Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #130

[Spartygirl]

This link pertains to the release of the first sketch, the older guy, July, 2017.

Correct
I was just saying why would BG pass by another girl/girls/guys and go for A & L ??
No matter if first sketch where we all thought for 2 yrs was BG or 2nd sketch... I am just questioning why Libby ?? why Abby ?? Why not someone else that was there that day ??
The 2nd sketch was also done at the beginning so he passed others also.. again.. why not the witness who saw him??
Why Libby ?? Why Abby ??

 

[Charlot123]

I suspect I read it as well...

Right, and I i

Fetlife is crowded with psychopathic sexual sadists. If I found out that someone I knew was on that site, I would ghost that person in a New York minute.
Most psychopaths never commit murder, but that's only because the urge never strikes them. None of them would give a second thought to killing if it advanced their personal goals.
Here in Detroit we had a BDSM guy, Bob Bashara, who paid a handyman to kill his wife a few years ago. (He just died in prison.)

Not a laughing matter, but wonder that handyman gave him the lowest contractor's estimate for the job...

And - shockingly, from the attorney:

"May his soul rest in peace," said Lillian Diallo, who was Bashara's attorney during his murder trial. "He had a tortured existence the last few years of his life, and hopefully he will be accepted into the arms of the Lord."

I mean, she probably is a good attorney and fought for her client, but accepted in the arms of Lord? Come on...

 

[Spartygirl]

I agree with most of the paper on serial killers although many serial killers are very charismatic and quite charming. The part where he talks about the victims being objects is so true, that’s how they can kill someone and not feel bad about it. They depersonalize the victim. I talked to a psychopath at my work one day and he couldn’t understand why his neighbors were so outraged at him for killing his dog. He claimed “it was my dog to do what I pleased”. That is how they think, it’s crazy but they think of their victims as property.

And WELCOME TO WS @Pyschsandi

 

[ReadySet]

Because only Libby and Abby were headed to the end of the bridge, with no one else around.

Correct
I was just saying why would BG pass by another girl/girls/guys and go for A & L ??
No matter if first sketch where we all thought for 2 yrs was BG or 2nd sketch... I am just questioning why Libby ?? why Abby ?? Why not someone else that was there that day ??
The 2nd sketch was also done at the beginning so he passed others also.. again.. why not the witness who saw him??
Why Libby ?? Why Abby ??

 

[Andreee]

Correct
I was just saying why would BG pass by another girl/girls/guys and go for A & L ??
No matter if first sketch where we all thought for 2 yrs was BG or 2nd sketch... I am just questioning why Libby ?? why Abby ?? Why not someone else that was there that day ??
The 2nd sketch was also done at the beginning so he passed others also.. again.. why not the witness who saw him??
Why Libby ?? Why Abby ??

Because he basically cornered Abby and Libby in a more secluded area is why. The witness was closer to the main area of the trails and anyone could've happened by, and not as safe of a target.

 

[MistyWaters]

Correct
I was just saying why would BG pass by another girl/girls/guys and go for A & L ??
No matter if first sketch where we all thought for 2 yrs was BG or 2nd sketch... I am just questioning why Libby ?? why Abby ?? Why not someone else that was there that day ??
The 2nd sketch was also done at the beginning so he passed others also.. again.. why not the witness who saw him??
Why Libby ?? Why Abby ??

Oh sorry, my apologies I misunderstood. One brief glance at the “not blue eyes” made me think to myself oh please, let’s not go there again lol

 

[MistyWaters]

Because he basically cornered Abby and Libby in a more secluded area is why. The witness was closer to the main area of the trails and anyone could've happened by, and not as safe of a target.

Makes sense to me.

 

[MistyWaters]

Because only Libby and Abby were headed to the end of the bridge, with no one else around.

Plus we don’t know where others might’ve sighted him. The total Delphi Historic Trail consists of 10 miles. If he was sighted on another section this could be why LE didn’t place priority on this tip initially.

 

[Spartygirl]

Oh sorry, my apologies I misunderstood. One brief glance at the “not blue eyes” made me think to myself oh please, let’s not go there again lol

UGH!!! I know
I wanted to delete that part of the interview with the "blue eyes" but felt not appropriate
Still... I do not want to bring that up.... again,
LOL

 

[Ravenmoon]

Correct
I was just saying why would BG pass by another girl/girls/guys and go for A & L ??
No matter if first sketch where we all thought for 2 yrs was BG or 2nd sketch... I am just questioning why Libby ?? why Abby ?? Why not someone else that was there that day ??
The 2nd sketch was also done at the beginning so he passed others also.. again.. why not the witness who saw him??
Why Libby ?? Why Abby ??

My thought- they were trapped at the end of the bridge. They fell into his trap. Libby had been yelled at previously by a home owner about trespassing, plus- the time for DG to pick them up was closing in. Even if the girls were uncomfortable with him, they never could have imagined what he had in store. It is a terrible reality that these2 kids unknowingly stumbled into a killer's world. A terrible twist of fate.

 

[K.jill]

ok so I don't want to get too carried away with who ran where and how the abduction went down...all I can say is if you are ever in a situation like this you have to ask yourself..will he really shoot her dead right here? doesn't he have her anyway? for children this is an emotional equation that is far too difficult and thats why children are easy victims.

fight fight fight. even with a gun or a knife...and if you run...remember to serpentine!

for some reason I got this weird notion like a voice in my head...and this falls into the ( not a random killing pile)

okay here goes:

what if this crime was not sexual in nature, but was about something sexual?

mOO

I do not understand your last sentence and I would like to. Can you elaborate? I understand a crime that was not sexual in nature. But about something sexual...

 

[janewall]

My thought- they were trapped at the end of the bridge. They fell into his trap. Libby had been yelled at previously by a home owner about trespassing, plus- the time for DG to pick them up was closing in. Even if the girls were uncomfortable with him, they never could have imagined what he had in store. It is a terrible reality that these2 kids unknowingly stumbled into a killer's world. A terrible twist of fate.

In addition to the factors cited by you and others (location, location, location!) it could be as simple as one or the other of Abby/Libby was more his "type" and fit whatever his kill fantasy was better than the first girl he encountered. Revolting, but plausible.

 

[stattlich1]

Correct
I was just saying why would BG pass by another girl/girls/guys and go for A & L ??
No matter if first sketch where we all thought for 2 yrs was BG or 2nd sketch... I am just questioning why Libby ?? why Abby ?? Why not someone else that was there that day ??
The 2nd sketch was also done at the beginning so he passed others also.. again.. why not the witness who saw him??
Why Libby ?? Why Abby ??

I don't recall factual evidence stating that the witnesses that led to the sketches saw who they think may have been BG on the trail. Is it true that is surely where they claim to have seen someone?

In particular the female witness, that says she was close enough to see his eyes were not blue, but could not tell LE what color they were. Is is stated as fact that she saw this person on the trail, or could it have been at another location, say, out on the road, or in town at a convenience store, etc.?

 

[stattlich1]

I find it interesting, the AP news article mentioned a page or two back, has this quote "Riley said investigators believe the man in the photos and in the new artist’s sketch killed both girls." That 'new artist's sketch' is the old sketch of BG.

The reason I bring this up is, it was stated as fact, at that time, that the old sketch was a sketch of the man believed to be the man on the bridge, and the man that killed both girls. And as we now know, this man in this first sketch, is not the man LE is currently seeking, rather, it is the man represented by the second sketch, unless, one wishes to believe that the sketches are of the same man, and that he, in reality will be a blend of the two sketches. Although it was also said, at one time, that the first sketch is now a man of no interest, or secondary interest in the case, meaning to me, that the man in the first sketch is clearly a different POI than the man in the second sketch. No wonder there is confusion relative to the matter.

It is stuff like this that leads me to be cautious in particular when reading news stories, whether they are approved or not, and in processing of information relative to this case.

 

[Angels27]

In addition to the factors cited by you and others (location, location, location!) it could be as simple as one or the other of Abby/Libby was more his "type" and fit whatever his kill fantasy was better than the first girl he encountered. Revolting, but plausible.

Maybe there were other hikers around or she came across as smart and not an easy mark.

 

[Charlot123]

I know it's kind of abstract but it was just a thought that came to me..lets say we are looking for a father and son...2 perps. let's say the son is known to the girls..could the murders be covering up something that may have happened that could have been damaging to them had it come to light? could there have been unknown drama going on regarding one of
the girls?

something, sexual?

I guess I was searching for other reasons this crime could have been committed and staged
to look like something it's not.

no doubt ridiculous...mOO

Yes, I have been feeling the same way. Something that would totally ruin the career of the older one and the future prospects of the younger one.

It might never play a role in this case, or it might... but it got me thinking further. I got on Bashara’s case, and was shocked to find out that he paid a man with the IQ of 64 to kill his wife.

I wonder if there are any laws for people who manipulate mentally challenged ones into crime?

 

[K.jill]

I know it's kind of abstract but it was just a thought that came to me..lets say we are looking for a father and son...2 perps. let's say the son is known to the girls..could the murders be covering up something that may have happened that could have been damaging to them had it come to light? could there have been unknown drama going on regarding one of
the girls?

something, sexual?

I guess I was searching for other reasons this crime could have been committed and staged
to look like something it's not.

no doubt ridiculous...mOO

Not ridiculous!
I have tried to think of other possible motives as well.
I have gotten the idea that the crime scene may have been staged to look like it was one thing but turned out to be another (kind of crime or motivation).

 

[minazoe]

anyway back to the single perp theory and his subsequent escape...seems like they think he escaped through the woods...if so where would he end up? he cant just go endlessly through the woods, he has to come out somewhere..how far could he go? what are some possible escape routes? are there any residential pockets you can access from through the woods?

I cant see him getting out of there on foot.

 

[MistyWaters]

I know it's kind of abstract but it was just a thought that came to me..lets say we are looking for a father and son...2 perps. let's say the son is known to the girls..could the murders be covering up something that may have happened that could have been damaging to them had it come to light? could there have been unknown drama going on regarding one of
the girls?

something, sexual?

I guess I was searching for other reasons this crime could have been committed and staged
to look like something it's not.

no doubt ridiculous...mOO

A question was posed to LE asking if the murders were planned. “No, not planned, they were victims of circumstance and opportunity.”

I’m confused as your theory appears to indicate a targeted murder involving revenge. Or don’t you believe LE’s response?

 

[Bluepopsicle]

Thanks for pointing this out. I felt that the article had a few errors. Another one I noticed was that it said the girls were found 50 feet from the Monon High Bridge Trail. Surely the author meant to say, "banks of Deer Creek" instead.

Yes! I feel as though there’s a few errors too, or maybe its the author just sort of “misspeaking”, and possibly taking license in writing her article...But one of the quotes that made me catch my breath today was this one...

“Just four words, “Guys…….Down the hill”! And then with the video still going, Libby recorded her own murder, and the murder of her friend Abby.”
A Sister’s Walk for Justice: The Delphi Murders [EXCLUSIVE]

I have always been under the impression that the murders were not on audio. I haven’t yet had the chance to search any supporting statements/articles, but I thought I have read several interviews with TL, DC, and/or KR in the last couple years where they had definitively said there wasn’t much else of value recorded on the audio.

To think that the actual horrific trauma of what those girls went through is horrifying and heartwrenching, i can’t imagine how horrible that would be for them to listen to on audio. I was always under the impression that none of it was on there, or at the very leaset, they havent confirmed it. Am I just remembering wrong? Did we know that the murders were captured on audio?