Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #141

[minazoe]

Another thing I wanted to post about is the jacket. I went back through the first couple of threads and found mention of the Subaru plant in LaFayette:

Found Deceased - IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #38

The Subaru company colours are typically various shades of blue. It's difficult to find images of workers at the plant wearing jackets as they're indoors, so typically just wearing blue t-shirts. Also, many jackets I found online are covered in bright logos.

However, I did find a Subaru jacket for sale on Ebay that looks, in my opinion, to be the exact shade of blue as the jacket in the video. It's a shame that the right side of the BG video is obscured by shade as it would likely be the side that an identifier like a logo would appear on. I've attached images anyway. Perhaps a local familiar with the plant will know how typical the Ebay listed jacket is of the ones that would have been worn by workers in 2017.

View attachment 328551 View attachment 328552 View attachment 328553

good find...very good find. mOO

 

[Yemelyan]

Another thing I wanted to post about is the jacket. I went back through the first couple of threads and found mention of the Subaru plant in LaFayette:

Found Deceased - IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #38

The Subaru company colours are typically various shades of blue. It's difficult to find images of workers at the plant wearing jackets as they're indoors, so typically just wearing blue t-shirts. Also, many jackets I found online are covered in bright logos.

However, I did find a Subaru jacket for sale on Ebay that looks, in my opinion, to be the exact shade of blue as the jacket in the video. It's a shame that the right side of the BG video is obscured by shade as it would likely be the side that an identifier like a logo would appear on. I've attached images anyway. Perhaps a local familiar with the plant will know how typical the Ebay listed jacket is of the ones that would have been worn by workers in 2017.

View attachment 328551 View attachment 328552 View attachment 328553

I think it's reasonable to guess that LE may know that the blue jacket is a Subaru plant jacket (or another identifiable brand/kind). The reason I say this is that TL said, when talking to reporter Barbara MacDonald of HLN, that a lot of people have turned in blue jackets but they have not yet been given THE jacket. So that leads to the question of how LE knows this. Is it because there are elements from the video OR, perhaps, the crime scene that leads them to know what kind of jacket it was? That's one possibility.

@StarryStarryNight JDD of Kokomo, sex offender, convicted of kidnap and attempted rape of 11 year old girl.

 

[CrimeAway]

The crime with the nine year old girl shows a total lack of control planning forethought etc. The Delphi crime just seems so different. Trying to insert yourself into a crime is common. And using social media to get attention and get people to approve of them? That's common too.

I can see some elements of disorganization in JBC's abduction of the 9 year old. However, it strikes me that perhaps he didn't expect her to be reported missing so quickly, and also didn't expect the very rapid police response. The vast majority of victims of stranger child abductions are dead within 3 hours, but there is often a delay of up to 2 hours before the child is reported missing (link below).

I think that the 9 year old victim suffered horrendously at the hands of JBC, but was incredibly lucky that she survived due to fast reporting, and a fantastic police response.

https://www.google.com/url?q=https:...EQFnoECAoQAg&usg=AOvVaw09XUlObl9jWi1emJVSNPua

 

[StarryStarryNight]

“@StarryStarryNight JDD of Kokomo, sex offender, convicted of kidnap and attempted rape of 11 year old girl.”

Thanks @Yemelyan. That’s exactly who I was thing of but couldn’t remember their name.

 

[iamnotagolem]

The Delphi crime is different. First, JBC didn’t even walk far with his victim and was apprehended immediately. If anything, he was a total moron. This guy, the BG…why no DNA? Did he learn his biology too well, or did he plan it exceptionally well? (Consider this, it was before the GSK story hit the newspapers. In 2017, Gedmatch being used by LE was not common occurrence, so he must have been on some genealogy sites…and how could he have signed into them without someone close to him at least being tested there?).

How can one avoid being identified by DNA, given that around 2013-2015, there was an outburst of genetic testing?

Either it is a very specific situation, or, the CS was so messed up and unprofessionally handled, that any lawyer can make a mincemeat of the case.

Either way, the case doesn’t look well for ISP. I am thinking of what BG had to know, and what professional skills to have, to organize it that well.

Either committed by someone too close to criminalistics and having experience at killing swiftly, or by a SK with Dahmer’s intelligence, but better planning, and ISP none the wiser.

JCK doesn’t fit either group,

I go back and forth between thinking BG was good at avoiding leaving his DNA and thinking he had a reason for his DNA to be there.

We all assume BG left before searchers arrived but he may have just joined the searchers and no one thought anything of it. How long after they were found was the video released? How many searchers noticed what other searchers were wearing? They were looking for two missing girls, not murder victims and a murderer, at that point they had no reason to think anything nefarious about any of the people on the scene. JMO

 

[Lavender Moon]

The only thing that makes me discount JBC at this time is the fact he is convicted and sentenced and we’ve heard no more about him. I haven’t totally scratched him off the list though. LE may still be trying to place him in Delphi. We’ll see.
To me, JBC’s Lafayette crime and Delphi are similar. Forget the age difference of the victims, I don’t think that matters at all. The Lafayette assault happened during the day with people around. Yes he lured the girl inside but that’s still pretty bold with a block party going on. He persisted with the attack even though people and LE were calling her name and looking for her. Completely invested in doing what he wanted to do. He admitted that he would have killed her if not discovered.
The Delphi crime was committed in the middle of the day on public trails and the killer persisted despite people at some point looking for the girls and calling their names. I think the killer had a gun and a knife and that was the extent of his planning other than planning to kill someone that day. Opportunity was his doorway in, and luck was his exit. He is not a genius. He is a lucky SOB.
The incredible boldness of both these attacks is shocking and a bit unheard of. Two attacks like this within a few miles of each other makes me wonder.
I am less certain right now Chadwell is the Delphi killer, but until LE arrests someone else JBC is still on my list.

I'm tottering on the fence as to whether JBC is BG. I share your opinion that the age difference between the 9 year old and Abby and Libby are not significant.

 

[minazoe]

it would be so easy to put all this JBC speculation to an end with a simple statement from the investigation and there isn't a peep on KAK... no real extra information just a path to consider. catfishing/online predators...I hope they find what they are looking for.

we are totally in a holding pattern. mOO

 

[iamnotagolem]

I'm tottering on the fence as to whether JBC is BG. I share your opinion that the age difference between the 9 year old and Abby and Libby are not significant.

I fully disagree. 9 years old is prepubescent, 13-14 year olds have started puberty and are very different from 9 year olds developmentally physically, mentally, and emotionally

 

[minazoe]

they are different how ever an age range is not unheard of like 9-14 is not unheard of..it is also not unheard of for a killer to kill adults and children and I believe it is because the crime has more to do with sadism then it does with actual sexual attraction...or the sexual aspect is secondary and the infliction of pain , fear and torture are the driver to sexual gratification..mOO

 

[Lavender Moon]

I fully disagree. 9 years old is prepubescent, 13-14 year olds have started puberty and are very different from 9 year olds developmentally physically, mentally, and emotionally

That is indeed often true. However, some monsters are indiscriminate in their choice of prey.
Furthermore , puberty begins at different ages for different children . A child that enters puberty at age 9 is no aberration.

 

[JnRyan]

Regarding JBC and KAK, I don't believe either is the killer here. KAK having an indirect connection via his contacts with like minded perv's? Yes, I believe that is possible. JBC - direct or indirect? I think that ship has already sailed. Given the high degree of publicity this has, I would imagine LE would be having a PC shortly after an arrest is made. Unless something comes out of KAK's data, I'm inclined to believe this case is exactly where it was 04 January 2021.

 

[Deleted member 229974]

I don't know why, but it seems that a lot of serial killers engage in taunting. I guess they think they're smarter than LE or something.

Sometimes there's an element of "please stop me." I don't think it's exactly remorse, but part of the brain seems to realize what the killer is doing is wrong. I don't know whether JBC feels any of that, but some of the comments on his Facebook, about doing things to ruin his life when things are going too well, kind of sound like he might have some awareness.

That’s true. Good points.

 

[HistoryNut]

it would be so easy to put all this JBC speculation to an end with a simple statement from the investigation and there isn't a peep on KAK... no real extra information just a path to consider. catfishing/online predators...I hope they find what they are looking for.

we are totally in a holding pattern. mOO

We certainly are and I also find it odd that LE hasn’t given an update on either man. The hopeful side of me wants to think their silence is for closer.

 

[Always Stay Hopeful]

So all that to say that this sounds like an organised psychopath, unlike the general profile people generally seem to be looking for. The known meth dealers and rapists are impulsive. This person has restraint. Psychopaths like this are typically boring, every day people. They don't appear to be the devil incarnate. I think (and again, just my opinion) that this will turn out to be a fairly average person, quite young, with a normal job, a normal family, etc. This also fits with Carter's comments about the identity being a shock to the community.

There was something I thought of today that I wanted to mention. Do you remember the press conference where it was said that the girls are "not how you left them", when speaking to the killer? This makes me feel like he left them a certain way to send a message. Possibly a message about Abby and Libby, to the public, or a message about something he hated or caused him disgust. Maybe he wanted to humiliate the girls and got off on leaving them in a way that everyone would see. Or maybe the message he was trying to send had nothing to do with them, but they were the instruments he used to send it. Maybe by LE not giving us any information, they are depriving the killer of what he wanted. The public doesn't know how the girls were left. Maybe he wanted us to know. This came to mind after thinking about the very small amount of information that's been made public. We already know that killers often send messages. Maybe knowing what the message was, though, could lead to who it was. Or the type of person who was responsible. If the killer was trying to send a message about Abby and Libby, the murder would seem, to me, more personal. Why though? That doesn't make sense. What could they have done that enraged him so badly that he decided to murder them. If he wanted to send a message regarding something else, the girls would be mere instruments to him. The crime took place around Valentine's day. Could it have something to do with that?

 

[evilwise]

If Chadwell is the killer there is literally zero reason for law enforcement to announce it before they have their entire case fully prepared. He's not hurting anyone where he's at.

Conversely if you think that he may have been surprised that law enforcement responded so quickly on the 9 year old - maybe he was already on the radar for that sort of modus operandi

 

[AC4RD]

The crime with the nine year old girl shows a total lack of control planning forethought etc. The Delphi crime just seems so different.

I see there's disagreement, G8, but I'm 100% on your side of this discussion JBC's crime, while appalling almost beyond belief, strikes me as the act of a guy with too few brain cells to begin with, who may well have been beyond any trace of human rationality for any number of reasons. Grabbing that poor girl in his own neighborhood, with people all around, is something a well-trained DOG is too smart to do, IMO.

Bridge Guy is also a beast far removed from human decency, but his crimes required some thought and planning and skill--all entirely unlike (IMO) JBC and that poor girl. The two are significantly different IMO (though I recognize that others may disagree.)

 

[minazoe]

If Chadwell is the killer there is literally zero reason for law enforcement to announce it before they have their entire case fully prepared. He's not hurting anyone where he's at.

Conversely if you think that he may have been surprised that law enforcement responded so quickly on the 9 year old - maybe he was already on the radar for that sort of modus operandi

I have heard that it was said that Chadwell was on their radar and they were aware of him but I don't think it was for anything to do with abusing kids ..well except he did have young children with him, I think some little boys when he was pulled over for drunk driving..but he is also an ex con parolee and maybe they know he has been floating around homeless and were aware of him in that regard...

 

[Boxer]

I see there's disagreement, G8, but I'm 100% on your side of this discussion JBC's crime, while appalling almost beyond belief, strikes me as the act of a guy with too few brain cells to begin with, who may well have been beyond any trace of human rationality for any number of reasons. Grabbing that poor girl in his own neighborhood, with people all around, is something a well-trained DOG is too smart to do, IMO.

Bridge Guy is also a beast far removed from human decency, but his crimes required some thought and planning and skill--all entirely unlike (IMO) JBC and that poor girl. The two are significantly different IMO (though I recognize that others may disagree.)

MOO if killing Abby and Libby was impulse driven I think JBC is a good suspect.
He hangs around bridges, he was working as a welder comfortable with heights.
Not too much a planner but a bold risk taker.

 

[Boxer]

I can see some elements of disorganization in JBC's abduction of the 9 year old. However, it strikes me that perhaps he didn't expect her to be reported missing so quickly, and also didn't expect the very rapid police response. The vast majority of victims of stranger child abductions are dead within 3 hours, but there is often a delay of up to 2 hours before the child is reported missing (link below).

I think that the 9 year old victim suffered horrendously at the hands of JBC, but was incredibly lucky that she survived due to fast reporting, and a fantastic police response.

https://www.google.com/url?q=https:...EQFnoECAoQAg&usg=AOvVaw09XUlObl9jWi1emJVSNPua

Fast reporting and super police.

 

[Marzipan]

Regarding JBC and KAK, I don't believe either is the killer here. KAK having an indirect connection via his contacts with like minded perv's? Yes, I believe that is possible. JBC - direct or indirect? I think that ship has already sailed. Given the high degree of publicity this has, I would imagine LE would be having a PC shortly after an arrest is made. Unless something comes out of KAK's data, I'm inclined to believe this case is exactly where it was 04 January 2021.

I wish this wasn’t you feeling this way. I wish it was some big mouth who didn’t really know much about this case or crimes and LE processes.
I hope in this case you are wrong.