manic.

Isn't that the type of mixture that killed John Belushi?

 

[Caffeine]

Since the other partners were close enough to taze, why did they not shoot him in the arm or leg?

Shooting to maim or scare is discouraged in any firearm training.

No guarantee they'll hit a small target under duress, and even so it's unlikely to deter the assailant.

She was clearly hesitant about shooting, last thing she wants is a slightly wounded attacker snatching an unholstered gun from her.

 

[Dogface]

Since the other partners were close enough to taze, why did they not shoot him in the arm or leg?

Because it's a ridiculously dangerous thing to do. Do you have any gun shooting experience? I train weekly, and wouldn't feel confident, with a handgun, shooting for someone's arm or leg while they were on top of another person beating them. Also, /$9@58!( an arm or leg doesn't necessarily stop a person.

 

[K_Z]

Holdup. She is a 17 year veteran of the force with an impeccable record. I'm not sure her hanging up her badge is the answer.

JMO

I'm not AT ALL suggesting she or the other officers should be fired.

To the contrary, they should be decorated, and offered full retirement, with benefits. Maybe, perhaps, they could "fly a desk" for a while, and be assigned to permanent non-patrol status. But the circumstances of this situation mean that if I were their supervisor, I could never be sure how they would react in similar situations in the future. And now their names are known on the streets, so they would be perpetual targets for hits for more criminal violence. And assigning them as a partner to another officer could expose the department to other serious difficulties, including lawsuits. It's more than possible that other officers would be reluctant to be their partner.

Decorate them, give them a retirement package, or some kind of separation compensation, along with full medical for life. That would be a very just, fair compensation for everyone, IMO.

 

[K_Z]

Because it's a ridiculously dangerous thing to do. Do you have any gun shooting experience? I train weekly, and wouldn't feel confident, with a handgun, shooting for someone's arm or leg while they were on top of another person beating them. Also, /$9@58!( an arm or leg doesn't necessarily stop a person.

Yes-- remember the Philly officer shot 3 times in the left arm and shoulder at point blank range with a .9mm by the criminal terrorist in arab clothing? The officer got out of the patrol car, and CHASED the perp, shooting the perp in the back and butt, before the perp was able to be taken into custody. You shoot center mass, at least two shots (double tap), or a head shot if very, very sure of your target and backstop, and you're competent at that distance. You never let a violent, attacking perp close the last 20 feet. Your life depends on shooting to kill, never to maim or wound.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/01/08/us/philadelphia-police-officer-shot/

 

[Tawny]

Question for those following more closely than I am: Did she and/or her partner speak to the media or is the information coming through a police spokesperson?

I'm curious how the media got hold of this particular story.

 

[Dogface]

Yes-- remember the Philly officer shot 3 times in the left arm and shoulder at point blank range with a .9mm by the criminal terrorist in arab clothing? The officer got out of the patrol car, and CHASED the perp, shooting the perp in the back and butt, before the perp was able to be taken into custody. You shoot center mass, at least two shots (double tap), or a head shot if very, very sure of your target and backstop, and you're competent at that distance. You never let a violent, attacking perp close the last 20 feet. Your life depends on shooting to kill, never to maim or wound.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/01/08/us/philadelphia-police-officer-shot/

Got to love Tueller for his research on this! Reactionary gap is real and can get people killed.

ETA: not sure what happened with my previous post but all the symbols should of spelled out shooting** but it's too late for me to edit that

 

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

Got to love Tueller for his research on this! Reactionary gap is real and can get people killed.

ETA: not sure what happened with my previous post but all the symbols should of spelled out shooting** but it's too late for me to edit that

Some references for those unfamiliar with Tueller...

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tueller_Drill

http://www.discovery.com/tv-shows/mythbusters/videos/duel-dilemmas/


Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk

 

[CoolJ]

Question for those following more closely than I am: Did she and/or her partner speak to the media or is the information coming through a police spokesperson?

I'm curious how the media got hold of this particular story.

No we haven't heard directly from her or her colleagues. This was a point I was trying to make earlier. I believe we heard from a Superintendent and a union guy.

 

[bluesneakers]

No we haven't heard directly from her or her colleagues. This was a point I was trying to make earlier. I believe we heard from a Superintendent and a union guy.

Do you know if the story broke with injured officer, or with injured officer who said she was afraid to fire her weapon?