IL IL - Timmothy Fry-Pitzen, 6, Aurora, 13 May 2011 - mom found dead - #3

[oceanverde]

There’s circumstantial evidence. Lots of it. She was going through a major depression. there was blood that was Timmothy’s and circumstantially, we could argue it’s from murder. Her car tires indicated flat land soil with queen Anne’s lace, suggesting a field. Her clothes that she wore out that day were missing. Then there’s how long he’s been missing, no one has seen a strange Child show up at someone’s house missing his birth certificate, social security number, or other important things. He couldn’t have been enrolled in school without noticeable trouble. Timmothy himself was old enough to possibly remember and the crime hasn’t exactly been low profile. He’d be over 18 now. And the people taking him in wouldn’t have been very good or safe parents if they went through with this plan as she planned it. The sheer fact there’s been nothing strange, no sightings, nothing, in itself is circumstantial evidence he’s dead. Personally, that’s why I think Stacy Rudolph is dead too. In both cases we’re talking about an incredibly, absurdly entitled mentally unbalanced person who put her wants ahead of her child’s. Given all that and especially how long he’s been missing, I think it’s fair to say he’s dead. MOO

I’m sure we all would like to see him be alive, but if you take a step back - and remember we’re not a court of law who can only accept some types of evidence - he is probably deceased.

It's not fair to say he's dead when there's no evidence of that. You can speculate that he could be dead, even likely dead but nobody can say for certain.

None of that means he's dead with certainty. All of that can be explained away. The blood was from something else, not a murder. The soil was from her being in a field perhaps sure, where she met and handed off her son to someone. He hasn't come forward because just like many others, they are brainwashed after years. There's plenty of examples of this. If he's within the amish community, he wouldn't need a birth certificate or SSN etc.

What I wrote above is just as possible as what you wrote given the evidence there is (not much).

Or she could have hid Tim in such a remote area that he will never be found? Why would she kill herself if she had nothing to do with Tim's vanishing and alleged death?

Satch

She killed herself because she was depressed but wanted her son to have a better life and didn't think his father could provide that? She found someone to provide it. The multiple trips to the area where her found was found could be evidence of this. Of course, it would also be evidence of her trying to find a good spot to bury her son after killing him too but one possibility is not more likely than the other.

 

[Keiri]

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[Piknik]

Where are her clothes from earlier in the day and explain why the need to change them?

 

[oceanverde]

Is that a serious question? She spilled something on them. Hot coffee, literally anything. She got sweaty and wanted to change them. She wanted to be found wearing different clothes when she died so she got rid of the other clothes and changed into these clothes.

There are a myriad of possibilities.

 

[Keiri]

Is that a serious question? She spilled something on them. Hot coffee, literally anything. She got sweaty and wanted to change them. She wanted to be found wearing different clothes when she died so she got rid of the other clothes and changed into these clothes.

There are a myriad of possibilities.

At a certain point you can make possible explanations for everything. When you do that, you aren't seeing the totality of the circumstances, which is how circumstancial evidence is used. It'd be really odd to have all of those things happen without a murder. Hey, if we're wrong, fine.

Disposing of her clothing leaves this huge question when she knows she's setting up a mystery about her son and wants people to believe he's ok but somewhere else (whether or not he is). You'd think you'd do everything to make sure it doesn't look like you, say, killed him and had to dispose of the clothing you killed him in. Which is how it looks.

Do you know her personally? Are you related to the case somehow? Because you seem bothered at the suggestions she seems to have done it. If you are connected, you should get vetted by the site and be an insider. It'd be nice to hear from one.

 

[oceanverde]

No, I don't know her. I'm bothered by people stating things as facts that aren't facts. There's no certainty in this case. There's what is likely and what is possible but nothing with certainy.

 

[Piknik]

No, I don't know her. I'm bothered by people stating things as facts that aren't facts. There's no certainty in this case. There's what is likely and what is possible but nothing with certainy.

There's absolute certainty in this case. It's certain she took two trips prior to this trip following the same corridor she took her son on. It's certain she DISPOSED of her clothes. Who disposes their clothes when they hypothetically spill coffee on them LOL. It's a 100% certainty that she threw her phone out the window in an attempt to dispose of it. Her IPASS is also missing.
Also, how could she be found "wearing different clothes" when she was found deceased in her tub? Are you CERTAIN she was wearing her clothes in the the tub when she committed suicide?

 

[oceanverde]

There's absolute certainty in this case. It's certain she took two trips prior to this trip following the same corridor she took her son on. It's certain she DISPOSED of her clothes. Who disposes their clothes when they hypothetically spill coffee on them LOL. It's a 100% certainty that she threw her phone out the window in an attempt to dispose of it. Her IPASS is also missing.
Also, how could she be found "wearing different clothes" when she was found deceased in her tub? Are you CERTAIN she was wearing her clothes in the the tub when she committed suicide?

Actually ... no. Almost none of what you wrote is certain. The prior trips are the only thing backed up by evidence, not speculation.

Her disposing of the clothes isn't certain. We don't know where they are. For all we know, she left them somewhere and didn't throw them away.

We also don't know how her phone ended up where it ended up. It it possible and even likely it was thrown out the window... but not certain.

She changed clothes... it's possible whatever plan she had changed. We simply DO NOT KNOW because it's all speculation.

<modsnip - personalizing>

 

[JaePim]

This is my first time posting, so please let me know if there’s any etiquette or rules I may accidentally be going against.
A couple questions I have:
1) Does anyone here know what specific areas in between the two states that were fully searched with groups and dogs?
Having those locations may be helpful in seeing what specific areas have been searched and where there may be locational gaps in the search efforts.
2) I read in the thread that one of the people that Amy had called during this timeframe was her brother in law. Is there any information out there on his statement specifically? I’m interested in learning what he had to say, especially since he was Jim Pitzen’s brother, I’m curious if her tone was different or if she left any sort of subtle indication of anything

From my perspective, I can only realistically envision that Amy unfortunately took Timmothy’s life. She was suffering from severe mental illness, and she may have been fearful of what the outcome of her divorce could do to her custody rights.. and of Jim and the courts potentially taking Timmothy away from her. I believe she drugged Timmothy. I don’t believe she stabbed him even though there was blood found inside the vehicle, because I feel as though if he was stabbed before/in the car, there would have been more signs of him being taken out of the car via blood droplets/smears/residue showing blood also on the outside of the vehicle, on the steering wheel, or even droplets/smears showing some sort of directional trail.
I have a difficult time believing that he is in a Mormon/cult/amish community because he is no longer a minor, and I believe he would have ventured out by now, seen something in the news, been spotted by someone else, or left to find his real family, he was 11 when he disappeared, I doubt that he would just forget about his family over time at that age. I also feel like a member of the community/group out of guilt or after removing themselves from the community, tells LE about Timmothy and where he is located. I do have quite a bit of confidence in this theory, however, what throws me off is Amy buying clothes and toothpaste for those items to go missing as well. It doesn’t completely add up that she would purchase them right before murdering her son? And where did they go? Was this part of Amy’s plan to make it look like he was taken somewhere? Did she bury the items with her son? Or am I off base and he was in fact given to another individual/group. This is all IMO.
I hope they can one day locate him for the peace of his family and the community that has showed such everlasting and great concern over him.

Good points but he was 6 when he disappeared, not 11. Just an FYI. This case has always haunted me.

 

[anony5432]

Good points but he was 6 when he disappeared, not 11. Just an FYI. This case has always haunted me.

This is the one case I always come back to. Recently, law enforcement have been using Google to access search histories for people that made specific searches. I wonder if they could use this to find more evidence. Like find other people making suspicious searches leading up to the disappearance.