Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #131

[janewall]

Help request - I can't find a link to the list of named and initialed persons for this case. Does anyone have it handy so it can be shared again? (And possibly it can then be added to the links in the first post of all subsequent threads?) TIA.

Answering myself to note that I found it in the media thread, and am linking here in case anyone else would like easy access. IN - Abigail Williams & Liberty German, Delphi, Media, Maps, Timelines NO DISCUSSION

 

[sunshineray]

Ives spoke with Dr. Oz. Interview of Ives begins at 2:45 and at about 4:25 is when he talks about this specific aspect of the crime scene ("3 or 4 physical characteristics you would absolutely take a photograph of"):

At one point Ives called them "items". I wonder if to him item would mean an aspect or if that was a bit of a slip and the killer left items in such a way that they were considered uniquely fashioned or placed?

Thanks for the video link, I hadn't seen this interview.

 

[sunshineray]

From that first article I included in my post:

Robert Ives' wife said he will step down at the end of the year for a variety of personal reasons.

"It just seemed like a good time to do it and I chose to do it," Ives told WLFI in West Lafayette, which first reported the news.

Ives was first appointed prosecutor in 1987. He went through a volley of election wins and losses over the years, but most recently has been the prosecutor for Carroll County going on seven years.

I find it a bit unusual that he leaves as county prosecutor, then comes back and has left again right? He's still giving interviews and releasing information about the murders not released by LE. I wonder if that has ruffled some feathers?

Edit by me: Maybe I just don't understand that area of the country enough.

 

[Diddian]

I find it a bit unusual that he leaves as county prosecutor, then comes back and has left again right? He's still giving interviews and releasing information about the murders not released by LE. I wonder if that has ruffled some feathers?

Edit by me: Maybe I just don't understand that area of the country enough.

While his coming and going over the years he served in the period from 1987 to 2017 seems unusual, it appears to reflect a divided electorate rather than his choice.

From this article, "he went through a volley of election wins and losses over the years:"

https://www.wrtv.com/news/local-new...p-down-amidst-two-high-profile-unsolved-cases

 

[Diddian]

I found this page interesting. It's from the project pages of the company that provided the planning, engineering and oversight of the installation of the Freedom Bridge and surrounding elements of landscape architecture. There is a video at top of the page that provides good perspective for what kind of land work and retaining/bridge supporting walls were constructed, what the stone seating and signage areas on either side of the bridge look like, how they are landscaped, and how they join the trail on either side of the highway. The drone also pulls back to show the relationship of the CPS building to that area.

While DLZ was contracted to engineer, plan, and oversee the project, it was probably local or regional contractors and subcontractors who completed much of that work. The bridge was moved to that location in 2002.

Freedom Bridge at Delphi, Indiana across Hoosier Heartland - DLZ

Edit: Note that this is the Freedom Bridge, which crosses the highway and connects the trails from the Delphi side to the more rural side. It is not the Monon High Bridge, which is further down the trails through the Mary Gerard Nature Preserve on the more rural side, and which crosses Deer Creek and ends in an area of private properties.

 

[carbuff]

Im weirded out by the Leah Conner death. wonder if there is no obvious cause?

its really eerie...out for a walk...broad daylight...nice weather...bridge area...found close by or under the trestle.

but no talk of homicide..yet..seems like they went in with dogs and found her quickly.

even the footage of the town reaction...similar..

ok I won't speculate anymore..nothing can be done or connected until the facts are known.

mOO

Yeah I agree.

It's probably not a connection, but it has me wondering: was the Delphi killer's plan originally to push them off the bridge? And they ran and he had to improvise with the gun etc. ?

Probably just me being off the wall again.

 

[Diddian]

I found this page interesting. It's from the project pages of the company that provided the planning, engineering and oversight of the installation of the Freedom Bridge and surrounding elements of landscape architecture. There is a video at top of the page that provides good perspective for what kind of land work and retaining/bridge supporting walls were constructed, what the stone seating and signage areas on either side of the bridge look like, how they are landscaped, and how they join the trail on either side of the highway. The drone also pulls back to show the relationship of the CPS building to that area.

While DLZ was contracted to engineer, plan, and oversee the project, it was probably local or regional contractors and subcontractors who completed much of that work. The bridge was moved to that location in 2002.

Freedom Bridge at Delphi, Indiana across Hoosier Heartland - DLZ

Edit: Note that this is the Freedom Bridge, which crosses the highway and connects the trails from the Delphi side to the more rural side. It is not the Monon High Bridge, which is further down the trails through the Mary Gerard Nature Preserve on the more rural side, and which crosses Deer Creek and ends in an area of private properties.

BBM. Too late to edit this date in my post, but the Freedom Bridge was not moved to the Delphi location in 2002. It was originally planned for another location around that time, but because of a land dispute could not be used there. The bridge was subsequently rehabbed in 2014, then placed and officially opened in Delphi in 2015.

My apologies for the earlier error.

Freedom Bridge set to officially open in Delphi

 

[minazoe]

Yeah I agree.

It's probably not a connection, but it has me wondering: was the Delphi killer's plan originally to push them off the bridge? And they ran and he had to improvise with the gun etc. ?

Probably just me being off the wall again.

Yeah I agree.

It's probably not a connection, but it has me wondering: was the Delphi killer's plan originally to push them off the bridge? And they ran and he had to improvise with the gun etc. ?

Probably just me being off the wall again.

it's possible, anything is possible, and it makes me shudder to
think about it.

mOO

 

[sandy_80]

Yeah I agree.

It's probably not a connection, but it has me wondering: was the Delphi killer's plan originally to push them off the bridge? And they ran and he had to improvise with the gun etc. ?

Probably just me being off the wall again.

and what would be his motive here ? the abduction makes sense with SA intent

 

[MistyWaters]

I find it a bit unusual that he leaves as county prosecutor, then comes back and has left again right? He's still giving interviews and releasing information about the murders not released by LE. I wonder if that has ruffled some feathers?

Edit by me: Maybe I just don't understand that area of the country enough.

Ives was the elected Chief Prosecutor until he retired at the end of the year in 2017. Then he returned in about April, 2019 as a deputy prosecutor, a hired position. It was speculated he might’ve came back for a specific period of time due to resourcing requirements.

I sure could be wrong but I’ve always wondered if several of the officials who are or have been involved in the investigation have gotten a little heady over their first taste of national limelight. For anyone with future career aspirations, name recognition is well known to be helpful. It worked for Jeff Ashton. But I’m not saying it’s hurt the case. It certainly generates interest, the approach of revealing information yet not giving anything away whatsoever.

JMO

 

[Pyschsandi]

At one point Ives called them "items". I wonder if to him item would mean an aspect or if that was a bit of a slip and the killer left items in such a way that they were considered uniquely fashioned or placed?

Thanks for the video link, I hadn't seen this interview.

You are very observant sunshine, I didn’t notice that slip. Items could be anything. An example would be maybe he left some writing or carving on a rock or tree, or left an object that was unusual.

 

[tiffkinsadder]

I pray for justice all the time for them. We won’t ever stop sharing their pictures, cell phone evidence, or poi artists sketches. Prayers.

 

[Ekliptika]

I'm still wondering what LE meant when they said that they were "onto something" early on. At one time my guess was that they were referring to the parked car (mentioned in the scanner thread) that had had it's plates run the afternoon of the murders. It seems like they should have been able to investigate that lead fully by now, so at this point I don't know what to think.
I don't believe that they have BG's DNA; I think that's a bluff. I wish Libby had filmed BG for just a few seconds longer; a few more seconds might have given us a much clearer image.

I am wondering about the same thing.
Did it mean that they were investigating something early on that they thought was not relevant, turned in another direction, but then something led them back to that early on investigation years later? I think it is related to the sketch change, maybe they were investigating someone younger early on, but due to whatever reason, they went with the older guy theory and then reverted back to the younger guy theory. I Think it is a strange thing to say, but so many Strange things have been said by LE, eluding at something but leaving plenty of room for speculations.

 

[Pyschsandi]

I am wondering about the same thing.
Did it mean that they were investigating something early on that they thought was not relevant, turned in another direction, but then something led them back to that early on investigation years later? I think it is related to the sketch change, maybe they were investigating someone younger early on, but due to whatever reason, they went with the older guy theory and then reverted back to the younger guy theory. I Think it is a strange thing to say, but so many Strange things have been said by LE, eluding at something but leaving plenty of room for speculations.

I think that both sketches were of the same guy but through different witnesses on the trail that day. When I look at the video I see a guy that’s in between the ages 18-40. I see someone that is in his 30’s. His face is so hard to see but his dress reminds me of someone that’s not as young as 18 . His voice sounds older as well. I also think he is maybe in his thirties because of how he got control of the teens and how calm his voice was. The crime had a sophistication about it that I think had to be done by an older man. MOO

 

[carbuff]

and what would be his motive here ? the abduction makes sense with SA intent

I've never thought that SA was the primary motivation in Libby and Abby's deaths. Possibly a sexual element, but I think there was something specific that caused their deaths. Something they knew, somebody was afraid they might know something, somebody wanted revenge--there are so many reasons why people kill other people

That means it's unlikely to be connected to the other cases. The similarities with the Evanston girls weird me out, but probably just coincidence. And apparently Leah's death wasn't related at all, poor girl.

 

[FruitTingles]

When I first joined these threads straight after the murders, I truly did not think we’d still be here 4 years later waiting for answers and justice.
The ‘down the hill’ audio still haunts me to this day!

 

[JnRyan]

When I first joined these threads straight after the murders, I truly did not think we’d still be here 4 years later waiting for answers and justice.
The ‘down the hill’ audio still haunts me to this day!

And you're not alone. Many of us have the same thought.

 

[Yemelyan]

When a child, or in this case children, goes missing, it seems that for LE the initial canvass of the neighborhood or area is critical, as people may have seen something that only in retrospect was out of place. They could be witnesses to some part of the crime without even realizing what they had seen, or what they knew.

I am reminded of how, in the Evansdale murders, two separate witnesses reported a particular vehicle parked on a road adjacent to the place of abduction. Police knew about this early on but only after a third witness came forward a full year later with identical information did they start treating this vehicle sighting as something of significance.

I wonder if the "we were on to something early on" in the Delphi case is similar. LE might have had a bit of information in their canvass about a vehicle at the CPS building that they were trying to confirm. I firmly believe that they didn't release make and model because they already had some details about the vehicle in mind and were seeking confirmation.

Because we haven't heard anything about the vehicle at the CPS building since, I hope they got the information they were seeking.

 

[CharminCharli]

Good evening fellow sleuthers,

I followed the Delphi case on here from the beginning, and eventually created an account so I could post a few things. I have not been on this site in a year or two as I got discouraged with the case.

This past week I listened to Down The Hill podcast and I found the details interesting. No more of BG/YG’s voice on the audio, fingerprints and DNA at the crime scene, that the video doesn’t show anything “earth shattering” I believe was the quote from the sheriff. Seems like there was something else that stuck out to me but it escapes my mind at this point.

I saw someone else commented that they used to follow the case, took a hiatus and recently came back. Like them I hope this means that the wheels of justice are speeding up and an arrest will be soon. Cheers to all who are keeping the story of Abby and Libby current and raising awareness.

 

[Jerrod]

I wonder if the "we were on to something early on" in the Delphi case is similar. LE might have had a bit of information in their canvass about a vehicle at the CPS building that they were trying to confirm. I firmly believe that they didn't release make and model because they already had some details about the vehicle in mind and were seeking confirmation.

What's considered "early on" in the Delphi case? 6 months? 9 months? At the one-year anniversary, Carter flatly denied having information about any (suspect) vehicle.

(thread #97)