Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #131

[rypj84]

Does anyone think LE has someone on their radar but they don’t have enough evidence to arrest as of yet ?

I 100% believe they've been locked in on someone since 2019 at least. The presser, lack of updates, ambiguity - it all feels right to me looking at it through that lens. I'm sure the DA isn't willing to risk a child murderer being acquitted, and there's only one shot at prosecution, so if there's a ton of evidence but the majority is circumstantial, then they're looking for a very specific tip. Moo

 

[sunshineray]

They've been begging for the public's help in IDing BG by the sound of his voice.

If this is the beginning sequence of events,

Who said, "Guys, ... ?"
Maybe BG then gives a command that we hear as glass breaking static.

Perhaps, BG offers s/t like, "Guys, they're headed your way." Or, "Guys, you can't get away." Then, we hear the infamous:

"Down the Hill."

It's bone chilling, really. Those brave, precious, pretty, young girls, RIP.

GreyHuze stated he can share that Abby is heard on the audio asking, "Is that a gun?" If true, and there's every reason to believe it is, then the firearm is how control over 2 girls was managed.
.

Can you please share the link to that GH video and an approximate time mark...TIA

 

[sunshineray]

Who decided the caller could be trusted? GH or LE? How did this person know he was still in the area when DG arrived? That’s huge information I’ve never heard before.

At approximately 1 hr 59 mins in this caller starts relaying info.

We are allowed to link Gray Hughes videos because his is a trusted site.

It was said by GH that this caller is trusted by him. I've posted this particular video a few times in the past when talking about crime scene DNA and timeline.

 

[sunshineray]

I know that GH is considered an approved source for this case, but this raises a lot of questions, IMO. How was this "trusted caller" vetted? We have no way to judge the accuracy of this information and I personally feel that it should be treated as a rumor.

I was under the impression that Tricia had vetted GH and all the info in his videos were allowed to be discussed here. I hope that's still correct?

I agree that we can only treat the info as possible truth.

 

[Boxer]

GH videos are allowed but calls in to the show seem like a different sort of information.

 

[sunshineray]

I like to put 3 questions here:
Who in general is most likely to be forgiven for strange behavior, let us say: for the/his last 15-20 years?
What qualities do you have to have in order for people to excuse strange behavior?
What connections to upper-graded people do you have to reach to be forgiven strange behavior?
(I'm speaking of a curriculum vitae before the Delphi crime.)
There is a certain reason, that LE (DC?) said, the locals would be shocked, when they will learn the truth (similar wording).

Very interesting questions...just had to insert my thoughts.
In thinking it over, I think first, there would probably be two standards of acceptable strange behaviour.

If the person was living in a more populous area like a city or larger town strangeness might be overlooked more but probably more frowned upon. In a smaller community strangeness might stick out more but might be more acceptable to the small town sensibilities.

This of course would most certainly not be the case if they were a know sex offender.

The other reason strange behaviour might be coddled is if the person were more well off that the average. Money does do a lot to smooth things over sometimes. It can make people afraid to speak against it too.

I believe it was Sheriff Leazenby who said people would be shocked?

 

[Sillybilly]

Extensive discussion related to OCD is off topic and has been removed. None of us is in a position to diagnose this perpetrator based on the limited info we have.

 

[Sillybilly]

Extensive discussion related to OCD is off topic and has been removed. None of us is in a position to diagnose this perpetrator based on the limited info we have.

 

[sunshineray]

GH videos are allowed but calls in to the show seem like a different sort of information.

Even if the host GH is not only a participant in discussing it but is also vouching for the creditability of the person supplying the information?

 

[Awsi Dooger]

wow, if I was the killer I would not like hearing that L has 5 suspects. That is very narrow, yet enough to make you wonder if you are on that list... oooh the paranoia must at some point start to seep in..

I think it would pure hysteria for the actual killer to hear about 5 suspects several years into the investigation. There is no way 5 suspects is anything but desperation and guesswork. Physical evidence cannot point to 5 suspects. Circumstantial evidence cannot point to 5 suspects. DNA cannot point to 5 suspects. The ever-popular false alibi theory cannot link separately to 5 suspects.

If they have 5 suspects it's almost certainly nothing but a list of local creeps who would be automatically near the top of the list for any type of serious crime. I would guess Leazenby hasn't branched far beyond the early search warrants. That's the way he thinks. Remember he has said that they realized maybe they were onto something very early.

Unless Bridge Guy is a local creep I doubt he is worried about anything except forensic advancements.

 

[Pyschsandi]

I fully agree. It's all dependent on how much planning was involved. Bear with me...

My inclination is that if he had planned this out and was waiting for a victim, he would have parked on the gravel road south of the bridge, then either crossed the bridge and entered the trails, or stayed hidden at the south end until somebody crossed. There'd be no creek crossing, fewer chances of him or his vehicle being seen, and plenty of isolated places to lead them sw of the bridge with easy access back to his vehicle.

Parking at the cemetary does make a lot of sense, except for crossing the creek, which I guess I need to let go of because maybe to the killer that was not a big deal.

But here's my dilemma... none of the scenarios that involve him planning the crime really make sense to me. The location is isolated, yes, but how long would he wait around? The perfect opportunity may not have presented itself for days and days? The witnesses apparently saw the men who were the sources of the sketches on the day of the crime, per TL in the Comet Q&A. Did he go unnoticed during his preperation phase and any other days hunting, if he had them?

IDK, these thoughts keep me leaning towards this being an unplanned event. One could argue that if he drove by, heading east, and saw them dropped off, the cemetary would then be a logical parking place even if it was completely opportunistic. I'd still be asking what reason he had to be on 300 rd.

Hunters will sit in one place for hours to kill a deer, this man hunts humans, so he may have hid in some bushes waiting for the right person to walk by. On the other hand, it could have been a spur of the moment opportunity and he brought a weapon just in case he needed it. We just don’t know. Both scenario’s seem to have their merits.

 

[sunshineray]

I think it would pure hysteria for the actual killer to hear about 5 suspects several years into the investigation. There is no way 5 suspects is anything but desperation and guesswork. Physical evidence cannot point to 5 suspects. Circumstantial evidence cannot point to 5 suspects. DNA cannot point to 5 suspects. The ever-popular false alibi theory cannot link separately to 5 suspects.

If they have 5 suspects it's almost certainly nothing but a list of local creeps who would be automatically near the top of the list for any type of serious crime. I would guess Leazenby hasn't branched far beyond the early search warrants. That's the way he thinks. Remember he has said that they realized maybe they were onto something very early.

Unless Bridge Guy is a local creep I doubt he is worried about anything except forensic advancements.

DNA can when if points to a family group with at the least 5 male individuals of the age group and living in that area of IN.

 

[Awsi Dooger]

But here's my dilemma... none of the scenarios that involve him planning the crime really make sense to me. The location is isolated, yes, but how long would he wait around? The perfect opportunity may not have presented itself for days and days?

Bridge Guy may have waited months for that opportunity. We have no idea how many times he visited that trail or any trail. He may have been incredibly frustrated countless times when some small variable or twist of fate intervened. The tendency is to overplay the result, as if he selected day day and it had to be that day. That type of overboard reliance on specifics leads to the preoccupation with the snow day, etc. Much more likely he had a general plan with a handful of priorities, along with accepted range of victim(s). If nothing clicked he would have walked away again.

 

[Boxer]

GH videos are allowed but calls into his show seem like a different sort of information.

 

[DeDee]

I fully agree. It's all dependent on how much planning was involved. Bear with me...

My inclination is that if he had planned this out and was waiting for a victim, he would have parked on the gravel road south of the bridge, then either crossed the bridge and entered the trails, or stayed hidden at the south end until somebody crossed. There'd be no creek crossing, fewer chances of him or his vehicle being seen, and plenty of isolated places to lead them sw of the bridge with easy access back to his vehicle.

Parking at the cemetary does make a lot of sense, except for crossing the creek, which I guess I need to let go of because maybe to the killer that was not a big deal.

But here's my dilemma... none of the scenarios that involve him planning the crime really make sense to me. The location is isolated, yes, but how long would he wait around? The perfect opportunity may not have presented itself for days and days? The witnesses apparently saw the men who were the sources of the sketches on the day of the crime, per TL in the Comet Q&A. Did he go unnoticed during his preperation phase and any other days hunting, if he had them?

IDK, these thoughts keep me leaning towards this being an unplanned event. One could argue that if he drove by, heading east, and saw them dropped off, the cemetary would then be a logical parking place even if it was completely opportunistic. I'd still be asking what reason he had to be on 300 rd.

BG may have known that Monday, Feb. 13 was a day off from school. The weather was amazing so school age students would be outside doing stuff like riding bikes.

How their paths crossed at precisely the most inopportune time on that dangerous High Bridge that dreadful day. This raises many coincidences.

He was in and out. There and gone. All three lives converging on the S end of the Bridge at the same time. Then, 2 little bodies left near the edge of the creek in a manner described by the property owner, RL. to the reporter about the CS area, "It was pristine."

With 4 photos we'd want to take.

 

[news buff]

BG may have known that Monday, Feb. 13 was a day off from school. The weather was amazing so school age students would be outside doing stuff like riding bikes.

How their paths crossed at precisely the most inopportune time on that dangerous High Bridge that dreadful day. This raises many coincidences.

He was in and out. There and gone. All three lives converging on the S end of the Bridge at the same time. Then, 2 little bodies left near the edge of the creek in a manner described by the property owner, RL. to the reporter about the CS area, "It was pristine."

With 4 photos we'd want to take.

What photo's?

 

[news buff]

Reading about this case a long time ago the movie, River's Edge came to mind and then I forgot about it. Could others have put things at the site of the murders?

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Bridge Guy may have waited months for that opportunity. We have no idea how many times he visited that trail or any trail. He may have been incredibly frustrated countless times when some small variable or twist of fate intervened. The tendency is to overplay the result, as if he selected day day and it had to be that day. That type of overboard reliance on specifics leads to the preoccupation with the snow day, etc. Much more likely he had a general plan with a handful of priorities, along with accepted range of victim(s). If nothing clicked he would have walked away again.

Could he have had the same girls in mind as his future victims, but the right opportunity didn't present before during his visits? Abby/Libby also were not the first time there at the MHB area.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

There's not a lot more to share. I was trying to think of reasons why he would park in an obvious place if he was planning to commit a murder. I guess for a cemetery it would include somebody visiting a grave, or somebody mowing or planting flowers or doing other maintenance, or getting ready for a funeral, or something like that. The kind of person who's so low key that people might not even remember they saw him there.

Any jogger for example might park his car somewhere and might jogg the trails at this area or another. Nothing to notice for other joggers or dog walkers or strollers, even if it would be a pair of 2 joggers. It would be a wellknown encounter for everyone, who is outdoors himself.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

One could say he’s still held captive although not yet incarcerated.

bbm

If he didn't get caught for 4 years in case Abby/Libby (or for 5 years in case MissyB or for 7 years in case Lizzy/Lyric -provided, that he is the killer also), he hasn't to endure much with "feeling a little incarcerated", IMO. He can live his life to the fullest, with all things, young people are doing: earning money, having a career, getting married, having children, going on vacation, spending his money on nice things like cars/homes/some men's toys etc. I think, for him knowing, that he will get caught only for his very last crime (if at all) and nobody will ever learn about previous crimes probably, gives him a calming feeling. Nobody can take the thrill away from him, he already had x times only for his pleasure. IMO