IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #170

[katydid23]

Where is the audio and transcript?

RA didnt deny this. He admitted he said this to the CO>

 

[AugustWest]

Good Grief! I'm not sure what is going on here. I had heard about the leak, but not much after that. Certainly this is something that needs to get sorted out quickly. Who does RA want as his attorneys? I can't imagine an attorney taking a murder trial pro bono. And I am sure the victims' families are not happy about any of this either. Now another year (at least) before trial.

Judge Gull dismissed his preferred attorneys. The two who were dismissed showed up today ready to go, along with another supporting them. And here we are.

 

[photographer4]

But doesn't that apply to ALL that wait for trial?
It isn't exclusive to RA and from all that I have seen 1 to 3 years is pretty standard.

Since he has new representation, hopefully more competent representation, I would think that it would be to his advantage for them to have the proper amount of time to be prepared.


JMO

I do not know what nonsense goes on in other courts across the country but I'm not a fan of it. When you're charged with a crime, and you are 100% innocent, then I'm sorry but a year long wait to go to trial is not "speedy". 1-3 years is quite absurd really! I don't think he necessarily needed new counsel - he seemed content with the counsel he had. He was aware of the concerns of the leaked evidence and was willing to hedge his bets on them anyhow. That should be his choice. If I am not mistaken, he was summarily stripped of this right today when Justice Gull removed his attorney's of choice from the case. If she had reason to do so, then a hearing should have had to ensue. It did not. So who is she protecting? The lawyers she now contends cannot manage this case? RA? Her own backside? No, this is not acceptable. His day in court was meant to be in January, and it should STILL proceed, in January as scheduled. The delay not being his fault, but severely affecting his entire life, should not be allowed. If that means they must assign oversight to his attorneys via other counsel to approve what they're doing (eg: senior counsel to whom they play second chair), so be it. Sanctions? Sure! But the idea that they must now be fully removed, and cannot participate in his defence thus extending his time incarcerated awaiting trial is a gross miscarriage of any notion of "justice".

 

[O.Incandenza]

Good Grief! I'm not sure what is going on here. I had heard about the leak, but not much after that. Certainly this is something that needs to get sorted out quickly. Who does RA want as his attorneys? I can't imagine an attorney taking a murder trial pro bono. And I am sure the victims' families are not happy about any of this either. Now another year (at least) before trial.

He apparently wants the attorneys who withdrew/were disqualified. He filed an affidavit to that effect and was reportedly sitting with them this morning when they tried to reappear as pro bono counsel.

 

[photographer4]

Structural error. We may be passed the point of him getting handed an appeal or conviction set aside. Today she might have handed him an acquittal.
jmo

That is exactly what I think she did today - and ya know what? If he cannot access a speedy trial (which he clearly cannot based on her moving the trial a year out now), then he should be acquitted. How many innocent members here would be fully ok with sitting in jail another year without trial because a cop thought you did it??

 

[photographer4]

Yes but it’s not up to us to decide if they committed gross negligence, public opinion isn’t the authority of the courtroom. The ex-D have the right to elevate the dismissal if they chose to do so.

We don't even get to evaluate the concerns because she hasn't given the benefit of a hearing. If she had done so, then her decision and the process by which she arrived at it would have been well documented and ready for appeal. In the absence of a hearing, in the secrecy of her protected chambers? This is not justice. This is blind faith in the justice system. A faith which in this matter, I simply do not have.

 

[FrostedGlass]

It's 6:50 pm
Scremin, Baldwin, Lebrato and Rozzi are still listed on mycase as RA's attys.
The filings by Rozzi on Oct. 25 and 26 are also still listed.

 

[photographer4]

I guess she didn't let them speak much. Hennessy filed a sworn supplement to the record that if they had been permitted they would have introduced a, b, c, and d as evidence. This part is most interesting

"4. There would also be testimony that an unnecessary continuance forced by a judge would not be in the best interests of the Accused.
5. There would also be testimony that a person that has never practiced criminal defense is not competent to judge the effectiveness and necessities and quality of criminal defense representation; nor what representation is in the best interests of an Accused."
jmo

I love this filed sworn statement so much!! I'd like to know who would have made the testimony in point 4? Has she never practiced criminal defence? If not why the heck is she on the bench in such a serious matter??

 

[photographer4]

If the judge has reason to believe the pro bono attorneys had been negligent, irresponsible and unfit to represent the defendant it would be her duty to have them booted. Especially in a double murder case possibly DP case.JMO

Would she not also have to report them to someone higher up? The Bar? Ethics? Someone??? Would they not be facing possibly being disbarred? If she hasn't, and they're not - why not?

 

[photographer4]

Because there is no official record of gross negligence besides some bullet point list which is not official. The judge can’t just say “coz I said so”. She’s violating due process.

Furthermore, there is more than enough to disqualify her. In the 1970s bias was included. One of the 2 new D have already gone to do news interviews in 2022 favorable to the P about this case.

AJMO

Then how the heck is this one now representing RA???? This is an absolute mess!

 

[MistyWaters]

And yet that is what the bumbling duo submitted in an actual filing

I have some sympathy that the judge simply had had enough of these guys.

If they'd filed a professional Franks memo, focussing on the 2 key issues they raised, they might have had the hearing and booted the warrant and the client could be free by now???

I have a certain amazement for the part of the legal community who sees them as great heroes in this.

That’s a good point, that ridiculous dramatic Frank’s memo was when everything began going off the rails IMO. It would’ve far simpler to stick to business at hand and file alleging an invalid search warrant rather than laying out their entire defense strategy accusing everyone of either incompetence, deception or corruption or all three in a massive coverup of evil Odinists.

I recall when we first heard the names of the appointed defense it was mentioned B successfully had the evidence from another SW thrown out in a different case, so obviously he knows how to go about it.

BBM

What experience do court-appointed lawyers in Delphi murders case bring to the table?

INDIANAPOLIS (WISH) — After learning this week that the judge in the Delphi murders case appointed two public defenders for suspect Richard Allen, I-Team 8 started looking into the cases that Andrew Baldwin and Bradley Rozzi have handled. Richard Allen, 50, was arrested on Oct. 28 and the...

www.wishtv.com

• Baldwin is representing 16-year-old Caden Smith who was charged last year as an adult in a triple murder in Indianapolis. I-Team 8 brought this story as breaking news on Oct. 12, 2021, when the bodies of Michael James, Abdullah Mubarak, and Joseph Thomas were found along a walking path near the 4400 block of South Meridian Street. Smith was arrested in December. Baldwin, convinced the judge that some of the evidence was collected with an invalid search warrant. The judge released Smith from jail with a GPS monitor. The state is appealing the judge’s decision, and a status hearing on the case is set for early next year.

 

[katydid23]

Would she not also have to report them to someone higher up? The Bar? Ethics? Someone??? Would they not be facing possibly being disbarred? If she hasn't, and they're not - why not?

If they voluntarily walked, maybe she thought that would be a valid lesson for them. If they didn't, she was prepared to do it publicly, which would bring attention to her accusations.

 

[MistyWaters]

Because there is no official record of gross negligence besides some bullet point list which is not official. The judge can’t just say “coz I said so”. She’s violating due process.

Furthermore, there is more than enough to disqualify her. In the 1970s bias was included. One of the 2 new D have already gone to do news interviews in 2022 favorable to the P about this case.

AJMO

You think D&B forgot to ask for a copy of her prepared statement while spending almost 2 hours in her chambers on Oct 19th. It seems to me she was well prepared and had recorded the issues in writing for good reason.

 

[photographer4]

If they voluntarily walked, maybe she thought that would be a valid lesson for them. If they didn't, she was prepared to do it publicly, which would bring attention to her accusations.

Funny though, she was irritated enough with them to apparently threaten 'gross misconduct' which led to them withdrawing (or at least to Baldwin withdrawing, still not sure the other guy did!). They now basically assert they did so under what amounts to duress from her. If she'd had a hearing at the time, this would probably have not been an issue today. If she had such concerns as "gross misconduct" then I ask again, was she not obligated to report them to some higher authority? The Bar? Ethics? Someone??? She doesn't appear to have done that so... I don't know if I buy her 'gross misconduct' concern as being as heavy hitting as she wants people to think it is. I hope B&R take this higher. ALL THE WAY HIGHER.

 

[katydid23]

I do not know what nonsense goes on in other courts across the country but I'm not a fan of it. When you're charged with a crime, and you are 100% innocent, then I'm sorry but a year long wait to go to trial is not "speedy". 1-3 years is quite absurd really!

How do you know he is 100% innocent of this crime? Are you going by the 'innocent until proven guilty' premise?

When someone is charged with a Capitol crime after Probable Cause is shown, one will often be incarcerated for public safety concerns.

If he is not 100% innocent then he is right where he needs to be. IMO

I don't think he necessarily needed new counsel - he seemed content with the counsel he had. He was aware of the concerns of the leaked evidence and was willing to hedge his bets on them anyhow. That should be his choice.

I don't know if that should be totally his choice. Sometimes a defendant needs to be protected from himself. If the judge sees things that really concern her about the defense teams actions and deficiencies then maybe she feels the responsibility to act upon those concerns?

If I am not mistaken, he was summarily stripped of this right today when Justice Gull removed his attorney's of choice from the case. If she had reason to do so, then a hearing should have had to ensue. It did not.

If Baldwin had refused to withdraw then there would have been a hearing. She would have done the public statement in public court and kicked them off the case and they could have filed for emergency hearing and it would have continued that way.

So who is she protecting? The lawyers she now contends cannot manage this case? RA? Her own backside? No, this is not acceptable.

I think she intended to protect them from a public on camera harsh review of their negligence.

His day in court was meant to be in January, and it should STILL proceed, in January as scheduled. The delay not being his fault, but severely affecting his entire life, should not be allowed. If that means they must assign oversight to his attorneys via other counsel to approve what they'd doing (eg: senior counsel to whom they play second chair), so be it. Sanctions? Sure! But the idea that they must now be fully removed, and cannot participate in his defence thus extending his time incarcerated awaiting trial is a gross miscarriage of any notion of "justice".

Did you read that 140 page document they put out into the public? They publicly accused by name, various people of being involved in the ritual cult murders. That was disgusting behaviour, imo. It created a clown show. It also devolved into a tragic suicide because of incompetence on Baldwin's part.

Why wouldn't the judge want to pull the plug on their representation?

 

[FrostedGlass]

Defense attorney Shay Hughes weighs in; this is just a small portion of his post.

https://x.com/publicdefender_/status/1719483462732685456?s=20

As it relates to the removal of counsel…The Indiana Supreme Court has stated a “trial court is limited in its authority to remove a criminal defendant's court-appointed counsel.” State ex rel. Jones v. Knox Superior Court No. 1, 728 NE2d 133 (Ind. 2000). However, parameters of this authority haven’t really been analyzed.
...
As I mentioned in the post below, I’m not aware of any authority that gives Judge Gull the power to remove counsel based on the facts presented (and they don’t appear to be in dispute). #RichardAllen #Delphi #DelphiMurders

 

[Jade]

Where is the audio and transcript?

This is a true crime forum not a Court of Law, lol!

Have you seen the Probable Cause Affidavit?

Here’s another link to what we know:

When interviewed by police in 2017, Allen said he was on the trail on the afternoon of the murders, according to the probable cause affidavit.

In an Oct. 13, 2022, interview, Allen told police he saw juvenile girls on the trails east of Freedom Bridge and said he went onto the Monon High Bridge, near where the girls were killed.

This year, Allen "again admitted" to police "that he was on the trail but denied knowing Victim 1 or Victim 2 and denied any involvement in their murders," according to the probable cause affidavit.

Allen "has been consistent" in police interviews over the years, former FBI agent and ABC News contributor Brad Garrett said. "He put himself at the scene, on the bridge."


Delphi murders: What the unsealed documents reveal and the questions that remain

 

[Emma Peel]

Honestly if you file a franks memorandum where you accuse other people of the murder and say the prison guards are in on it, together with 1000s of pages of irrelevant supporting content, can you complain when the Judge doesn't hold your hearing yet?

She should have chewed them out for that and made them file it properly without the 100 pages of wild conspiracy theories.

Yes, thank you, THAT's what I'm talkin' about.
But setting boundaries? That's work.
It's easier to just remove them.

 

[Trublue21]

The accused is presumed innocent, until he is found guilty by a jury of his peers. That his constitutional rights are being violated in such a blatant manner is very concerning. We should all be concerned with this. The world is watching and RA’s attorneys are not the ones looking bad right now. This is JMO.

 

[katydid23]

That’s a good point, that ridiculous dramatic Frank’s memo was when everything began going off the rails IMO. It would’ve far simpler to stick to business at hand and file alleging an invalid search warrant rather than laying out their entire defense strategy accusing everyone of either incompetence, deception or corruption or all three in a massive coverup of evil Odinists.

I recall when we first heard the names of the appointed defense it was mentioned B successfully had the evidence from another SW thrown out in a different case, so obviously he knows how to go about it.

BBM

What experience do court-appointed lawyers in Delphi murders case bring to the table?

INDIANAPOLIS (WISH) — After learning this week that the judge in the Delphi murders case appointed two public defenders for suspect Richard Allen, I-Team 8 started looking into the cases that Andrew Baldwin and Bradley Rozzi have handled. Richard Allen, 50, was arrested on Oct. 28 and the...

www.wishtv.com

• Baldwin is representing 16-year-old Caden Smith who was charged last year as an adult in a triple murder in Indianapolis. I-Team 8 brought this story as breaking news on Oct. 12, 2021, when the bodies of Michael James, Abdullah Mubarak, and Joseph Thomas were found along a walking path near the 4400 block of South Meridian Street. Smith was arrested in December. Baldwin, convinced the judge that some of the evidence was collected with an invalid search warrant. The judge released Smith from jail with a GPS monitor. The state is appealing the judge’s decision, and a status hearing on the case is set for early next year.

And guess what happened, after Baldwin got triple murder his defendant out on bond?

Teen suspect in triple murder, previously released on GPS monitoring, arrested again for invasion of privacy

INDIANAPOLIS — A teenager who police say killed two men and a teenager has yet again been arrested after being previously released on GPS monitoring during his triple murder trial. Caden Smith was …

fox59.com

NDIANAPOLIS — A teenager who police say killed two men and a teenager has yet again been arrested after being previously released on GPS monitoring during his triple murder trial.

Caden Smith was arrested once again by the Indianapolis Metropolitan Police Department on Wednesday after he violated a restraining order and was issued a warrant for his arrest.
Smith had previously been charged with multiple offenses including murder and dangerous possession of a machine gun, connected to the death of three people in October 2021. He was just 16 years old when the incident occurred.

An arrest report shows that Smith allegedly violated a protective no-contact order while out on GPS monitoring, and that when IMPD came to arrest him this week for the violation they uncovered evidence for additional charges.

Inside his southside residence on Thompson Road, police allegedly found drugs, ammo, firearms, gun accessories, magazines and cash. Now 18, Smith currently faces three charges in the incident:



Suspect in triple murder ordered released on GPS monitoring after key evidence suppressed