Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #137

[Zabble]

Super interesting. Did you tip that in?? Please do.
Someone who knows what they’re doing can hide all sorts of ways online.

Yes I actually tipped it in right after I posted the previous message.

I've been hanging on to those screenshots for nearly 2 months thinking that they would probably not be meaningful to LE. But I guess it's best to send it anyways in case it fits with other info they might have but cannot connect.

 

[JnRyan]

Makes me wonder.

Imagine this. He lives, say, in Illinois. Commits a crime in Indiana and soon moves to Oregon. Everyone is looking for a person from Delphi neighborhood to suddenly relocate, but he relocates from Illinois. Too far to be noticed. Then he kills/disappears someone in WA. Then he moves from Oregon to Texas. Kills in Oklahoma...etc.

He is always one state away. I think he might even keep a certain pattern, how many states away from the target one.

Exactly. As another example look at the case of the murderer, Robert Brashers. He kills Genevieve Zitricki in SC in 1990. Then he murders a mother and daughter in SE MO in 1998. In between, he rapes 14 yo in Memphis in 1997. I believe, if I remember correctly, LE had eventually had a DNA match between the SC and MO murders between 1998 and 2007. But it isn't until a rape kit for the 1997 crime - that has been sitting for years without being processed - that a connection has been made between that crime and the other murders in 2007. The significance? The 1997 rape had a composite sketch. But without DNA, LE struggles to make the connection. (LE tries to find this guy for 20 years after the MO murders only to find out that the killer died of a self inflicted wound in a shoot out with LE in 1999. They're chasing a dead man.) I wouldn't doubt if there is another unsolved murder somewhere that Brashers committed and LE hasn't made the connection.

Robert Eugene Brashers - Wikipedia

Could there be another murder or murders in another state? Where he either didn't leave DNA or Carroll County doesn't have his DNA to match to another murder? And maybe that murder or murders isn't in ViCAP to help LE make the connection. Or he changes his MO and has hidden the body or bodies? Yes, I believe your example is very possible.

 

[fridaybaker]

This peaked my interest. A while ago I was looking for comparisons using Google Trends. Essentially you can input several search key words and then it shows you how often it's been searched. You can narrow down the results by geography such as state and city.

What struck me was that in the months leading up to the murder no one really searched "Monon High Bridge". However, I could see that someone googled for "Monon High Bridge" from Chicago, IL. I've attached a screenshot that shows this.

The following is speculation, but I think BG could potentially be from the Chicago area and have searched for suitable sites online, including the "Monon High Bridge".

Edit: I attached a second screenshot from Google Trends where it can be seen that keywords "Abigail Williams", "Libby German", and "Monon High Bridge" were all searched from Chicago in the months leading up to the murder.

Using a VPN?

 

[Charlot123]

This peaked my interest. A while ago I was looking for comparisons using Google Trends. Essentially you can input several search key words and then it shows you how often it's been searched. You can narrow down the results by geography such as state and city.

What struck me was that in the months leading up to the murder no one really searched "Monon High Bridge". However, I could see that someone googled for "Monon High Bridge" from Chicago, IL. I've attached a screenshot that shows this.

The following is speculation, but I think BG could potentially be from the Chicago area and have searched for suitable sites online, including the "Monon High Bridge".

Edit: I attached a second screenshot from Google Trends where it can be seen that keywords "Abigail Williams", "Libby German", and "Monon High Bridge" were all searched from Chicago in the months leading up to the murder.

Very interesting. Super important. IMO.

I would not discount someone who does not live in Chicago, either - I think the person who left so little DNA, likely, does not research from own house. Either from a library, or when visiting relatives. JMO. But - he might have some ties to IL.

(Not that type of a victim, but this young woman of color abducted from Midlothian Park - has her case been solved?)

P.S. don't know if this is his, but - abducted, tortured, rapidly killed, set on fire.

Harvey woman who disappeared on walk in Midlothian forest preserve was strangled, autopsy finds

 

[StarryStarryNight]

This peaked my interest. A while ago I was looking for comparisons using Google Trends. Essentially you can input several search key words and then it shows you how often it's been searched. You can narrow down the results by geography such as state and city.

What struck me was that in the months leading up to the murder no one really searched "Monon High Bridge". However, I could see that someone googled for "Monon High Bridge" from Chicago, IL. I've attached a screenshot that shows this.

The following is speculation, but I think BG could potentially be from the Chicago area and have searched for suitable sites online, including the "Monon High Bridge".

Edit: I attached a second screenshot from Google Trends where it can be seen that keywords "Abigail Williams", "Libby German", and "Monon High Bridge" were all searched from Chicago in the months leading up to the murder.

I think this is interesting.
Does it say how many times MHB was searched from Chicago?
I am confused about the searches for Libby and Abby. That makes no sense to me at all, but I admit I don’t think they were specifically targeted.

 

[SkipperKey3]

I think this is interesting.
Does it say how many times MHB was searched from Chicago?
I am confused about the searches for Libby and Abby. That makes no sense to me at all, but I admit I don’t think they were specifically targeted.

Keep in mind that there is a historical figure by the name of Abigail Williams in the Salem witch trials, and that the Crucible has a character in it also by that name. So searches for that name can be accounted for.

 

[fridaybaker]

Looks like there are currently three Liberty Germans on Facebook right now.

I'm not a Wayback person -can never figure out how to get it to work!- however, it would be interesting to do a Google search from before they were abducted and see how many results came up (as distinct from how many searches there were).

 

[Charlot123]

I tried Google trends and found out 100 hits on Delphi MHB in Indiana, 4 - in Illinois and 2 - in FLA. Interesting triangulation.

What if we try to Google Trend searches for "Bridges Midwest" or "Creeks Midwest" to see if any peak falls on the dates shortly before the September 2016?

Or if anyone was searching for Iowa (Seven Bridge area)? Or Midlothian?

I never knew about Google Trends but it is very interesting.

Found a hit on Seven Bridges in December of 2012 and January of 2013. Flat otherwise. But It does not give me the area.

Midlothian Meadows forest preserve is interesting. And all in Illinois.

 

[StarryStarryNight]

Keep in mind that there is a historical figure by the name of Abigail Williams in the Salem witch trials, and that the Crucible has a character in it also by that name. So searches for that name can be accounted for.

Yes, I thought about that. Interestingly....or maybe not to anyone else...one of my 9th great-grandmothers died during the Salem witch trials, in prison, awaiting trial for...yea...witchcraft.

 

[Zabble]

Super interesting. Did you tip that in?? Please do.
Someone who knows what they’re doing can hide all sorts of ways online.

Very true, I should have mentioned that but I forgot. I found that out at the time of doing the check back in July. Out of all the keywords searched "Monon High Bridge" was really interesting.

 

[Zabble]

I tried Google trends and found out 100 hits on Delphi MHB in Indiana, 4 - in Illinois and 2 - in FLA. Interesting triangulation.

What if we try to Google Trend searches for "Bridges Midwest" or "Creeks Midwest" to see if any peak falls on the dates shortly before the September 2016?

Or if anyone was searching for Iowa (Seven Bridge area)? Or Midlothian?

I never knew about Google Trends but it is very interesting.

Found a hit on Seven Bridges in December of 2012 and January of 2013. Flat otherwise. But It does not give me the area.

Midlothian Meadows forest preserve is interesting. And all in Illinois.

I'm up for it. If you're willing to share some keywords that you think are relevant I can do the checks on Google Trends.

BTW just read up on how to interpret the results. I believe the 100 / 75 / 50 values on the axis relate to the percentage it was searched compared to the average listed.

For example you can see on the left that there were "average" bars noted for each keywords search. If I hover over those averages I could see that the "Monon High Bridge" was searched an average of 3 times per day (or something like that, I forgot the exact number but it was low) in the Chicago area. This average is then used to report on the percentage the word was searched each day compared to the average.

 

[FromGermany1]

I know part of following true crime is being able to speculate, give opinion, go down rabbit holes and dig. WS'er do it best!
But when LE tells us absolutes...

Delphi, Iowa killings not believed linked
"Authorities investigating the killings of two teenage girls in Delphi say they've contacted Iowa police about the unsolved 2012 killings there of two cousins, but they don't believe the crimes are connected."

bbm
The term "believe" leaves options open .....

 

[Charlot123]

Keep in mind that there is a historical figure by the name of Abigail Williams in the Salem witch trials, and that the Crucible has a character in it also by that name. So searches for that name can be accounted for.

The Salem Abigail Williams is also on the list of people who mysteriously disappeared. After 1692, she not on the record.

List of people who disappeared mysteriously: pre-1970 - Wikipedia

Much as R. Ives and others hinted at religiosity of the perpetrator, I can not believe that anyone remotely spiritual could perform this heinous act. However, like the author of Malleus Malleficarum, the perp could be delusionally obsessed with women being witches. I wonder if his preoccupation with water (and maybe, fire?, if these are serial cases), is somehow tied to witch delusion.

 

[Charlot123]

I'm up for it. If you're willing to share some keywords that you think are relevant I can do the checks on Google Trends.

BTW just read up on how to interpret the results. I believe the 100 / 75 / 50 values on the axis relate to the percentage it was searched compared to the average listed.

For example you can see on the left that there were "average" bars noted for each keywords search. If I hover over those averages I could see that the "Monon High Bridge" was searched an average of 3 times per day (or something like that, I forgot the exact number but it was low) in the Chicago area. This average is then used to report on the percentage the word was searched each day compared to the average.

Would you, or anyone here, remember what @Awsi Dooger once said about the place of attack? Something like there was another bridge in/near Delphi that he thought would be a more logical choice for a random attack. What was it?

I don’t remember the name of the bridge (still know very little about Delphi) but it would be interesting to see if that bridge had hits in Chicago area around the same days as MHB. The perp was either looking for a good place, or there was something too specific about MHB.

I looked for “how not to leave your DNA”, but it had too many hits, lol. People are busy…

 

[Charlot123]

• 
  

  All of this stuff seemed so important in April 2019. I think time has shown us it signified nothing.
  
  -Someone hiding in plain sight
  I don’t believe this anymore. It defies logic in my opinion that this killer lives among the good folks of Delphi and they don’t recognize him on that bridge.
  
  -Someone younger
  Yes. The two second video shows BG is not some pot bellied older guy.
  
  -Local and well known that the community will be shocked.
  Don’t believe it for a minute. Locals do not know this person.
  
  -Someone who has spoken with LE and privy to direction of case.
  Possible but LE is hinting here that the killer is a twisted guy who is feasting off his crime by hanging out with LE. They might have talked to him but I think he’s more likely to just be smirking at LE’s ineptitude.
  
  -Not in the system so has not committed serious crimes before.
  Maybe but unlikely
  
  -A coward. Organized killer associated with power.
  Definitely a coward but thinks he’s a big man. Impulsive rather than organized. Opportunist. I do not think the killer is some criminal genius.
  
  -Has a caring family(“what will they think...?)
  I doubt it, but concede it’s 50/50 chance.
  
  -Noticeable changes in behavior or appearance
  Possibly
  
  -Has a little bit of conscience left
  I doubt this.
  
  Just my opinions, but I think too much time has passed for any of this to matter anymore.

  
  - someone hiding in plain sight
  Only in a way that if he lives in Kokomo, Indiana, he is probably cooking meth; if he lives in the Silicone Valley, he is probably voting “green” and drives a bike to work, and if he lives in Chicago, a megalopolis, he can do anything. He is probably not too noticeable and maybe even a speeding ticket is too much.
  
  - Someone younger
  
  But really, he is very close to someone older who knows. My intuition is split there.
  
  - Local and the community will be shocked.
  Not local and the community probably never ever noticed him.
  
  - Someone who has spoken to LE and is privy to the direction of the case.
  
  Had not spoken to LE and if he is privy to the case, it is just because he works where he can get snippets of info. To LE it looks like he is one step ahead of them. IRL, he could be a waiter in the court cafe, or is writing programs for their databases.
  
  - not in the system - agree
  
  - has not committed serious crimes before
  
  I think he is a serial killer, so, disagree
  
  - a coward.
  
  I don’t know. I think it is not quite applicable to him, but inside he feels small and unappreciated. I think he might have been abused as a child.
  
  - had a caring family. I suspect the family is dysfunctional, but they can’t see what he did as he always was such a good boy.
  
  - noticeable change in behavior or appearance.
  
  I think only with COVID. I think that before, he was the same. Maybe with COVID, he let out a beard, or became more casual. They are talking about a person with rich imaginary world, so his external world may not change.
  
  - has a little bit conscience left.
  
  Possibly. I think he has explanations for all his murders, like they deserved it, or invited it, or attacked him, but I suspect there is one he’d prefer to forget. It won’t prevent him from killing others.

 

[FromGermany1]

If we on WS google for our suspect and some details maybe, our searches will come up in Google Trend with our state/city, we are living in? Doesn't really please me.

 

[Blue Amethyst]

I'm up for it. If you're willing to share some keywords that you think are relevant I can do the checks on Google Trends.

BTW just read up on how to interpret the results. I believe the 100 / 75 / 50 values on the axis relate to the percentage it was searched compared to the average listed.

For example you can see on the left that there were "average" bars noted for each keywords search. If I hover over those averages I could see that the "Monon High Bridge" was searched an average of 3 times per day (or something like that, I forgot the exact number but it was low) in the Chicago area. This average is then used to report on the percentage the word was searched each day compared to the average.

This is fascinating. I didn’t even know that something like this existed. Good luck in your searches and maybe a pattern will show.

 

[Charlot123]

If we on WS google for our suspect and some details maybe, our searches will come up in Google Trend with our state/city, we are living in? Doesn't really please me.

Well, surely, if we Google for MHB our details came up…but did you ever Google for it before the killings?

After the killings, of course, there will be tons of hits. But before, did you ever hear of Delphi, IN?

After the killings (after 2019 PC) I googled “how not to leave DNA”, QUORA has a lot on it. But if someone googled in 2011-2012, it is different.

But yes, all that you Google is there. And maybe, his - if he works in IT, close to some databases or in Snapchat, as I am now wondering - is not.

Another way to find future victims - just hit me because of the restaurant shoes - is a waiter. In a big place where lots of travelers stay.

Didn’t they say somewhere that A&L traveled to Fla with the grandparents? Or maybe, there is some big place at MW where people often eat?

You get the names and the family name. If anyone Googled Libby Patty after that, it would be interesting.

A waiter is absolutely invisible. Forgettable.

 

[Zabble]

Well, surely, if we Google for MHB our details came up…but did you ever Google for it before the killings?

After the killings, of course, there will be tons of hits. But before, did you ever hear of Delphi, IN?

Yes you will see in the screenshots that I refined the search date range just up to 13 Feb 2017, so those results in my screenshot are searches leading up to the murders. I did not bother including searches post the murders because, as you rightly say, there was a significant increase in searching for terms like MHB.

 

[FromGermany1]

Well, surely, if we Google for MHB our details came up…but did you ever Google for it before the killings?

After the killings, of course, there will be tons of hits. But before, did you ever hear of Delphi, IN?

After the killings (after 2019 PC) I googled “how not to leave DNA”, QUORA has a lot on it. But if someone googled in 2011-2012, it is different.

But yes, all that you Google is there. And maybe, his - if he works in IT, close to some databases or in Snapchat, as I am now wondering - is not.

Another way to find future victims - just hit me because of the restaurant shoes - is a waiter. In a big place where lots of travelers stay.

Didn’t they say somewhere that A&L traveled to Fla with the grandparents? Or maybe, there is some big place at MW where people often eat?

You get the names and the family name. If anyone Googled Libby Patty after that, it would be interesting.

A waiter is absolutely invisible. Forgettable.

"Restaurant shoes" - never heard of it before here on the thread. Did you hear/read it before or is it your idea?? Do you think, BG is wearing them perhaps?