IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #165

[Blunomore]

Interesting.

Just a side note, I imagined the muddy part came from having to go up that steep bank on the side of the creek. The bloody I assumed to be coming from him rearranging their bodies after using a knife to actually kill wold them.

"Bloody" would be from the act of murdering the victims with a knife. This kind is crime is up close. No way a murderer cannot get blood on himself.

 

[Blunomore]

bbm

I remember to have seen a part of Abby's light brown/beige jacket sleeve, which later on had been removed from the photo.

Which photo was that? An earlier pic of BG?

 

[Blunomore]

But Richard Allen confessed and there is ballistic toolmark evidence and eyewitness testimony, so the case is solved. I still wonder about the answers to the questions I have in this case.

The defense will try to have his confession thrown out.

 

[FromGermany1]

Which photo was that? An earlier pic of BG?

Idk, if the photo is the same we know already or a second one. I rather think, it is the same photo, but without the outer edge of one sleeve now.
The sleeve-photo is gone; I can't prove it.

 

[AC4RD]

Idk, if the photo is the same we know already or a second one. I rather think, it is the same photo, but without the outer edge of one sleeve now.
The sleeve-photo is gone; I can't prove it.

I recall seeing that in (I believe) one of RG's videos on YouTube. It seemed plausible to me, I remember.

 

[FrostedGlass]

Idk, if the photo is the same we know already or a second one. I rather think, it is the same photo, but without the outer edge of one sleeve now.
The sleeve-photo is gone; I can't prove it.

I took this screen cap on Feb 25, 2017. At the time, most thought that was Abby's sleeve.

 

[TL4S]

I took this screen cap on Feb 25, 2017. At the time, most thought that was Abby's sleeve.

View attachment 434385

This is the first time that my brain interprets something covering the lower part of his face.

 

[TL4S]

Two things are nagging me. JH said the reenactments are inaccurate, and L's phone was under her body while her clothing was in the creek.

I think RA took them into the woods below the bridge on the south side of the creek, and that's where they spent nearly an hour, where he made them undress, etc. Then at 3:11, L's dad called, and whether or not the phone was on silent, maybe the phone lit up and L said her dad was there looking for them. With this, RA wanted to get away from the bridge and trails, so he made the girls gather their things and cross the creek. At 3:14, they might have been around the north bank when L's dad called the second time. I think the clothing was dropped and L maybe tried to get up the bank and answer the call. Maybe RA scrambled up behind her, getting muddy, they got about 50 feet from the bank before he chambered a second round to threaten her (or misfired and tried again), which ejected the round. Then he grabbed his knife and got to L, who fell on top of her phone. Or, alternatively, he killed L and while standing by her, chambered the round to threaten A to keep her from trying to run. JMO.

 

[girlhasnoname]

The defense will try to have his confession thrown out.

They will try, I do not believe they will be successful.

MOO

 

[FromGermany1]

Two things are nagging me. JH said the reenactments are inaccurate, and L's phone was under her body while her clothing was in the creek.

I think RA took them into the woods below the bridge on the south side of the creek, and that's where they spent nearly an hour, where he made them undress, etc. Then at 3:11, L's dad called, and whether or not the phone was on silent, maybe the phone lit up and L said her dad was there looking for them. With this, RA wanted to get away from the bridge and trails, so he made the girls gather their things and cross the creek. At 3:14, they might have been around the north bank when L's dad called the second time. I think the clothing was dropped and L maybe tried to get up the bank and answer the call. Maybe RA scrambled up behind her, getting muddy, they got about 50 feet from the bank before he chambered a second round to threaten her (or misfired and tried again), which ejected the round. Then he grabbed his knife and got to L, who fell on top of her phone. Or, alternatively, he killed L and while standing by her, chambered the round to threaten A to keep her from trying to run. JMO.

bbm

It would make some sort of sense, because LE blocked a larger area with barrier tape on the South area of the bridge, afaik. We wondered, why.

 

[FromGermany1]

This is the first time that my brain interprets something covering the lower part of his face.

Now, when you said it ..... maybe.

 

[FrostedGlass]

This is the first time that my brain interprets something covering the lower part of his face.

You're making progress; that's a good thing! My brain is still stuck on something with a loop.

 

[Megnut]

This is the first time that my brain interprets something covering the lower part of his face.

Actually, it looks to me like his beard. Prior, I suspect he'd taken effort to conceal his beard. No witnesses described one IIRC.

I think this image was released because it shows him at the closest point for maximum clarity of features without capturing the weapon and abduction. And that's why it was truncated.

JMO

 

[girlhasnoname]

You're making progress; that's a good thing! My brain is still stuck on something with a loop.

Neck gaiter: a fabric covering in the form of a closed loop worn around the neck that can extend to cover the lower part of the face.

RA admitted to 'maybe' wearing one that day. I have to ask, why would BG aka RA need to wear such layered clothing and a neck gaiter on a very mild afternoon unless he was specifically trying to obscure his identity?

MOO

 

[girlhasnoname]

I think this piece of evidence was one of his "mistakes" (DC at the 2019 press conference, "you made mistakes"). I'm wondering if in the course of going across the creek, the gun got wet and/or muddy...and at some point (maybe after the crime was over) he ejected the bullet from the chamber (the one that was racked on the bridge) so that he could drain the water and/or debris out of the chamber, and dry it off with something to prevent rust issues...or to quickly clean and rack a new cartridge in case someone found and confronted him before he made his escape (maybe not confident it would fire in the condition it was in)? Maybe he didn't see where the cartridge landed when he ejected it, and had to leave without it?

LE alleging that a witness saw the killer "muddy and bloody"...makes me wonder if one or both of the girls didn't attempt to fight back...and maybe the killer (and his gun) took a fall in the creek and/or in the mud/dirt trying to climb down or up one of the banks on either side of the creek?

JMO

RA would def be muddy/bloody based on this report. Also, it says items of clothing were taken and removed from the scene. I wonder if LE found one or some of these during their SW at this home. I think they do.

<snipped & bbm>
“A large amount of blood was lost by the victims at the crime scene,” an agent wrote in the warrant. “Because of the nature of the victim’s wounds, it is nearly certain the perpetrator of the crime would have gotten blood on his person/clothing.”

The victims, according to the warrant, didn’t have any defense wounds, but some articles of clothing were taken from them and removed from the scene, while the killer placed the victims’ bodies in what investigators called a staged manner.

Blood, Sex Staging, Fiber Evidence: Chilling New Details in Murder of Two Delphi Little Girls

MOO

 

[FrostedGlass]

Neck gaiter: a fabric covering in the form of a closed loop worn around the neck that can extend to cover the lower part of the face.

RA admitted to 'maybe' wearing one that day. I have to ask, why would BG aka RA need to wear such layered clothing and a neck gaiter on a very mild afternoon unless he was specifically trying to obscure his identity?

MOO

I just don't see it being a pulled-down mouth covering. Unless he took it off and stuffed it in his jacket. If he did that, then we can (maybe) conclude his intention from the beginning was to kill them. MOO

No such item showed up in his or his wife's belongings in the search.

 

[Vern]

I just don't see it being a pulled-down mouth covering. Unless he took it off and stuffed it in his jacket. If he did that, then we can (maybe) conclude his intention from the beginning was to kill them. MOO

No such item showed up in his or his wife's belongings in the search.

No gaiter is mentionned, but the search warrant details "headbands" seized from the residence during the search. A couple of us posted in an earlier thread and a witness also describes him having something covering his mouth etc when he passed them. We know he had a motorcycle based upon the motorcycle cover also noted as seized during the search.

Kind of like these perhaps:

Mask, Neck Gaiter, Neck Warmer, Headband, Explore Now - Etsy Australia

This Costume Masks item by YASHRACLOTHING has 76 favourites from Etsy shoppers. Is dispatched from United States. Listed on 05 May, 2024

www.etsy.com

 

[girlhasnoname]

I just don't see it being a pulled-down mouth covering. Unless he took it off and stuffed it in his jacket. If he did that, then we can (maybe) conclude his intention from the beginning was to kill them. MOO

No such item showed up in his or his wife's belongings in the search.

Maybe that was one item he got rid of? IDK RA is a hard one to read for me. I think he's sly and conniving and very, very manipulative.

ALL MOO

 

[PrairieWind]

They will try, I do not believe they will be successful.

MOO

Jail phone call recording are frequently used in trial. We don't know the procedures as far as i know of the jail here, but I also haven't seen anything yet that would lead me to believe the calls wouldn't be admissible. It actually never ceases to amaze me the things a person will say on a jail call, knowing there is a good chance it is being monitored.

 

[FrostedGlass]

No gaiter is mentionned, but the search warrant details "headbands" seized from the residence during the search. A couple of us posted in an earlier thread and a witness also describes him having something covering his mouth etc when he passed them. We know he had a motorcycle based upon the motorcycle cover also noted as seized during the search.

Kind of like these perhaps:

Mask, Neck Gaiter, Neck Warmer, Headband, Explore Now - Etsy Australia

This Costume Masks item by YASHRACLOTHING has 76 favourites from Etsy shoppers. Is dispatched from United States. Listed on 05 May, 2024

www.etsy.com

The white thing seemed to change shape as he walked, giving me the impression that it was "loose." It also seems to come from inside his jacket. I'm beginning to think it's something that only the killer knows.

They took some seemingly extra items, imo. I suspect that pair of size 6.5 boots belonged to his wife.
The 3 coats they took... they were specifically looking for a BG wearing a blue coat; so why take the
Black & gray North End coat and the Blue with red stripes Adidas jacket?

They took 12 of his sweatshirts, 9 of his hats.

Of course, there's that strange water bottle. Apparently bagged first by Steve Mullin and then bagged again by somebody. Of all the items taken, that was the only one that noted who bagged it.