Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #108

[rosesfromangels]

I really like your question SEATTLESTEW !!!
Before I tip-toe out of this room, could I please add, a sketch is not a photo (duh!), a photo is not a sketch (duh!), adding one word to a phrase after 2 years will solve this case (duh!), and even better....just switch heads, after 2 years, on the 2 second clip and voila, you will have your killer (duh!). And all we need is ONE, just one itsy-bitsy tiny tip and all the LE agencies and resources involved in this case for the last two years will finally be able to close their books on this perp???
Be assured, I like Supt Carter (probably have a mild Carter-crush, too. Ya' know a man-in-uniform kind of interest?) but I just can't figure out who/why this odd "squeeze play" by LE.

I have a notion I just can't shake off, and I keep trying to run it through my logic filter; no luck there. Why do I keep having this speculation that there are a fair amount of people (affiliated; a connected group of sorts), that absolutely know who did this, and are staying silent?! This is not a particularly logical or rational thought, but I can't seem to shake it.
Perhaps it's time to take a walk and get some fresh air...

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[tresir2012]

This is plausible, but my question would than be if he came from the south, why did he kill them on the north side of the creek? He'd have to recross the creek or bridge to get back?

It was secluded and most people think he left via the cemetery to the north.

 

[rosesfromangels]

DBM - Duplicate

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[TL4S]

It was secluded and most people think he left via the cemetery to the north.

If he came from the south, but left from the north, where does he live or how is he getting around? In my mind he at least had to have the same beginning and end spot, but there could be lots of scenarios that might account for different ones. So much to consider.

 

[tresir2012]

If he came from the south, but left from the north, where does he live or how is he getting around? In my mind he at least had to have the same beginning and end spot, but there could be lots of scenarios that might account for different ones. So much to consider.

Quickly according to LE.
>>>>>>>>>

That's not helpful. But I wonder if he worked for Mears or Logan doing odd jobs and maybe borrowing a vehicle to get around or something like that. Alternatively, did he work for highways or other public services and his vehicle went unnoticed parked by the CPS building.

 

[MistyWaters]

BBM

Assuming BG first spotted the girls near their drop off point, he may have followed them from quite a distance down the path towards the bridge, assuming that they would not cross (this assumption is based on the fact it is illegal to be on the bridge and they girls were so young). They may or may not have even noticed him. He might have been planning to ambush them in the woods on the North side, but when the girls did go across the bridge they foiled his plans, at least for the moment. He could have hid and waited for the girls to get at least halfway across the bridge before he got on the bridge himself, thus essentially trapping them. He proabably crossed to make sure that the girls were not meeting anybody at the SE end and/or that there weren't any potential witnesses coming from that direction. He may also have been checking them out to make certain in his mind that they would be 'good' victims. Somehow I think he knew/assumed that the girls needed to get back to the other side of the bridge, so he assumed they would make their way back either across or through the woods. So he crossed back and waited to intercept them on the North side as he had originally planned.

You raise an excellent point. If this crime was the least bit premeditated the killer may have had the means to know the girls might walk onto the bridge but he couldn’t have known they’d walk all the way across to the SE end.

Just another theory - he started across the bridge from the NW end, the girls proceeded to the SE end to avoid walking past him midway n the bridge. They walked beyond the bridge waiting for him to cross and go his way or turn back. Near the end he did turn back so the girls began walking behind him but he suddenly at some point he did an about face, turned and began walking toward them. While Libby may have been alarmed, curiosity or confusion for the reason of his unexpected turn-about may have prevented fear from immediately taking hold.

But this is assuming the killer was a total stranger. If he wasn’t, then there’s many other possibilities including him simply approaching, asking to talk to them “down the hill” off the bridge. JMO

 

[Jamie737]

This is plausible, but my question would be if he came from the south, why did he kill them on the north side of the creek? He'd have to recross the creek or bridge to get back?

But was the find site the site of the murders? Or were they taken there, perhaps by ATV or even on horseback?

I still don’t see how and why he would cross the creek to kill there.

 

[Intrigued25]

If the POI was a friend of the family or somehow connected he may have simply told the girls DG asked him to pick them up and to follow him "down the hill"

 

[TL4S]

You raise an excellent point. If this crime was the least bit premeditated the killer may have had the means to know the girls might walk onto the bridge but he couldn’t have known they’d walk all the way across to the SE end.

Just another theory - he started across the bridge from the NW end, the girls proceeded to the SE end to avoid walking past him midway n the bridge. They walked beyond the bridge waiting for him to cross and go his way or turn back. Near the end he did turn back so the girls began walking behind him but he suddenly at some point he did an about face, turned and began walking toward them. While Libby may have been alarmed, curiosity or confusion for the reason of his unexpected turn-about may have prevented fear from immediately taking hold.

But this is assuming the killer was a total stranger. If he wasn’t, then there’s many other possibilities including him simply approaching, asking to talk to them “down the hill” off the bridge. JMO

That would be spooky. My mind is trying to wrap around the times. Since the FBI posters used 2:30 as the last seen time, I'm okay with assuming (for now) that that was the time of the BG video. So how long did the girls take on the trail and crossing the bridge? Or did they mess around at the end of the bridge for awhile?

Also, we see BG moving towards them in the video, but we don't have any way of knowing what he had previously been doing on the bridge. Was he pacing around, like he was waiting for them to come back across? Was he yelling stuff at them? Had he stood in one place for awhile? Peed off the bridge? You know what I mean? We have no idea why Libby started filming.

 

[TL4S]

But was the find site the site of the murders? Or were they taken there, perhaps by ATV or even on horseback?

I still don’t see how and why he would cross the creek to kill there.

IMO, the location they were found is the location they were killed.

And I also don't see why he would cross the creek to kill there, which is why I've taken so much thread space trying to figure out an alternate way to put them all in that location.

 

[somequestions]

I would be surprised if the person who killed Abigail Williams and Liberty German was someone they knew. The killer in this case appears to be a stranger.

In the December 2017 Dr. Phil interview, Abby's mother said that Abby's hair was messed up while put in a bun, wearing blue jeans, her mother's old shirt, and Abby had Libby's sweatshirt on.

I think there is a tendency to overanalyze a case when the killer appears to be a stranger, because that means the killer could be anyone. Until there is some new information or police finally get that "right" tip that leads them to a name, I think this case is not going to get any closer to being solved than it was 2 years ago. I think this case will get solved eventually but eventually could be tomorrow or 20 years from now.

 

[MistyWaters]

I'm just not convinced he came from the south, but if he did, I don't understand him exiting to the north. IMO, it's one or the other.

That would be spooky. My mind is trying to wrap around the times. Since the FBI posters used 2:30 as the last seen time, I'm okay with assuming (for now) that that was the time of the BG video. So how long did the girls take on the trail and crossing the bridge? Or did they mess around at the end of the bridge for awhile?

Also, we see BG moving towards them in the video, but we don't have any way of knowing what he had previously been doing on the bridge. Was he pacing around, like he was waiting for them to come back across? Was he yelling stuff at them? Had he stood in one place for awhile? Peed off the bridge? You know what I mean? We have no idea why Libby started filming.

Yes that’s right, we have no idea why Libby began filming but there must’ve been a reason. When confronted with the unexpected it’s normal for our human minds to attempt to rationalize what we see. Fear is not always the initial reaction.

 

[Boxer]

MOO Where he came from and how he left:

Theae are the only times I think are established in public media, scattered.

2:07 Girls on bridge
2:30 ?? LG video of BG
2:42-2:44+- CE arrives at MHB starts to walk across, hears and sees nothing.
2:47 FSG sees BG ?
2:49 CE on south side of MHB takes photo of bridge.
2:55/3:00+- FSG arrives at north end of MHB. Hears couple arguing?
3:11 DG call to LG rings but is not answered.

 

[MistyWaters]

I would be surprised if the person who killed Abigail Williams and Liberty German was someone they knew. The killer in this case appears to be a stranger.

In the December 2017 Dr. Phil interview, Abby's mother said that Abby's hair was messed up while put in a bun, wearing blue jeans, her mother's old shirt, and Abby had Libby's sweatshirt on.

I think there is a tendency to overanalyze a case when the killer appears to be a stranger, because that means the killer could be anyone. Until there is some new information or police finally get that "right" tip that leads them to a name, I think this case is not going to get any closer to being solved than it was 2 years ago. I think this case will get solved eventually but eventually could be tomorrow or 20 years from now.

If the killer was someone both or either knew even in passing, there’s no indication a meeting was prearranged. Had it been I think there’d have been an arrest early on. But given LE has turned their sights back to someone younger with some sort of connection to Delphi, the odds are somewhat greater the killer didn’t choose his victims randomly.

 

[TL4S]

Yes that’s right, we have no idea why Libby began filming but there must’ve been a reason. When confronted with the unexpected it’s normal for our human minds to attempt to rationalize what we see. Fear is not always the initial reaction.

I agree. Which is why I won't dismiss the idea that they simply never thought to call for help until it was too late. Even if they were afraid, maybe they were thinking more about what to do and where to go than to call someone and report it, especially if they still had some distance between them and BG. IDK

 

[Boxer]

I agree. Which is why I won't dismiss the idea that they simply never thought to call for help until it was too late. Even if they were afraid, maybe they were thinking more about what to do and where to go than to call someone and report it, especially if they still had some distance between them and BG. IDK

MOO I agree, they had no time, they got sucker rushed. Look at the speed of the whole crime.

 

[TL4S]

MOO Where he came from and how he left:

Theae are the only times I think are established in public media, scattered.

2:07 Girls on bridge
2:30 ?? LG video of BG
2:42-2:44+- CE arrives at MHB starts to walk across, hears and sees nothing.
2:47 FSG sees BG ?
2:49 CE on south side of MHB takes photo of bridge.
2:55/3:00+- FSG arrives at north end of MHB. Hears couple arguing?
3:11 DG call to LG rings but is not answered.

Okay, I'm totally lost now. If these people were all on the bridge, how was nothing seen or heard? If these are all factual and accurate, than the theory that makes the most sense is indeed BG marched them down the hill, across the creek, killed them, and left, all within 12-14 minutes of the video. Which LE has said is wrong. WTF

 

[Boxer]

Police did say they were killed within minutes of the video, but I have no idea how it really fits together.

 

[MsFacetious]

I agree. LE has repeatedly stated the purpose of the release of the audio was so somebody might identify the voice and provide that “one tip” they’re looking for.

LE is not interested in the general public attempting to figure out how the crime occurred, they only want to know who’s responsible. Therefore no explanation has been offered with the limited information that’s been released.

However, I think if they had more clear, casual audio of BG than the audio they've released, they would release it.

I believe what is left is too disturbing to release. If there was casual conversation with BG about asking directions that certainly would have been released to aid in identifying him.

I don't think they have anything else in his voice that isn't disturbing... and that's why they haven't released any more. Though, if they do have more audio it might trigger someone who's been abused by him and suspects he might be BG to finally report. Who knows.

 

[Daisyeve]

I have a notion I just can't shake off, and I keep trying to run it through my logic filter; no luck there. Why do I keep having this speculation that there are a fair amount of people (affiliated; a connected group of sorts), that absolutely know who did this, and are staying silent?! This is not a particularly logical or rational thought, but I can't seem to shake it.
Perhaps it's time to take a walk and get some fresh air...

Amateur opinion and speculation

I felt that way when I first read over this post recently and I still do so guess I need to go for a walk too.

 

[Jess.Jess]

I really like your question SEATTLESTEW !!!
Before I tip-toe out of this room, could I please add, a sketch is not a photo (duh!), a photo is not a sketch (duh!), adding one word to a phrase after 2 years will solve this case (duh!), and even better....just switch heads, after 2 years, on the 2 second clip and voila, you will have your killer (duh!). And all we need is ONE, just one itsy-bitsy tiny tip and all the LE agencies and resources involved in this case for the last two years will finally be able to close their books on this perp???
Be assured, I like Supt Carter (probably have a mild Carter-crush, too. Ya' know a man-in-uniform kind of interest?) but I just can't figure out who/why this odd "squeeze play" by LE.

Indiana state police releasing one word after 2 years of no turn up.. is equivalent to Portugal police releasing sketch of the kidnapper in the missing case of Madeleine McCann

(Please refer to photo)

 

[Jamie737]

Indiana state police releasing one word after 2 years of no turn up.. is equivalent to Portugal police releasing sketch of the kidnapper in the missing case of Madeleine McCann

(Please refer to photo)

They needed some excuse for the press conference. I’ve always thought it was a play on the conscience of those that could provide actual information and no more.