IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #171

[Cyber sleuth]

Where is there proof EF was properly cleared?

RSBM
The proof of EF being cleared is probably in the discovery defense had received prior to the Frank’s memo and had not yet read or was in the discovery that was dropped off after they filed the Frank’s.
We will have to wait until trial to hear the evidence that supports that RA is correctly accused.

 

[duckcat]

RSBM
The proof of EF being cleared is probably in the discovery defense had received prior to the Frank’s memo and had not yet read or was in the discovery that was dropped off after they filed the Frank’s.
We will have to wait until trial to hear the evidence that supports that RA is correctly accused.

The difference in opinion will just depend on how much one trusts LE and the judicial branch in Carroll County. I do not. I have no particular interest in RA, i don’t have too much of an opinion about his innocence, guilt, or involvement, i just think the actual truth is being concealed regardless and there are others being protected by a corrupt system. A quick search shows decades of strange stories in that area.

Quickly about Liggett, it’s reads almost like slapstick:

Special prosecutor issues report on Liggett campaign - Carroll County Comet

The Comet sponsored a sheriff’s candidate debate on Sept. 29. After the debate, Sheriff candidate and deputy Tony Liggett provided the Comet with a special prosecutor’s report that he said “exonerated” him in regard to alleged campaign misdoing. The Comet told Liggett it did not know about a...

www.carrollcountycomet.com

Context on the former sheriffs deputy who was on scene, filed a lawsuit after being demoted for bringing the FBI into the case early on:

Sheriff’s deputy claims demotion over Delphi murders investigation

CARROLL COUNTY, Ind. — A Carroll County Sheriff’s deputy has filed a federal civil rights lawsuit against Sheriff Tobias Leazenby and the sheriff’s office claiming that he was the victi…

fox59.com

BW, who did receive some of his settlement money for this case:

Former county jail inmate claims civil rights violation - Carroll County Comet

A former Carroll County jail inmate, Brandon Woodhouse, has filed a complaint in the Northern Indiana District Court against Carroll County Sheriff Tobe Leazenby, the County Sheriff’s Department, Jailer John (as spelled in the formal complaint) Randle and Jail Commander Lori Sustarsic. The...

www.carrollcountycomet.com

Years later received “by accident” some of the leaked discovery apparently from the ex defense. He is now back in jail, which is another potentially corrupt rabbit hole, but his assigned public defender is Kurtis Fouts, a former Carroll County judge who was forced to resign after being filmed assaulting a woman. There are much stronger rumors and allegations about him in places that aren’t written but the county’s own local press. Somehow he’s still allowed to help “uphold justice” by being a public servant, assigned to citizens by default.
It isn’t unreasonable to be highly suspicious of the local legal system there, and question why they were so hesitant to allow the FBI to join their investigation, and then disregard their findings, not to mention the suspicious deaths.
Former county jail inmate claims civil rights violation - Carroll County Comet

Superior Court Judge steps down - Carroll County Comet

Carroll County Superior Court Judge Kurtis Fouts has sent a letter of resignation to Governor Eric Holcomb and will leave his position July 31. Fouts first took the bench when he was appointed to the position by Governor Mitch Daniels in 2010 to replace retiring Judge Jeffrey R. Smith. He was...

www.carrollcountycomet.com

 

[Ravenmoon]

Where is there proof EF was properly cleared? Both of his sisters (names redacted) passed a polygraph re: what they said he told them which some only someone who was there would know. The ISP officer that conducted the polygraph is now dead.

Source re: ISP Thompson’s death in a nefarious fire:
Cause of Indiana house fire that killed state trooper, daughter remains unknown

Source for the pics:

Indiana Courts Case Search - MyCase

Indiana Supreme Court, Public Access

public.courts.in.gov

DELPHI: Memorandum in Support of Motion PDF | PDF | Prosecutor | Police

They passed a polygraph because EF probably told them everything they claimed he did!

That doesn't mean he had any REAL knowledge about the crime scene. He wanted to be part of a group that he imagined was cool.

His functionality is the same as a 7 year old.
Do you think that that fits the little bit that we know about the crime scene?

He says he made "antlers" on Abby. Turns out, that just isn't the truth at all. There is nothing remotely resembling antlers on the child's head. The sticks were placed Randomly. Just because the defense put in a memo doesn't make it true!

EF isn't the only person that "confessed" to the crimes.

And if you think that EFs sisters didn't have some type of reward in mind when they went to the police, I know of a nice sidewalk for sale!

ETA

I noticed the part of the interview with EF about spitting on the girls isn't marked in red. How come,?
EF willingly allowed LE to take a swab.

I guess his DNA wasn't found at the crime scene? Probably due to the fact that he wasn't ever there.


JMO

 

[M. Kay]

Why do people think they have the wrong man?
Actually, it seems people are certain he is not the killer. Please tell me WHY?
AS ALWAYS, JMO

I don't have every answer, so I narrow my reply to your questioning why many people are "thinking they have the wrong man." Since there has been an emphasis on all that was done, in the time taken at the murder scene, my interpretation of some inquiries is whether (or how?) one single person could have been responsible. So that becomes not "who" but "how" it could be one man rather than several people. Many wondered if RA herded the girls from the bridge to another person or person(s) waiting "down the hill". i.e. he's not the single killer; I'm unaware of many (or any?) questioning his guilt, esp. after his confessing was recorded.

 

[Ravenmoon]

Well, that’s left to be seen. No doubt there’s still lots to come before this case sees a trial.
Try pages 97 & 98 of the Franks memo. We may not agree on this, and that’s fine.

Yes Agree to disagree. The 2 sisters waited for more than 2 weeks to discuss what they were told by EF. Actually, one sister.

If my brother said he was involved in a murder, I don't think that I would wait for a couple of weeks before I went to police, would you?

JMO

 

[zh0r4]

The difference in opinion will just depend on how much one trusts LE and the judicial branch in Carroll County. I do not. I have no particular interest in RA, i don’t have too much of an opinion about his innocence, guilt, or involvement, i just think the actual truth is being concealed regardless and there are others being protected by a corrupt system. A quick search shows decades of strange stories in that area.

Quickly about Liggett, it’s reads almost like slapstick:

Special prosecutor issues report on Liggett campaign - Carroll County Comet

The Comet sponsored a sheriff’s candidate debate on Sept. 29. After the debate, Sheriff candidate and deputy Tony Liggett provided the Comet with a special prosecutor’s report that he said “exonerated” him in regard to alleged campaign misdoing. The Comet told Liggett it did not know about a...

www.carrollcountycomet.com

Context on the former sheriffs deputy who was on scene, filed a lawsuit after being demoted for bringing the FBI into the case early on:

Sheriff’s deputy claims demotion over Delphi murders investigation

CARROLL COUNTY, Ind. — A Carroll County Sheriff’s deputy has filed a federal civil rights lawsuit against Sheriff Tobias Leazenby and the sheriff’s office claiming that he was the victi…

fox59.com

BW, who did receive some of his settlement money for this case:

Former county jail inmate claims civil rights violation - Carroll County Comet

A former Carroll County jail inmate, Brandon Woodhouse, has filed a complaint in the Northern Indiana District Court against Carroll County Sheriff Tobe Leazenby, the County Sheriff’s Department, Jailer John (as spelled in the formal complaint) Randle and Jail Commander Lori Sustarsic. The...

www.carrollcountycomet.com

Years later received “by accident” some of the leaked discovery apparently from the ex defense. He is now back in jail, which is another potentially corrupt rabbit hole, but his assigned public defender is Kurtis Fouts, a former Carroll County judge who was forced to resign after being filmed assaulting a woman. There are much stronger rumors and allegations about him in places that aren’t written but the county’s own local press. Somehow he’s still allowed to help “uphold justice” by being a public servant, assigned to citizens by default.
It isn’t unreasonable to be highly suspicious of the local legal system there, and question why they were so hesitant to allow the FBI to join their investigation, and then disregard their findings, not to mention the suspicious deaths.
Former county jail inmate claims civil rights violation - Carroll County Comet

Superior Court Judge steps down - Carroll County Comet

Carroll County Superior Court Judge Kurtis Fouts has sent a letter of resignation to Governor Eric Holcomb and will leave his position July 31. Fouts first took the bench when he was appointed to the position by Governor Mitch Daniels in 2010 to replace retiring Judge Jeffrey R. Smith. He was...

www.carrollcountycomet.com

Can anyone give me a quick rundown abt Prosecutor Ives? I wasn’t around then. TIA.

Wheeew this is rotten. Nothing irks me more than despicable, corrupt LE (ie apparently in Delphi) who give a bad name to 90% of LE who act with integrity.

How could they lock Woodhouse up again after the way he was treated for a confrontation with his cousin? There are situations where serious DV happens and no one is locked up like this. How can they do this?

I just learned about the injustice re: Jessie Snider too, who is now dead. I think CC needs a federal investigation into their misconduct.

AJMO.

Source (Jessie Snider):

https://cases.justia.com/federal/district-courts/indiana/inndce/4:2009cv00037/57969/105/0.pdf

 

[zh0r4]

They passed a polygraph because EF probably told them everything they claimed he did!

That doesn't mean he had any REAL knowledge about the crime scene. He wanted to be part of a group that he imagined was cool.

His functionality is the same as a 7 year old.
Do you think that that fits the little bit that we know about the crime scene?

He says he made "antlers" on Abby. Turns out, that just isn't the truth at all. There is nothing remotely resembling antlers on the child's head. The sticks were placed Randomly. Just because the defense put in a memo doesn't make it true!

EF isn't the only person that "confessed" to the crimes.

And if you think that EFs sisters didn't have some type of reward in mind when they went to the police, I know of a nice sidewalk for sale!

ETA

I noticed the part of the interview with EF about spitting on the girls isn't marked in red. How come,?
EF willingly allowed LE to take a swab.

I guess his DNA wasn't found at the crime scene? Probably due to the fact that he wasn't ever there.


JMO

With respect, it takes a lot of time 1. to go through 136 pages to find specific info then 2. Redact names and underline straight on a phone when I am afk.

The interview date by LE is underlined, then the following paragraph on that page is abt the interview. IMO anyone who is curious about information would read the entire page anyway, I was attempting to be helpful by underlining any words or sentences.


Since you’re saying EF’s DNA allegedly wasn’t at the scene therefore he is cleared, I assume that means RA is also cleared since his DNA wasn’t found at the scene?

 

[Ravenmoon]

With respect, it takes a lot of time 1. to go through 136 pages to find specific info then 2. Redact names and underline straight on a phone when I am afk.

The interview date by LE is underlined, then the following paragraph on that page is abt the interview. IMO anyone who is curious about information would read the entire page anyway, I was attempting to be helpful by underlining any words or sentences.
View attachment 460000

Since you’re saying EF’s DNA allegedly wasn’t at the scene therefore he is cleared, I assume that means RA is also cleared since his DNA wasn’t found at the scene?

I am sorry if I offended you. My issue is with people that are buying the Odin angle because it just feels so childish.

The focus, however, was on 3 specific pages regarding EF, not on the other 133.

The comment about DNA is due to the fact that he willingly gave DNA while claiming to have spit on the victims.

Do we know for certain that there is no DNA from RA at the CS?

I seem to recall that his DNA wasn't found on the girls. I could be wrong on that.

What we don't know is whether or not the girls DNA was found was found on anything that was collected from RAs home or vehicles.

EBM to say

AJMO

 

[Ravenmoon]

With respect, it takes a lot of time 1. to go through 136 pages to find specific info then 2. Redact names and underline straight on a phone when I am afk.

The interview date by LE is underlined, then the following paragraph on that page is abt the interview. IMO anyone who is curious about information would read the entire page anyway, I was attempting to be helpful by underlining any words or sentences.
View attachment 460000

Since you’re saying EF’s DNA allegedly wasn’t at the scene therefore he is cleared, I assume that means RA is also cleared since his DNA wasn’t found at the scene?

I also don't want to use the lack of DNA for EF not being the culprit. It's more than that.

I would have to be a part of "Odinists are responsible" squad to believe he is responsible. I'm not. I would also have to believe that a disabled man with the mind of a 7 year old overpowered, controled, murdered and staged these kids and has gotten away with it for all of these years AFTER making claims that he did it OR at the very least participated.

I am just not buying what the ex d is selling. Nope. Not for a minute.


JMO

 

[zh0r4]

I am sorry if I offended you. My issue is with people that are buying the Odin angle because it just feels so childish.

The focus, however, was on 3 specific pages regarding EF, not on the other 133.

The comment about DNA is due to the fact that he willingly gave DNA while claiming to have spit on the victims.

Do we know for certain that there is no DNA from RA at the CS?

I seem to recall that his DNA wasn't found on the girls. I could be wrong on that.

What we don't know is whether or not the girls DNA was found was found on anything that was collected from RAs home or vehicles.

EBM to say

AJMO

p. 129

Source:

Indiana Courts Case Search - MyCase

Indiana Supreme Court, Public Access

public.courts.in.gov

DELPHI: Memorandum in Support of Motion PDF | PDF | Prosecutor | Police

 

[susiQ]

Yes Agree to disagree. The 2 sisters waited for more than 2 weeks to discuss what they were told by EF. Actually, one sister.

If my brother said he was involved in a murder, I don't think that I would wait for a couple of weeks before I went to police, would you?

JMO

Probably not, but do keep in mind this young man has the mind of a child, if what people say about him is true. I could forgive the sister for taking the time to process what she heard and decide whether or not he had dreamt it or it actually happened. I applaud her for doing what she did and then pushing for someone to actually take her seriously.

So, on the one hand you question why she would wait two weeks to go to authorities, but OTOH you don’t question that they didn’t take her seriously and follow up immediately? Can’t have it both ways now can we?

 

[Emma Peel]

FWIW ... EF is in his 50's.

 

[Ravenmoon]

View attachment 460029
p. 129

Source:

Indiana Courts Case Search - MyCase

Indiana Supreme Court, Public Access

public.courts.in.gov

DELPHI: Memorandum in Support of Motion PDF | PDF | Prosecutor | Police

Thank you! I couldn't remember, I knew something similar was said.

But, I digress, were the girls DNA present on things recovered from RA's home, belongings or vehicles

JMO

 

[Ravenmoon]

Probably not, but do keep in mind this young man has the mind of a child, if what people say about him is true. I could forgive the sister for taking the time to process what she heard and decide whether or not he had dreamt it or it actually happened. I applaud her for doing what she did and then pushing for someone to actually take her seriously.

So, on the one hand you question why she would wait two weeks to go to authorities, but OTOH you don’t question that they didn’t take her seriously and follow up immediately? Can’t have it both ways now can we?

I imagine that there was no reason to suspect EF at all. Plus, I don't know anything about the sisters at all. I assume LE does.


JMO

 

[zh0r4]

Thank you! I couldn't remember, I knew something similar was said.

But, I digress, were the girls DNA present on things recovered from RA's home, belongings or vehicles

JMO

The way I interpreted what was said in the Depos with Liggett and Holeman, is that there is no DNA at the CS or RA’s house connecting him to the CS (so either way).

JMI (just my interpretation ~.^)

 

[StarryStarryNight]

Where is there proof EF was properly cleared? Both of his sisters (names redacted) passed a polygraph re: what they said he told them which some only someone who was there would know. The ISP officer that conducted the polygraph is now dead.

Source re: ISP Thompson’s death in a nefarious fire:
Cause of Indiana house fire that killed state trooper, daughter remains unknown

Source for the pics:

Indiana Courts Case Search - MyCase

Indiana Supreme Court, Public Access

public.courts.in.gov

DELPHI: Memorandum in Support of Motion PDF | PDF | Prosecutor | Police

The Franks memo is not fact. It is the opinion and speculation of the ex-dense team.

 

[StarryStarryNight]

The way I interpreted what was said in the Depos with Liggett and Holeman, is that there is no DNA at the CS or RA’s house connecting him to the CS (so either way).

JMI (just my interpretation ~.^)

The Franks memo is not fact, including the parts where ex-defense gives their opinions and speculation on how cited material should be interpreted.

 

[zh0r4]

The Franks memo is not fact, including the parts where ex-defense gives their opinions and speculation on how cited material should be interpreted.

Regardless of what bias anyone has about the ex-defense, depositions are a part of the legal process. It’s insulting to insinuate any lawyer would falsify depositions in legal documents and risk their entire career with no proof that falsification occurred & based solely on personal bias. JMHO.

 

[Ravenmoon]

Regardless of what bias anyone has about the ex-defense, depositions are a part of the legal process. It’s insulting to insinuate any lawyer would falsify depositions in legal documents and risk their entire career with no proof that falsification occurred & based solely on personal bias. JMHO.

Ugh. The exD is who are insulting.
From allowing friends access to crime scene photos, to repeating how one girl suffered a slow death, to publicly naming people they want investigating.... and on and on.


JMO

 

[susiQ]

FWIW ... EF is in his 50's.

Thanks for the correction. He’s in his 50’s and has the mind of a child. Got it!