IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #173

[mrjitty]

I also have the feeling that the best shot for the defence is to kill the search warrant and get the case dismissed pretrial - and they've gone that route rather than a bail hearing

As @O.Incandenza said, if it goes to trial and the prosecution has recorded admissions, a foolish police interview, the bullet, the video, and the timeline, IMO it's a decent case, even if no one thing is super strong.

 

[Justice101]

I also have the feeling that the best shot for the defence is to kill the search warrant and get the case dismissed pretrial - and they've gone that route rather than a bail hearing

As @O.Incandenza said, if it goes to trial and the prosecution has recorded admissions, a foolish police interview, the bullet, the video, and the timeline, IMO it's a decent case, even if no one thing is super strong.

Sorry, not following you exactly. what is the "foolish police interview"? thanks

 

[mrjitty]

Sorry, not following you exactly. what is the "foolish police interview"? thanks

Both times he spoke to law enforcement. Without those they would let have probable cause for the search warrant.

 

[arielilane]

My entire post was to show why I don't think KAK will be brought up at RA's trial, in response to your post about the same subject.

Sorry, I guessed wrong, I don't know what you meant by KAK has elements. But it still stands that KAK can't be presented as an alternate suspect without MOM, and my argument is that the defense will not have anything that qualifies as admissible evidence to offer him as an alternate suspect.

I don't think LE will be called to the stand to testify, especially about the 2020 interrogation where KAK is told they don't think he is the murderer. (link to transcript below) Absent from the transcript, accusations of being at the crime scene. LE was looking for 2 things, did KAK know about the bridge plans and did he somehow let someone else know.
Asking those questions does not give RA's defense court admissible evidence that KAK is the alternate suspect.

KAK is not the man on the bridge, my opinion only but I think it is widely accepted. The FBI could testify that they estimated the height of the suspect, he was short.

KAK does not have any convictions or even accusations of assault or forcible sexual contact. Indiana Courts Case Search - MyCase

I agree with the retired FBI agent's opinion.

Retired FBI agent on Kegan Kline transcript: ‘This interview looked to me a little bit like a Hail Mary’​

Retired FBI agent on Kegan Kline transcript: 'This interview looked to me a little bit like a Hail Mary'

INDIANAPOLIS (WISH) — I-Team 8 continues to dig into the shocking discovery obtained by I-Team 8 surrounding the Delphi murders. It’s a story we first reported Thursday on WISHTV.com and it involves new evidence police might have in the deaths of Abby Williams and Libby German. On Friday, I-Team...

www.wishtv.com

https://www.wishtv.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/03/Tx-statement-Kegan-Kline-10-19-2-FINAL-VERSION-Redacted-1.pdf

Appreciate your response, however, I believe you misunderstood my initial post.

In the grand scheme of things the public does not know the actual facts of the case. More importantly, is Abby & Libby will get justice, and I believe we can agree on that. Hope you are having a super day!

A few points from the article:

• This guy clearly is a suspect.
• The fact that he was communicating with this victim under illegal and indecent reasons, then this person’s dead, certainly makes him a suspect.
• Tabman said it’s important to note, he doesn’t know every detail the Delphi investigative team knows.
• The interview also gives the first public indication that police believe two people used the Anthony Shots account.
• Tabman said the interview is clear police are looking for someone else who used the account.

Post is an opinion only!

 

[FrostedGlass]

There are 2 things I took away from the KAK interrogation.
First: there were 2 (or more) using that account.
Second: the unknown was the one who liked little girls.

I really wanted them to give KAK a plea in return for naming that second person. Maybe if they had threatened him with the years he ended up getting, plus more, he would have come clean. Maybe he could have even helped LE identify the individuals who taught those little children and young girls to do some of the things they did.

When they found him guilty of CSAM and nothing else, I think that kind of excludes him from being brought up in a jury trial.

 

[sunshineray]

Instead of “tracking down every prison”, do you have a source for 1 single case you had in mind?

No, do you? TIA

 

[Jurisprudence]

His speedy trial demand was signed and defense notified the court that it would be filed in the beginning of November - that's when all of the explosions happened. Not a coincidence. These papers are attached as exhibits to the original actions that have been linked here many times.

 

[Jurisprudence]

That is the definition of a civil rights crisis ... and you're right ... it's a widespread problem.

Here's hoping no innocent-until-proven-guilty detainees with 3-year trial delays in Seattle get hannibal-lectered for 3 years.

It's no wonder so many found guilty (lesser crimes) manage to walk w/ time served. JMHO

Yet Indiana (different county) has an admitted child killer whose body was found buried on his property in pretrial detention in a county jail without incident. It's only this Delphi case that seems to have the problem. (Valerie Tindall/Patrick Scott)

'It just kind of happened' | Rush County man allegedly claimed 17-year-old 'came on to him,' so he strangled her

Patrick Scott, 59, was arrested Nov. 28 and charged with murder after human remains were found buried on his property.

www.wthr.com

This is directly on topic. RA should not be in a correctional institution as a pretrial detainee. Most LE and state prosecutors recognize this.

 

[Jurisprudence]

Motion to Transfer - 1/12/2024
Filed by Scremin
6 pages

Source:

Indiana Courts Case Search - MyCase

Indiana Supreme Court, Public Access

public.courts.in.gov

2024 1/12: Defense Motion to Transfer Allen

drive.google.com

Abhorrent.
jmo

 

[zh0r4]

There are 2 things I took away from the KAK interrogation.
First: there were 2 (or more) using that account.
Second: the unknown was the one who liked little girls.

I really wanted them to give KAK a plea in return for naming that second person. Maybe if they had threatened him with the years he ended up getting, plus more, he would have come clean. Maybe he could have even helped LE identify the individuals who taught those little children and young girls to do some of the things they did.

When they found him guilty of CSAM and nothing else, I think that kind of excludes him from being brought up in a jury trial.

Interesting, I never heard there were 2 or more ppl using that account. Do they have any idea who the other person/people were?

 

[zh0r4]

No, do you? TIA

No but I didn’t claim this was normal in the U.S. court system. I have been looking for other situations like (where a suspect who hasn’t had a trial is kept in prison like a convicted murderer) and I haven’t found one. So to say this is common/not abnormal is inaccurate. JMO.

 

[Caylee Advocate]

Snipped from an old article most have read I think


"The original safe keeping order in November based on the chief at the time over concerns the Carroll County Jail could not hold Allen safely. He admitted during testimony that his concerns were based on the possibility of threats and not on any actual threat made against Allen or the sheriff’s department.

Allen’s defense attorney said he had previously worked out a plan for Allen to be moved to the Cass County Jail, but that plan is being opposed by the prosecutor. The Cass County sheriff said in court Thursday morning, “We don’t want him” because of the additional security issues involved with housing a high-profile inmate, but he said that his facility is well suited to house Allen.

The sheriff said he is willing to accept Allen if ordered to do so by the court. The Cass County Jail is only 20 minutes from Delphi and provides much easier access for attorneys to meet with their clients, according to the sheriff."

PROSECUTOR: Suspect in Delphi murders made ‘incriminating’ statements while in prison

Richard Allen, arrested in the 2017 Delphi murders, appeared in court Thursday morning for an important day of hearings in the case.

www.21alivenews.com

 

[Jurisprudence]

Interesting, I never heard there were 2 or more ppl using that account. Do they have any idea who the other person/people were?

I believe they did. (But he is not a suspect from what I understand)

 

[MichMan015]

Oh yes- if I remember correctly they both needed to be at the same address. Which limited the number of possible other perps.

 

[mrjitty]

There are 2 things I took away from the KAK interrogation.
First: there were 2 (or more) using that account.
Second: the unknown was the one who liked little girls.

I really wanted them to give KAK a plea in return for naming that second person. Maybe if they had threatened him with the years he ended up getting, plus more, he would have come clean. Maybe he could have even helped LE identify the individuals who taught those little children and young girls to do some of the things they did.

When they found him guilty of CSAM and nothing else, I think that kind of excludes him from being brought up in a jury trial.

I guess what I struggle with, is at least with KAK there is one bad thing, that demonstrably links him to the victim, just not the murder. With the Odinists, there is literally nothing to link them, except the hearsay confession. So I wonder if a judge will even allow it.

 

[FrostedGlass]

I guess what I struggle with, is at least with KAK there is one bad thing, that demonstrably links him to the victim, just not the murder. With the Odinists, there is literally nothing to link them, except the hearsay confession. So I wonder if a judge will even allow it.

Just because we've seen nothing to link them does not mean there is nothing. Remember... Click's letter. When we get to read that, learn all the details of the crime scene, injuries to the girl's bodies, etc, then maybe we can agree on whether there is nothing or something.

We have heard absolutely nothing about the crime scene itself. I think that's telling.

 

[sunshineray]

No but I didn’t claim this was normal in the U.S. court system. I have been looking for other situations like (where a suspect who hasn’t had a trial is kept in prison like a convicted murderer) and I haven’t found one. So to say this is common/not abnormal is inaccurate. JMO.

I never said it was common, I said chances are, in the whole United States, RA is not an anomaly in this regard. It was in reaction to a statement saying categorically that no murder defendants are ever housed in a prison. If you don't agree with my opinion that's fine because what I've said has been All Just My Opinion (AJMO)

 

[mrjitty]

Just because we've seen nothing to link them does not mean there is nothing. Remember... Click's letter. When we get to read that, learn all the details of the crime scene, injuries to the girl's bodies, etc, then maybe we can agree on whether there is nothing or something.

We have heard absolutely nothing about the crime scene itself. I think that's telling.

I think if anything linked the suspects to the murders it would have been in the Franks memo. As it was they were scrounging for any random facebook post that somehow was similar to another facebook post

Rather what we saw was an investigative theory based on a possible Occult staging, that found no substantive links.

 

[Justice101]

Appreciate your response, however, I believe you misunderstood my initial post.

In the grand scheme of things the public does not know the actual facts of the case. More importantly, is Abby & Libby will get justice, and I believe we can agree on that. Hope you are having a super day!

A few points from the article:

• This guy clearly is a suspect.
• The fact that he was communicating with this victim under illegal and indecent reasons, then this person’s dead, certainly makes him a suspect.
• Tabman said it’s important to note, he doesn’t know every detail the Delphi investigative team knows.
• The interview also gives the first public indication that police believe two people used the Anthony Shots account.
• Tabman said the interview is clear police are looking for someone else who used the account.

Post is an opinion only!

I thought the 2 people that used the AShots account were KK and his father

 

[FrostedGlass]

I think if anything linked the suspects to the murders it would have been in the Franks memo. As it was they were scrounging for any random facebook post that somehow was similar to another facebook post

Rather what we saw was an investigative theory based on a possible Occult staging, that found no substantive links.

First off, I'll give you an A+ for the creative manner in which you hand-waved the points away.
It didn't take any scrounging at all to find the FB stuff; I even easily found it. Search the individuals and it's all there.

Click seemed to believe in his investigation. I'm not sure it's accurate to say no substantive links were found until we learn how they were followed up on. It isn't unheard of LE having suspects they did not follow up on, for whatever reason.

What is your idea of what the entire crime scene looked like? Do you think it was just 2 bodies in the woods, with twigs strewn over them?