Found Deceased IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #161

[GA_Peach]

The new motion is interesting, especially items 10 and 15. I am not surprised to see that the defense is asking for information related to a photo lineup. I really want to know if a single witness has IDed RA. Also, is #22 normal?

 

[JudgeJudi]

That’s not him lighting those off - take a look at the face when he turns around. AFAIK it looks nothing like him. IA when he turns around & speaks he doesn’t sound like BG and RA either cuz he isn’t.

That's not RA, that's RA's son-in-law.

I agree it it doesn't look like him, but the article says, "Others have compared Allen’s gait in this fireworks video to the walk of the suspect in the video that police released". Very strange reporting if it's his son-in-law or anyone else.

 

[MistyWaters]

I agree it it doesn't look like him, but the article says, "Others have compared Allen’s gait in this fireworks video to the walk of the suspect in the video that police released". Very strange reporting if it's his son-in-law or anyone else.

The preceding paragraph on heavy.com reads “Some people believe that the jacket Allen is wearing in this video resembles the jacket wore by the killer they call “BG” — “Bridge Guy” — in Facebook groups.” so it’s seems obvious to me that ”others” also comes from SM sources who were expecting to find incriminating evidence on the wife’s FB and therefore assumed every posted pic or video was of RA.

JMO

 

[ss90]

Would they have crossed with somebody in front of them though?


I would walk that bridge without any fear but if I had a strange man in front of me acting suspicious then I wouldn’t start to cross. Coz I have seen way to many horror movies

Yes, and I guess it depends. He may not have been acting weird at all at that time and to my understanding there are platforms all the way to the end so he could have been just standing there, seemingly minding his own business while they passed.

It would be interesting to know what exactly gave the "creepy" vibes for the 3 girls he passed. IMO it could have been just that they were young and he older, kinda hobo looking guy se maybe a bit of exaggeration, but I doubt that would have been enough for Libby to start filming.

 

[electricuncalm]

What is "DNR?"

Dnr is the title of the department conservation officers work for.… again at least in indiana. Until this fact about the Delphi case was released I’ve never in my life heard them called conservation officers. In my work we would refer to them as dnr officers and in popular vernacular you would just say oh that’s dnr. It’s the department of natural resources.

Where I’m at we also have tribal police. Both dnr and tribal police officers have legal powers much broader than the “regular” city county and state police officers I work with.

 

[FrostedGlass]

Angela Ganote, reporter with Fox59, has the full document (RA's attorneys' motion for supplemental discovery) available here: https://m.facebook.com/story.php?st...AazBkgHKnl&id=100044311365463&mibextid=Nif5oz

MS went over those items one-by-one. Many were standard but a few were pretty interesting. MS didn't seem to have any solid feel for the unusual ones = whether the atty was just covering any and all bases or if they were specific to this case.

The 2 mentions of a confidential informant kind of tripped MS trigger. Also anyone acting undercover or jailhouse snitches. The mention of a grand jury (#8) = MS said they had not heard any mention of a GJ. #16 the suggestion of a search after the arrest, which we know nothing about. MS discussion of rule 404 was informative, talking about the ways in which it could be used.

Murder Sheet

The Murder Sheet is a weekly true crime podcast hosted by journalist Áine Cain and attorney Kevin Greenlee. We take a journalistic approach to covering true crime. We have broken national news on major cases, like the Delphi murders and the Burger Chef murders. We also cover plenty of other...

art19.com

 

[TL4S]

Angela Ganote, reporter with Fox59, has the full document (RA's attorneys' motion for supplemental discovery) available here: https://m.facebook.com/story.php?st...AazBkgHKnl&id=100044311365463&mibextid=Nif5oz

I'm not particularly adept in interpreting legal language, but I feel like items 5 and 6 might be the defense looking for discovery evidence related to NMcL's claim of "other actors." Thoughts?

ETA: I just saw @FrostedGlass's post about the new MS podcast, which seems to discuss my questions. I haven't listened yet, so thanks FrostedGlass for bringing it to my attention!

 

[raja]

So is it impeachment of KK. Sorry don’t throw tomatoes at me.

 

[arielilane]

RA’s wife videos him letting off firecrackers in the backyard. The date is unknown but you’ll be surprised what he looks like. The most interesting part by far is you actually get to hear him speaking. I really don’t think he sounds like BG saying “Guys, down the hill”.

Kathy Allen, Richard Allen’s Wife: 5 Fast Facts You Need to Know

Appreciate that you posted Heavy link. Imo, they usually provide informative and helpful information, and avoid fluff.

BG is going to sound different from video in article than video at bridge given different circumstances at the time of each video though its same person imo.

of course innocent until proven guilty in a court of law.

 

[FrostedGlass]

I'm not particularly adept in interpreting legal language, but I feel like items 5 and 6 might be the defense looking for discovery evidence related to NMcL's claim of "other actors." Thoughts?

ETA: I just saw @FrostedGlass's post about the new MS podcast, which seems to discuss my questions. I haven't listened yet, so thanks FrostedGlass for bringing it to my attention!

Here are a few minute markers:
4. 12mm
6. 16:33mm
11. 23mm
17. 31mm
22. 34mm
26. 39mm

 

[JudgeJudi]

HAPPY NEW YEAR

Wishing you all good health and happiness for 2023. We're many hours ahead of you in Oz and have had our New Year's Eve celebrations. Here's our famous Sydney Harbour fireworks display which runs for 12:36. If that's too long, just watch the last 3 minutes which includes the "golden waterfall".

 

[TheVisual]

Yes, and I guess it depends. He may not have been acting weird at all at that time and to my understanding there are platforms all the way to the end so he could have been just standing there, seemingly minding his own business while they passed.

It would be interesting to know what exactly gave the "creepy" vibes for the 3 girls he passed. IMO it could have been just that they were young and he older, kinda hobo looking guy se maybe a bit of exaggeration, but I doubt that would have been enough for Libby to start filming.

If the girls passed him on the platform then he might have said " GUYS " as a salutation ( that I have always thought it was). His voice sounds more lifted then down. JMO

 

[TL4S]

MS went over those items one-by-one. Many were standard but a few were pretty interesting. MS didn't seem to have any solid feel for the unusual ones = whether the atty was just covering any and all bases or if they were specific to this case.

The 2 mentions of a confidential informant kind of tripped MS trigger. Also anyone acting undercover or jailhouse snitches. The mention of a grand jury (#8) = MS said they had not heard any mention of a GJ. #16 the suggestion of a search after the arrest, which we know nothing about. MS discussion of rule 404 was informative, talking about the ways in which it could be used.

Murder Sheet

The Murder Sheet is a weekly true crime podcast hosted by journalist Áine Cain and attorney Kevin Greenlee. We take a journalistic approach to covering true crime. We have broken national news on major cases, like the Delphi murders and the Burger Chef murders. We also cover plenty of other...

art19.com

I finally listened. Again, I'm not well-versed in legal language, but I don't think I agree with MS's interpretation of item 5. I don't think the defense is expecting evidence showing the murders happened on behalf of the state, or anything like that. I think it's asking for evidence showing that someone who participated (and they don't say "allegedly participated") in the alleged crime worked on behalf of the state in an informant capacity. JMO.

 

[FrostedGlass]

I finally listened. Again, I'm not well-versed in legal language, but I don't think I agree with MS's interpretation of item 5. I don't think the defense is expecting evidence showing the murders happened on behalf of the state, or anything like that. I think it's asking for evidence showing that someone who participated (and they don't say "allegedly participated") in the alleged crime worked on behalf of the state in an informant capacity. JMO.

That sounds reasonable. This is such odd wording that it's hard to know exactly what he means. Maybe he did mean to say "indirectly on the investigation...". instead of at the investigation.

 

[TL4S]

That sounds reasonable. This is such odd wording that it's hard to know exactly what he means. Maybe he did mean to say "indirectly on the investigation...". instead of at the investigation.

That's what I think. And the very next item, number 6, seems like an extension on the idea of an informant, going on to ask for anything showing what the informant got in return for their cooperation (payment, altered jail time, etc). Jmo.

 

[gizmobtj]

So is it impeachment of KK. Sorry don’t throw tomatoes at me.

We shan't kill the messenger, Lord @raja !

 

[gizmobtj]

I finally listened. Again, I'm not well-versed in legal language, but I don't think I agree with MS's interpretation of item 5. I don't think the defense is expecting evidence showing the murders happened on behalf of the state, or anything like that. I think it's asking for evidence showing that someone who participated (and they don't say "allegedly participated") in the alleged crime worked on behalf of the state in an informant capacity. JMO.

Correct -- was someone an agent for the state at some point is the question. For example, when a co-conspirator is trying to get someone to confess they are acting as an agent of the state

 

[mooseandcoffee]

I’m sure that LE have more evidence than what is documented in the Probable Cause Affidavit.

BBM, do you have a certain person in mind that possibly obtained RA's bullet and planted it at the crime scene? That’s an interesting claim. TIA

I did found the Murder Sheet podcast dated Dec 16 "Conversations with a Firearms Expert and a Professional Investigator" insightful.

MOO

LE planting evidence makes no sense, IMO.

 

[iamnotagolem]

LE planting evidence makes no sense, IMO.

I agree, if they planted evidence from RA I don’t think it would have taken them 5.5 years to remember they were setting up someone to take the fall.

 

[Ozoner]

I’m sure that LE have more evidence than what is documented in the Probable Cause Affidavit.

BBM, do you have a certain person in mind that possibly obtained RA's bullet and planted it at the crime scene? That’s an interesting claim. TIA

I did found the Murder Sheet podcast dated Dec 16 "Conversations with a Firearms Expert and a Professional Investigator" insightful.

MOO

RA's defense team is not going to claim anybody planted the bullet; they're going to dispute the claim that it's his bullet—period—in my opinion. Experts challenge ballistics evidence all the time, and there is not nearly the same body of research behind this kind of identification as there is behind ballistics matches with bullets that have actually been fired.

All the defense attorneys are going to try to do is create doubt. They don't have to prove that RA is innocent.

I think that it will come down to what evidence prosecutors have that has not been made public yet.

I've read that RA kept the jacket that he allegedly wore that day. If that's true, then investigators will rip that jacket to shreds looking for blood evidence containing either Abby or Libby's DNA. If they find any, it's game over for RA: he'll be convicted, sentenced to death, and executed, in my opinion.

If the crime scene was a bloody as we've been led to believe, then that DNA from one of the victims should be in the jacket. If there is none, then that will give the defense team another opportunity to try to create doubt, in my opinion.