IL IL - John Spira, 45, DuPage County, 23 Feb 2007

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McNeil said her brother was also on the outs with his business partner, David Stubben. Spira borrowed a large sum of money from the cable construction company he owned with Stubben, McNeil said, and his partner was “upset” and “angry” about it.

http://patch.com/illinois/shorewood...piras-family-friends-fail-to-intere1d98c724f0


I don't recall reading that John had borrowed a large sum of money from his business partner. That opens up some more questions. How long prior to his disappearance did he borrow the money? Was there an investigation as to how the money was spent? Could John finance a disappearance with that money? Or, was the money used to fund his divorce proceedings?

Why would disappearing John benefit his business partner if John owed him a large sum of money?

And of course I am still interested knowing how the divorce settlement was going to affect the business. Especially if John's then soon to be ex owned half the building in which the business operated with DS's wife.

Was the fire set to recoup money John owed DS? Or to cover up a crime?


lots more questions........

I also wonder if John's divorce lawyer was ever interviewed by LE.

:thinking:
 
not sure of theis questioned was asked and answered but-----where were John's guitars and equipment? He was going to dinner and then play with the band........did he have to return home to get his things? Did he have them in the truck or were they already at the venue????? Someone dropping them off or transporting them??? Just a thought-----I think the business partner knows ALOT-------the program mentioned business financial trouble---was that ever clarified? Trouble making payroll, not able to pay company health insurance or employee taxes or something as simple as "counting the paperclips" (slight belt-tightening).....
 
Hi cawfee (Hi hot doesn't sound right ;) ), welcome to the board. I'm not sure about the equipment, it may have been with the band. I agree with you that the business partner knows a lot. I don't remember about financial issues with the company, I thought his sister said everything was in good shape, maybe I'll re-watch the episode. I read the 'Patch' article referenced by Cubby, and remembered hearing some statements about John owing money to the business, but I'm pretty sure I later read something where his sister addressed that and stated it was not true, just a rumor put out there by the business partner. I'll have to research that.
 
Sorry to double post here is an article where Stephanie (John's sister) talks about the debt idea>> http://patch.com/illinois/shorewood...partner-told-stories-of-million-dolacf9d00c3b The partner is essentially co-president of the business and he's not sure if money is missing ?! Also here it says she brings up a debt that may have angered the parner>> http://patch.com/illinois/shorewood-il/missing-st-charles-man-john-spiras-sister-wont-quit-on-case That the essence of it. There is also a long facebook post with its own url if you Google 'I just posted this John Spira' although I can't link it. So it looks like she thinks there is a debt, but its odd that the business partner isn't definite on that.
 
snowleopard said:
Sorry to double post here is an article where Stephanie (John's sister) talks about the debt idea>> http://patch.com/illinois/shorewood...partner-told-stories-of-million-dolacf9d00c3b The partner is essentially co-president of the business and he's not sure if money is missing ?! Also here it says she brings up a debt that may have angered the parner>> http://patch.com/illinois/shorewood-il/missing-st-charles-man-john-spiras-sister-wont-quit-on-case That the essence of it. There is also a long facebook post with its own url if you Google 'I just posted this John Spira' although I can't link it. So it looks like she thinks there is a debt, but its odd that the business partner isn't definite on that.
Click to expand...

Thank you, snowleopard! I had missed the information you linked back when it was originally posted. I read all of it, and it sounds like the theory regarding John owing money coincides with the business burning down. Odd, really odd. It makes me more suspicious of the business partner. Especially if what is alleged, about his drinking, is true. Too many contradictions there. It is good to know John's case might have been reviewed by a Grand Jury.

..... more thinking outloud. It's a good thing there is no statute of limitations on arson in Illinois. We all have read msm articles about the fire being suspicious. I have a feeling there are parallel investigations going on with the fire and disappearance. The silence on both along with the high probability LE has brought this case before a GJ tells it's highly likely at some point one or the other will make it through the judicial system.... and justice will come for John.

http://statelaws.findlaw.com/illinois-law/illinois-criminal-statute-of-limitations-laws.html
 
Thanks snowleopard!!!! Glad to be here and chatting with everyone about this--watched it twice on "Disappeared" and things did not sound right (always leery when key players are not on camera).....business debt is tricky--some owners dont think certain debts are really debts--merely business costs without due dates (Mr C had a former employer who thought that way---401K contributions etc----)
 
hot cawfee said:
not sure of theis questioned was asked and answered but-----where were John's guitars and equipment? He was going to dinner and then play with the band........did he have to return home to get his things? Did he have them in the truck or were they already at the venue????? Someone dropping them off or transporting them??? Just a thought-----I think the business partner knows ALOT-------the program mentioned business financial trouble---was that ever clarified? Trouble making payroll, not able to pay company health insurance or employee taxes or something as simple as "counting the paperclips" (slight belt-tightening).....
Click to expand...

BBM

On the night he disappeared, did he have a gig? I thought it was for the next night so he wouldn't have needed his equipment on the 23rd.

When I started watching his episode, I actually thought he had an accident or something. He got home at 3 a.m. and then woke up at 7 a.m. I know people operate differently in regards to their internal clock but that sounded too insignificant of a sleep cycle. Of course after finishing the episode, that was probably not it and I'm leaning towards foul play.
 
I saw this case on Disappeared like so many others. I thought the interesting part of the case was the missing person sign. The show never said whether or not the family put up another sign, this time with maybe a video camera to watch it?

What route did John Spira's ex-wife take to work in Sept. 2007? What time did his business partner leave work on the days the signs came down? The reason for these questions is that I think the sign would irritate someone who would have to see it everyday. Did the other business owner have a big insurance policy on the building when it burned to the ground? Having an insurance policy on your business partner would not really work in this case because there is no proof he is actually dead. Who helped put up the missing person's signs?

The reason you would have to think these questions about the missing person signs are important is because you would have to guess that they were taken down under the cover of night. So if the other business owner lives 50 miles away or something he would have to be determined to go home, then come back late at night to remove a missing person's sign. The same thing with the ex-wife. To do it twice is very brazen in my opinion. Then again maybe it was just juveniles being dumb.

When I saw the backhoe equipment on the show Disappeared I came up with the obvious idea that if his business partner killed him, he could just did a hole and cover it up. Then you have that plastic roll. I think plastic would do more than just help conceal the body. It would keep the body from smelling once it started to decompose. It really looks like if John Spira is dead that his body was transported or is probably close to where he disappeared.
 
Strange disappearance, often seems to happen after mp has had some change or break in routine, imo.
 
Thinking of John and his family. I never thought this case would still be unsolved 9 years later. Praying this is the year John is located and gets the justice he deserves.
 
still missing: http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-ten-years-missing-met-20170203-story.html

$
 
I think of John Spira everytime I go through the St. Charles area.
So unfair, the answers that - IMO - died with his ex-wife.
His family deserves answers and it breaks my heart that those may not be forthcoming. Never losing hope, though!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Those are some interesting tidbits that we did not know before. Thanks for the update Swick
 
Swick said:
His sister posted some information she obtained through FOIA...

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1232498620182036&id=100002657292413

(From the official Missing John Spira page, so I assume it's ok?)

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk
Click to expand...


Interesting, this puts a whole new spin on things, imo. What especially stands out is that Dave Stubben reported one of the plastic rolls was missing. Now, if he were responsible for Johns disappearance, why would he tell police about the missing roll of plastic?

I wonder, was Dan M usually at work at 5 am? Was it usual for him to have his daughter clean the office? Interesting how he had his daughter clean the office between the time the missing poster went up across from the office/last place John was seen alive and the office burning down.

Something to make note of. Not only is there no statute of limitations on murder in Illinois, there is also no statute of limitations on arson in Illinois. http://criminal.lawyers.com/criminal-law-basics/illinois-criminal-statutes-of-limitations.html
 
I wish Johns sister would put together a detailed time line of the events of ALL aspects surrounding this case. Divorce proceeding dates and times, dates and times of events which occurred the day of Johns disappearance, that weekend, the date the sign went up, went missing and when the office burnt down.
 
Coverage from Crime Watch Daily. Video in four parts

Where is missing musician 'Chicago Johnny'? John Spira disappears under suspicious circumstances

Nicknamed "Chicago Johnny," he was the lead guitarist in the popular blues band the Rabble Rousers. Often playing smaller gigs around town, they also played some bigger ones like the famous Chicago Blues Festival.

"He was sort of the musical leader of the band, a really dynamic, outgoing guitar player, very pleasant, very unselfish," said Spira's bandmate Rick Fobes.

If music was John's true love, the marriage to his wife Suzanne could be considered less melodic.

"She was an extremely difficult person to like," said Tom Spira. "I would say 99 percent of the time it was very difficult and awkward. I don't think she ever really fit in, and frankly I don't think she wanted to."

It was a Friday in late February when John and Suzanne finally came to an agreement.

"It was probably his greatest day, it was our greatest day, that Suzanne was going to be out of the picture," said Tom.
Click to expand...

With a brand new lease on life, John heads to work at Universal Cable Construction, a company he co-owns with his partner, Dave Stubben.

"[Dave Stubben] had been friends for a long time. They were in business together 17 years, but had known each other for 20 years," said Stephanie. "I think he was a pilot, too, and avid hunter."

John arrives midday in time for the weekly office barbecue on Feb. 23, 2007. Then around 7 p.m., John calls a friend, making plans to meet for dinner at 8:30. But John never showed up for that dinner.

That evening John's girlfriend Renata tried calling him several times, but he never picked up. Then around 11 p.m., John's cellphone dies.

"So Renata, his girlfriend, is frantically calling, calling, she called the police and they said 'Nothing we can do,'" said Stephanie.

Renata even calls John's wife Suzanne asking her to help, but she allegedly refuses.

On Saturday there's still no word from John. That night, the Rabble Rousers have a gig, But John's a no-show.
Click to expand...

What Happened To John Spira? Part 1:

[video=youtube;XZiF9pY-3dA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XZiF9pY-3dA"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XZiF9pY-3dA[/video]
 
Where is missing musician 'Chicago Johnny'? John Spira disappears under suspicious circumstances

Early Sunday, John's sister Stephanie learns he's vanished without a trace.

"My dad called me and said 'Seems he's been missing since Friday,' and my first thought immediately was Suzanne," said Stephanie McNeil. "I just dialed her number and said 'Where the f--- is my brother?' And she just said 'I don't know, Steph, I'm just as devastated as everybody else.'"
Click to expand...

Reportedly, Dave Stubben tells detectives he and John have a good relationship with no real problems, financial or otherwise. When cops ask him who was the last to see John on Friday night, he says it was not him.

"Dave detailed his evening as leaving Universal Cable about 7, 7:15 at night, and stating that the last person in there with John was another vendor," said Sgt. Harris.

But the other vendor told investigators that when he left, Dave and John were both still there. And that vendor's account was buttressed by another vendor.

"Those two vendors or subcontractors corroborated each other's statements," said Det. Wayda. "They're not friends, they're not co-workers. They don't have a working relationship to know who each other really are. Certainly makes us think that there's more he knows, or more involvement than he wants us to know he had."
Click to expand...

"When the police arrived, the truck was found in the back lot that's gated," said Detective Tiffany Wayda, DuPage County Sheriff's Office.

That becomes noteworthy when investigators learn that on Friday John had parked where he usually parks, in the front lot.

"It's unusual that he's gone and the car was moved from where it initially was, to where it was found," said Sgt. Bob Harris.

So allegedly, John's car was moved after he vanished. But by whom? Harris says no evidence was found in the car.

"What stuck out to us immediately is that there was a large piece of plastic, maybe 10-by-20-foot piece of sheeting, that had been seen on Friday on a desk in warehouse area of the business," said Harris. "The employees pointed out that this plastic was there, and now it's missing. So certainly we start to think John can't be found, we're missing plastic, so at that point two and two starts look like four."
Click to expand...

What Happened To John Spira? Part 2:

[video=youtube;Mlg2Og6TjaY]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mlg2Og6TjaY"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mlg2Og6TjaY[/video]
 
Where is missing musician 'Chicago Johnny'? John Spira disappears under suspicious circumstances

They would later find out that John's cellphone never left Universal Cable. But they never found the phone.

A large-scale search yields no evidence and no John. But Stephanie started piecing together her own evidence when she learns her brother's business partner and estranged wife are spending time together.

Why are they communicating?

Investigators talk to Suzanne.

"Her first statement actually to me was that she wanted to point out to me that no matter what else happened in this case, she would always tell me the truth and she'd never lie," said Det. Harris. "Others might lie but she would always tell the truth. In Law Enforcement 101, we recognize that when someone makes that bold of a statement, it's almost quite the opposite."
Click to expand...

"We had learned that John had a couple other romantic involvements with other women," said Det. Harris. "Certainly in those situations -- and at least one we know was married -- there's an obvious, the romantic angle of, you know, a spurned or a jealous husband could have been involved. We have attempted to pursue them and unfortunately run into other roadblocks with people not wanting to talk to us."

Soon after, Suzanne Spira leaves town, relocating to another state. She is never named a suspect in John Spira's disappearance.

John's brother Tom Spira believes all roads lead back to Dave Stubben and Suzanne, who he says actually conspired to get rid of John, and says money was their motive.

"It solved Suzanne's problem, because I don't think she wanted to get the divorce," said Tom. "Look at the house they lived in. Look at the income he had. She had a very, very healthy lifestyle. The divorce was going to end that. And I think she was going to do everything that she could to hold on to that institution, and she shared this information with Dave, and Dave said, 'Well, we think his half of the business is probably worth "x" and you'd get that income,' or whatever deal they seemed to have made."

Then three years after his disappearance his estranged wife Suzanne is found dead. Reportedly she died of natural causes.

"We all knew she knew something," said Tom Spira. "Now that has gone to the grave and we will never know what Suzanne knew or didn't know."
Click to expand...

What Happened To John Spira? Part 3:

[video=youtube;B6p4s5WaUzA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6p4s5WaUzA"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6p4s5WaUzA[/video]
 
Where is missing musician 'Chicago Johnny'? John Spira disappears under suspicious circumstances

Six months after John vanishes. Stephanie, John's younger sister, gets bold. She has a large "missing" sign of John put up directly across the street from Dave Stubben and Universal Cable.

But it's not up for long. The billboard goes up on a Friday night, and Saturday this billboard is vandalized -- gone, disappeared.

Then, unbelievably, on Sunday, Universal Cable goes up in flames.

"The fire was eventually ruled by the fire investigative task force as an incendiary fire, which basically means that the fire had a human involvement in it," said Det. Bob Harris. "So someone set this fire at Universal Cable, we just don't know who and we don't know why."
Click to expand...

Shockingly, during the fire investigation, Dave drops yet another bombshell about John: He suggests that that John was in fact embezzling money from the company.

Stubben then goes as far as to say "He would not rule out John's involvement in the fire."

Yes, the same John no one has seen for six months. Was there an insurance payout?

"There was. They ended up settling for I believe it was approximately $700,000," said Harris.
Click to expand...

Dave Stubben was cooperating with investigators, then got a lawyer and cut off all communication. Did that then impede the investigation by him not cooperating?

"Eventually he did impede, yes. He co-owns a property and we certainly thought it would be appropriate to search that property. It's about 110 acres in Missouri, and he refused to consent to a search of that property.

"Unfortunately for us the fact that we can't talk to him, even with an attorney present, kind of puts us in between a rock and a hard place," said Det. Harris.

So if Dave Stubben won't talk to detectives, maybe he'll talk to Crime Watch Daily. We tracked him down and confronted him on the street. He covered his face, got into his car and drove off without answering any questions.

"I would basically describe him as a brick wall. He's in our way," said Det. Harris. "If he helped he would be alongside of us, but by not helping he's in the way."
Click to expand...

Dave Stubben has never been charged with anything related to the disappearance of John Spira. While the Dupage County Sheriff's Office does consider him a person of interest, he's not alone.

"There's a list of people that are close to John that I would call people of interest," said Det. Harris. "Anyone close to someone who disappears or who is murdered are going to be people of interest, so he's one of many."
Click to expand...

What Happened To John Spira? Part 4:

[video=youtube;7cQo_YA1eto]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7cQo_YA1eto"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7cQo_YA1eto[/video]
 
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