Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #132

[MistyWaters]

I wonder the same. It seems if other agencies wanted to see the area, it would be most beneficial to have the exact body locations and any other evidence still marked, as well. Jmo But I guess they would have all that photographed, though.

It's all so frustrating to me.

With real life crime cases, even after the perpetrator is convicted there’s always a lot unanswered questions, unfortunately. That’s the difference between fictional books or movies where by the end it’s satisfying when all the loose ends are tied together.

So something I try to remember is LE have given the public only as much information as they believe will lead to the identification of the killer. Their objective of releasing information is not to enable us to recreate the crime. Hopefully that’ll happen in front of a jury in a courtroom in the upcoming future, maybe well before the end of 2022.

“We still have the up and down days is the best way to put it," Sheriff Leazenby said. "My term ends in 2022 - would love nothing more than to see someone convicted of this crime before I am out of office."..”
Delphi Murders Update 2021: Reward in 2017 killings of 2 Indiana teens Abby Williams, Libby German grows to $325K | abc7chicago.com

 

[FrostedGlass]

Hmm. That picture is different than any I've seen. There's another short video clip on this article that shows a taped-off area that doesn't look like the same south cemetery one, either. IDK, maybe just different angles?


State police receive a thousand tips since new Delphi evidence release | wthr.com

I have never seen any of the crime scenes with tape wrapped around the trees like that.
Here's the Beacon view of what I think is the inlet

 

[FrostedGlass]

Is this area I circled in red where you think you see water? I might see it too, not sure. Or, it could be a slope into the creek? Not sure. Also, if the creek ran through very close to the crime scene, maybe he did drown them, and didn't have to drag them anywhere.

Yes, that's the spot.

 

[MistyWaters]

My experience with a crime near where I used to work was that they picked up the evidence marker when they gathered the evidence at that spot. In a couple of cases they replaced a yellow marker with a red one, I assume because they wanted to mark the location but also indicate the item had been processed. Most of the flags were shell casings but the one that went yellow to red was bigger. Might have been where a handgun was thrown.

But they didn't care about the tape. They took a couple of pieces that were across the sidewalk and told the maintenance people they could clean up the rest. One of the IT people grabbed some of it and for years after our computer lab was draped with crime scene tape.

It would be unusual if evidence and evidence markers were removed simultaneously.

Evidence markers are placed by the forensic team after the evidence is removed in order to identify the exact locations it was found. All parties involved in the investigation can then recognize where the evidence was found, as opposed leaving any evidence laying there unanalyzed, risking disturbance and contamination etc. During a trial we often see a prosecution witness showing the jury any objects collected as evidence, plus a photo with the corresponding number on the evidence marker to indicate the spot it was taken from. That’s why I don’t think evidence markers would be removed until the completion of the crime scene processing.

 

[MistyWaters]

I have never seen any of the crime scenes with tape wrapped around the trees like that.
Here's the Beacon view of what I think is the inlet

View attachment 292059

I noticed that, what you refer to as an inlet. During heavy rains or spring melt I thought it looked like a natural feature which provides drainage from higher elevations down to the creek.

 

[carbuff]

It would be unusual if evidence and evidence markers were removed simultaneously.

Evidence markers are placed by the forensic team after the evidence is removed in order to identify the exact locations it was found. All parties involved in the investigation can then recognize where the evidence was found, as opposed leaving any evidence laying there unanalyzed, risking disturbance and contamination etc. During a trial we often see a prosecution witness showing the jury any objects collected as evidence, plus a photo with the corresponding number on the evidence marker to indicate the spot it was taken from. That’s why I don’t think evidence markers would be removed until the completion of the crime scene processing.

I dunno. Maybe I'm misremembering what they did. It was a pretty perfunctory crime scene investigation.

 

[TheVisual]

I'm open to the possibility that there were 2 taped-off areas on Rl's property. One that didn't have much evidence so they allowed reporters access to that one. Another located further east which they did not allow access to.

There was a picture of a small area taped off (maybe 2-3 foot by 2-3 foot) but I wouldn't know where to find it.

 

[DeDee]

Here's a screen cap from one of the 4-year anniversary interviews. In the middle, on the right hand side, I think I see water. Riley described the scene: "...the creek ran through there real close to the crime scene..."
I think it looks like a little inlet and I was able to find something that seemed to match on the Beacon site. The area is located directly across from the drainage ditch that runs along the Weber property on the east.

View attachment 292049

Although I don't have access to the original image, this has been a popular snapshot of RLs backyard depicting CS tape and the CS. RLs little dog is walking behind the reporter.

If you've watched Gray Hughes videos, and if you don't, he so often mentions the tree hanging over Deer Creek because it is an unusual marker pointing to the location where the girls went up the hill to the CS on private property.
I don't believe either one of them drowned.
The rocky bottom is visible in the topography. Photo credit to strangeoutdoors.com

 

[FrostedGlass]

I noticed that, what you refer to as an inlet. During heavy rains or spring melt I thought it looked like a natural feature which provides drainage from higher elevations down to the creek.

I wasn't sure what to call it. lol...

Maybe it serves several purposes? It does look like there is a deep ravine that could carry water down and the drainage ditch also does. There is an odd area behind the Weber house that I can't identify. I've rotated this pic a bit to see it better; north is in the upper right hand corner. From Google Earth.

 

[TL4S]

I wasn't sure what to call it. lol...

Maybe it serves several purposes? It does look like there is a deep ravine that could carry water down and the drainage ditch also does. There is an odd area behind the Weber house that I can't identify. I've rotated this pic a bit to see it better; north is in the upper right hand corner. From Google Earth.
View attachment 292070

This was what I thought could be another possible crossing spot, but somebody who had been to the area says a person couldn't walk the south edge of the creek under Weber's house without being in the water.

In the helicopter footage, this is approximately where the searchers appear to be in the water the first time they are shown. It's upstream from the taped-off area by a ways (remember, we don't know where in the creek they started, heading down steam). If the south cemetery is the final crime scene, it perplexes me that upstream would be searched thoroughly, but the cemetery and trail down would not, and in fact was used for staging.

I don't mean to be a broken record. I'm seriously overcomplicating this, I think...

 

[FrostedGlass]

This was what I thought could be another possible crossing spot, but somebody who had been to the area says a person couldn't walk the south edge of the creek under Weber's house without being in the water.

Logan's kids played all over down there on his side. I'd be very surprised if there was not some way to cross over to the bridge side. Is the back of the Weber property a straight drop-off?

 

[MistyWaters]

Logan's kids played all over down there on his side. I'd be very surprised if there was not some way to cross over to the bridge side. Is the back of the Weber property a straight drop-off?

The topography photo of the area was posted here only a couple of days ago, might be helpful.

 

[FrostedGlass]

The topography photo of the area was posted here only a couple of days ago, might be helpful.

I saw that but I can't tell if it's a shear cliff or a steep hill. One of the internet pics shows it's a pretty steep hill along the side of the house but still walkable.

 

[TL4S]

The topography photo of the area was posted here only a couple of days ago, might be helpful.

 

[MistyWaters]

I saw that but I can't tell if it's a shear cliff or a steep hill. One of the internet pics shows it's a pretty steep hill along the side of the house but still walkable.

I’d think the larger dark grey shaded areas are the steepest, just guessing.

 

[photographer4]

There was a picture of a small area taped off (maybe 2-3 foot by 2-3 foot) but I wouldn't know where to find it.

If the girls were laying down when found, surely that spot couldn't have been where their bodies were found then? They'd probably have been far taller than that, no?

 

[St. Anthony2017]

Agreed. They were looking for any other possible evidence at all (they may not even have known what they were looking for, and just picking up items of possible interest).

Things they may have been looking for might include:
-> tobacco products in water / along shore
> clothing / footwear
> weapon(s)
> evidence of other crimes (eg: drugs, prostitution)
> electronic device(s) (cell phone, watch(es), key(s)
> string / rope

Anything else they could have been searching the water for?

What about hair ties or hair from the girls who both had longer hair? I always wondered if he yanked them by their hair as he led them away. Girls should not wear a ponytail if they are jogging because a predator can grab them by it and control them that way. They should wear their hair like Abby did in a high bun or under a cap if possible.I know the girls weren’t jogging but wanted to mention this as a point of safety for females.

 

[Charlot123]

.

I don’t understand the logic in your statement. Because kids spend a lot of time on the internet, logically, there must be a connection between the girls and the murderer? There is absolutely no indication, known to the public, other than speculation that the killer knew the girls in any way, internet or not.
Your last sentence, I agree with you 100%.
Just my thoughts.

I just think that his emergence on that bridge indicates that he was somehow aware of their plans. Internet, to me, is still the easiest way to find out. The rapidity of the attack is somewhat telling- he organized it all in his head, and they came.

The reason he was in the area that day might have been totally his own, though. And if this week the girls failed to emerge on the bridge, no problem, the next one, he'd be somewhere else and kill someone there. Possibly via an internet connection, but who knows. His trips, I think, are somehow planned. I don't know how. An "exhibition killer" with regular trips covering a certain area sounds logical to me, but could be anything that is somewhat regular. Even a regional drug rep with a certain catchment area, for example. (In this case, he could have more flexibility in organizing trips).

 

[St. Anthony2017]

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I just think that his emergence on that bridge indicates that he was somehow aware of their plans. Internet, to me, is still the easiest way to find out. The rapidity of the attack is somewhat telling- he organized it all in his head, and they came.

The reason he was in the area that day might have been totally his own, though. And if this week the girls failed to emerge on the bridge, no problem, the next one, he'd be somewhere else and kill someone there. Possibly via an internet connection, but who knows. His trips, I think, are somehow planned. I don't know how. An "exhibition killer" with regular trips covering a certain area sounds logical to me, but could be anything that is somewhat regular. Even a regional drug rep with a certain catchment area, for example. (In this case, he could have more flexibility in organizing trips).

Or he could be semi-retired or unemployed and has freedom to travel around by regular vehicle or box car. Where is the closest working railroad to the crime scene or the MHB?

 

[TheVisual]

If the girls were laying down when found, surely that spot couldn't have been where their bodies were found then? They'd probably have been far taller than that, no?

No, I believe this spot might have been where they found something.