IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #168

[gitana1]

I doubt it.

If the judge wanted them removed from the case, then I think she would have done it publicly. Threatening an attorney with something privately in order to get them to 'voluntarily' withdraw would be pretty unethical.

Moreover, it would be really strange to call a public hearing, approve cameras in the courtroom, make it open to the news media, have the victims' and defendant's family come, etc if her intention was just to force the defense counsel to withdraw beforehand.

Oh a judge could totally make a threat of some sort in private. “Listen. This is a big deal. This could be career-destroying. I’m giving you the option to voluntarily withdraw rather than having a public hearing to determine whether you will be sanctioned and/or removed. And I can tell you that my tentative is to have you removed and issue a very severe sanction.”

And she couldn’t know that the defense would acquiesce if she did indeed suggest they voluntarily withdraw. So she had to prepare for the hearing to go forward.

 

[gitana1]

The defense did leak other info this past Spring and then that Franks memorandum, with vivid crime scene descriptions which was subsequently sealed, after the fact. Two strikes and then BAM, leaked crime scene photos of two murdered children. After the two strikes she must have worried what the defense was capable of but no, she couldn't have ever thought this mess was coming. JMO

What was the first leak?

And we are talking about whether the judge should have withheld filings by the defense so she could review them first, and that her failure to do so allowed the memorandum to be accessible by the public. We aren’t talking about this last leak of photos.

So the first one was a leak of phone records or something? The judge would have zero reason to believe that would happen again and thus she needed to review everything prior to filing.

Regardless, I have never heard of a case where the court reviews everything prior to it being filed. The remedy is to sanction the attorneys or to remove them or need be.

 

[gitana1]

Well, whatever the reason, it's probably best for RA to get a new team at this point. This one has been catastrophic for him.

As for the departing team... well, I don't know about anyone else, but I doubt I'd put my trust in a firm where someone can just walk in, riffle through case files unchallenged, have plenty of time to find what they're looking for, take photos of it all on their phone, and leave unchallenged without anyone raising an eyebrow. I've worked in supermarkets, and once I no longer became an employee, I wouldn't have been able to go to the break room unchallenged! One would hope a law office had greater safeguards!

MOO

Seriously! It’s so ridiculous it seems like a lie to me.

 

[gitana1]

I don't understand, who recieved it to file it at that wee hour of the morning? To file a motion don't you have have it stamped and dated by the court clerk?

We Efile a lot these days. I’m not sure how it technically works but anything I submit after hours until 11:59 pm is file stamped the day I submit it.

 

[gitana1]

The person who died was one of (we don't know exactly how many) the people the insider/friend of the defense leaked the crime scene photos to, very tragic.

Yes. Tragic and weird!

 

[gitana1]

Well one lawyer, Attorney Baldwin, did fill out the withdraw paperwork and give to the judge. The judge mentioned in court today the other lawyer, Attorney Rossi, said he would be filling it out and turning it in soon. I can't remember if judge said tomorrow?

So it was filed before they went to chambers? Do we know?

 

[gitana1]

But if the Judge had that in mind, why would they all be set up to argue a hearing?

I wonder if instead something happened last minute such that they had to ask the Judge in chambers to withdraw. I mean it's odd none of this happened in the Court room?

I was wondering if maybe related to the leak, Baldwin now has an impossible conflict?

I don’t know- To the last two questions. As to the first, the judge has to be ready for the hearing. She can’t assume they will do what she wants and withdraw without an agreement.

 

[O.Incandenza]

So it was filed before they went to chambers? Do we know?

I went back and watched the video because I was curious about this and about her demeanor. Having now seen it, I think you might be right about what happened. It doesn't sound like anything was filed. She said that "Mr. Baldwin made an oral motion to withdraw, and I granted it" and that Mr. Rozzi would presumably be filing a written motion in the next few days.

 

[zh0r4]

So it was filed before they went to chambers? Do we know?

The only motion I’m aware of that was filed before the hearing per: Baldwin was 10/19/2023 10:07AM by Attorney Hennessy (Baldwin’s attorney)

Memorandum of possible disqualification or sanctions

 

[Bergmann]

I think defense attorneys do encourage the idea you can get away with the crime instead of saying let's do whats right.

Approx 90% of cases never make it to court because D advise ‘they’ve got you, best option is to plea..’

Of the remaining 10% there’s clearly a proportion of cases where D behave that way.

But I wouldn’t tar all D for the behaviour of an unscrupulous few.

In the same way I wouldn’t characterise all P as unscrupulous just because a few have used various underhand tactics to get a conviction at all costs.

 

[zh0r4]

“Baldwin's attorney, David Hennessy, told Fox News Digital that the attorneys did not "quit" the case but "withdrew under coercive circumstances."

Could coercion include “withdraw or be sanctioned”?

Delphi murders suspect Richard Allen's defense team withdraws from case after alleged leaked photos

Delphi murders suspect Richard Allen's defense attorneys quit the case Thursday after allegations that someone tied to an attorney's office leaked sensitive photos.

www.foxnews.com

 

[sunshineray]

What was the first leak?

And we are talking about whether the judge should have withheld filings by the defense so she could review them first, and that her failure to do so allowed the memorandum to be accessible by the public. We aren’t talking about this last leak of photos.

So the first one was a leak of phone records or something? The judge would have zero reason to believe that would happen again and thus she needed to review everything prior to filing.

Regardless, I have never heard of a case where the court reviews everything prior to it being filed. The remedy is to sanction the attorneys or to remove them or need be.

I'm not sure what was leaked in the Spring but I believe the judge mentioned the instance briefly in her address today.

I've liked this judge since she took over the case. I think these defense lawyers were not at all trust worthy after the memorandum violated the gag order but even worse described details that were under seal. Then it was itself sealed but nothing was being said about the why it happened and who's head would roll because it did happen. Maybe there just wasn't time because the next leak was even worse and the death occured, it seems, because of it.

She is the one in charge of the proceedings. It would have been nice to see her take this all in hand a bit sooner. Maybe she did talk to them, I don't know. I hope so. I read the ISP are investigating this final leak.

Indiana State Police reportedly investigating evidence leak in Delphi murder case

DELPHI, Ind. — An investigation by “The Murder Sheet” podcast, certain elements of which have been confirmed by FOX59, indicates an alleged leak of sensitive crime scene evidence by Ric…

www.google.com

 

[sunshineray]

So it was filed before they went to chambers? Do we know?

I don't think she mentioned that in her court address.

 

[sunshineray]

Seriously! It’s so ridiculous it seems like a lie to me.

Two hours before the hearing was to start Attorney Baldwin's lawyer filed...

"Attorney Baldwin did nothing wrong. He was snookered and abused," defense lawyer David Hennessy argued in the filing.

Hennessy, a longtime defense attorney who has argued on behalf of lawyers throughout Indiana before, argued that a trusted friend to Baldwin was given access to the office space where he kept all Delphi-related items.

"He was betrayed," Hennessy wrote, arguing that Baldwin has since kept "all Delphi-related items locked in a room or a locked fireproof cabinet."

Redirect Notice

 

[sunshineray]

“Baldwin's attorney, David Hennessy, told Fox News Digital that the attorneys did not "quit" the case but "withdrew under coercive circumstances."

Could coercion include “withdraw or be sanctioned”?

Delphi murders suspect Richard Allen's defense team withdraws from case after alleged leaked photos

Delphi murders suspect Richard Allen's defense attorneys quit the case Thursday after allegations that someone tied to an attorney's office leaked sensitive photos.

www.foxnews.com

Ok is this guy seriously down playing and saying that the girl's, two minors, that their death scene photos would have been seen by someone other than a judge, jury and of course counsel?

"It should be considered that nothing has been disclosed that won’t be disclosed at trial or hearings," Hennessy wrote."

 

[Betty P]

“Baldwin's attorney, David Hennessy, told Fox News Digital that the attorneys did not "quit" the case but "withdrew under coercive circumstances."

Could coercion include “withdraw or be sanctioned”?

Delphi murders suspect Richard Allen's defense team withdraws from case after alleged leaked photos

Delphi murders suspect Richard Allen's defense attorneys quit the case Thursday after allegations that someone tied to an attorney's office leaked sensitive photos.

www.foxnews.com

Trying to save face, but that’s a very inflammatory statement to make. They make it sound as though the judge is violating their rights. JMO

 

[Betty P]

Two hours before the hearing was to start Attorney Baldwin's lawyer filed...

"Attorney Baldwin did nothing wrong. He was snookered and abused," defense lawyer David Hennessy argued in the filing.

Hennessy, a longtime defense attorney who has argued on behalf of lawyers throughout Indiana before, argued that a trusted friend to Baldwin was given access to the office space where he kept all Delphi-related items.

"He was betrayed," Hennessy wrote, arguing that Baldwin has since kept "all Delphi-related items locked in a room or a locked fireproof cabinet."

Redirect Notice

Negligent and unprofessional at best. Dishonest and conniving more likely. JMO. Wouldnt most attorneys have that locked up as standard procedure?

 

[Salah11]

Two hours before the hearing was to start Attorney Baldwin's lawyer filed...

"Attorney Baldwin did nothing wrong. He was snookered and abused," defense lawyer David Hennessy argued in the filing.

Hennessy, a longtime defense attorney who has argued on behalf of lawyers throughout Indiana before, argued that a trusted friend to Baldwin was given access to the office space where he kept all Delphi-related items.

"He was betrayed," Hennessy wrote, arguing that Baldwin has since kept "all Delphi-related items locked in a room or a locked fireproof cabinet."

Redirect Notice

Oh please what a load of rubbish. The fact somebody could walk in and take such sensitive documents proves he isn’t fit to be a lawyer. They are clowns and I hope they get disbarred.

 

[iamshadow21]

Ok is this guy seriously down playing and saying that the girl's, two minors, that their death scene photos would have been seen by someone other than a judge, jury and of course counsel?

"It should be considered that nothing has been disclosed that won’t be disclosed at trial or hearings," Hennessy wrote."

Not just two minors who had been killed, but if the defense's Odinist fanfiction has any grain of truth, one of those girls was unclothed. And explicit photos are sometimes censored at trial. Gannon's face and groin were both blurred for trial. They wouldn't have been in the original evidence photos taken by the medical examiner. This leak wasn't benign. For all we know, some of those pictures may never have been shown to a jury at all, ruled that way on challenge by the defense. And yet they're out in the world, circulating amongst these creeps. Makes me sick.

MOO

 

[iamshadow21]

Trying to save face, but that’s a very inflammatory statement to make. They make it sound as though the judge is violating their rights. JMO

Yep, that's how it read to me. After the games they've played, going for victimhood is pretty rich.

MOO