Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #142

[Sgt. Pepper]

@TL4S, that sound you are hearing is my applause. This ought to be a "sticky" IMO. Well said, and bravo says I!

One of my posts was deleted because I gave my detailed opinion on these murders. In doing so I named the person I believe is highly a likely suspect. While I was aware LE hadn't named him an official suspect, to my knowledge he's still on their radar and hasn't been CLEARED as a poi. But it is a fact that DG was instrumental in bringing down some bad goings on. My point is at the press conference when they made reference to the "shack" I believe they were talking straight to the one particular person I named. Here's why...the word "shack" was in many headlines when Nicole Bowen was murdered on account that's where her body was found. In closing this is why I think the killings were motivated by revenge. And you can't tell me that LE hasn't thought of all this. It would explain the frustration of Carter at the press conference.

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

I recently heard an expert speak about fingerprints and it was really eye-opening as to what surfaces are best for prints and how fragile they can be. Basically, there are three types of prints: impression (imagine the three dimensional print left behind if you pressed your finger into a soft, moldable surface like clay or wax), patent (visible prints - imagine a finger coated in blood that pressed against a windowpane), or latent (invisible to the naked eye - these are left behind because the ridges of your fingers, palms, and soles of your feet have organic oils and sweat that can be invisibly left on certain surfaces). Because these latent prints are just made up of oils from your skin, on any surface they will break down over time and on certain surfaces they can be extremely fragile.

Forensic examiners classify surfaces in three ways - porous, non-porous and semi-porous. Porous surfaces are absorbent and would be materials like paper, cardboard, untreated wood, money, etc. Fingerprints deposited onto this type of surface are considered pretty durable and there is a high probability of collecting them, especially if the surface is smooth and non-textured. Non-porous surfaces , especially if smooth and non-textured, are also conducive for the deposition of prints, but because they do not absorb the oils and actually repel the moisture from a print as it's deposited, prints from these surfaces are more fragile and can be easily damaged by environmental factors (precipitation, heat, etc). These surfaces are glass, metal, plastics, painted wood, and rubber, for example. Semi-porous surfaces would be things like cellophane, glossy paper or treated cardboard/wood. This type of surface has to be processed using techniques adapted for both porous and non-porous surfaces. As with the other two types of surfaces, texture is a problem for print recovery because textured surfaces do not allow complete contact between the ridges of the skin and the surface being touched.

Some additional factors - surfaces that have become wet can be particularly challenging and require special techniques. Surfaces that themselves already have grease or oil are not great for the deposition of prints (some parts of firearms and human skin would be examples of this - in addition, human skin is not rigid and deforms under pressure so this can obscure print detail). Can you still get prints from these challenging surfaces? Yes, sometimes - but the probability is low and the detail, even if you succeed, is often not good enough for comparison.

TL said in the HLN special that they had evidence "suggestive" of a print but they did not know if it was the murderer's print. So we don't know if that was a patent (visible) or latent (invisible) print but it sounds as if it was perhaps not in the best condition when recovered or maybe a partial.

Here's more info about latent prints that covers what I shared above:
https://dofs-gbi.georgia.gov/document/publication/180850381gbi-latentprintspdf/download


https://dofs-gbi.georgia.gov/document/publication/180850381gbi-latentprintspdf/download

But fingerprints like DNA is a really a judgement call the way I understand it. In court each side brings their own experts that testify against each others findings. Which is up to jury to decide. Either way very frustrating.

 

[JnRyan]

OK here is a news article today about the 5 year mark and tips. AND they AGAIN bring up anthony_shots. If it doesn't have any relationship to the murder why include it?
Delphi murders 5 year anniversary: police ask for more tips

I'm wondering how much of this is coming directly out of LE's mouths and how much is due to the media including it without LE stating so. Then again, ISP opened Pandora's Box with that video clip in December so I suppose until LE makes a definite statement that the two cases are not related it is fair game for the media. I will say this, Fox59 has been doing a fairly decent job so far. It was Fox59 that sat down with the lead ISP investigator, 1st Sgt Holeman, in August 2017.

 

[JnRyan]

OK, a CBS affiliate, WANE 15, is on it now. anthony-shots is apparently still the news du jour.
Anniversary of the killings of Libby German and Abigail Williams approaches and police renew the plea for tips

 

[StarryStarryNight]

OK here is a news article today about the 5 year mark and tips. AND they AGAIN bring up anthony_shots. If it doesn't have any relationship to the murder why include it?
Delphi murders 5 year anniversary: police ask for more tips

I'm wondering how much of this is coming directly out of LE's mouths and how much is due to the media including it without LE stating so. Then again, ISP opened Pandora's Box with that video clip in December so I suppose until LE makes a definite statement that the two cases are not related it is fair game for the media. I will say this, Fox59 has been doing a fairly decent job so far. It was Fox59 that sat down with the lead ISP investigator, 1st Sgt Holeman, in August 2017.

I’m starting to also think that this whole thing is coordinated by LE.

 

[JnRyan]

OK, bear with me one more time as Good Morning America weighs in on the case. LE is stating they are still receiving 25-30 tips a week. Of course, they are also stating the tips come from all over the world. (I would wonder what the value of a tip from Europe would really be?) If they get an average of 25-30 tips a week that is 1300-1560 tips a year.
Indiana police issues warning to killer still at large for murder of Delphi teens

I did note that ISP Superintendent Carter states the anthony_shots case is a tip generator for them.

 

[TheVisual]

Interesting since MP said in an interview done after dark that the phone was pinging all over town. Later it was explained that the cell phone was pinging on 3 towers all about equidistant from the scene. The phone had apparently been at/near the scene of the crime the whole time. It was difficult to conceive of it as a crime at the start. MOO

ETA: My recollection, the official search was called off until morning.

For one thing, there were only two towers. I would expect many of their friends would have tried calling Libby's phone ( family included) hoping she would pickup. As long as there was any power in the phone it would have pinged to a tower.JMO

 

[JnRyan]

I’m starting to also think that this whole thing is coordinated by LE.

Your instincts are apparently spot on. See the GMA clip above and ISP Superintendent Carter's comment about KAK and his web site.

 

[margarita25]

OK here is a news article today about the 5 year mark and tips. AND they AGAIN bring up anthony_shots. If it doesn't have any relationship to the murder why include it?
Delphi murders 5 year anniversary: police ask for more tips

I'm wondering how much of this is coming directly out of LE's mouths and how much is due to the media including it without LE stating so. Then again, ISP opened Pandora's Box with that video clip in December so I suppose until LE makes a definite statement that the two cases are not related it is fair game for the media. I will say this, Fox59 has been doing a fairly decent job so far. It was Fox59 that sat down with the lead ISP investigator, 1st Sgt Holeman, in August 2017.

OK, a CBS affiliate, WANE 15, is on it now. anthony-shots is apparently still the news du jour.
Anniversary of the killings of Libby German and Abigail Williams approaches and police renew the plea for tips

OK, bear with me one more time as Good Morning America weighs in on the case. LE is stating they are still receiving 25-30 tips a week. Of course, they are also stating the tips come from all over the world. (I would wonder what the value of a tip from Europe would really be?) If they get an average of 25-30 tips a week that is 1300-1560 tips a year.
Indiana police issues warning to killer still at large for murder of Delphi teens

I did note that ISP Superintendent Carter states the anthony_shots case is a tip generator for them.

Thanks @JnRyan, adding to media thread now.

 

[JnRyan]

For one thing, there were only two towers. I would expect many of their friends would have tried calling Libby's phone ( family included) hoping she would pickup. As long as there was any power in the phone it would have pinged to a tower.JMO

Here is a blast from the past. A master of Google Maps, @skibaboo, created this one. It also has the cell tower locations.

Abigail Williams & Liberty German. Delphi, IN. 2/13/17 - Google My Maps

There 4 cell towers closest to the trail. However, the one farthest to the SW probably would not be a factor and it is almost on the same line from the trails as the tower near the high school. There is a 4th tower to the NE, but it is so far away I don't know if it would be a factor.

 

[JnRyan]

Thanks @JnRyan, adding to media thread now.

THANKS! I should have thought of that.

 

[Falcon500]

I happened to hear a radio interview today with Chief Deputy Mike Thomas of the Carroll County, Indiana Sheriffs Department. The chief deputy is usually responsible for the day to day operations of a sheriffs department but in the case of Carroll County I’m not so sure that’s the case.

it seems that Sheriff Tobe Leazenby is term limited and can’t run for re-election. The candidates to take his position are Mike Thomas, Tony Leggett, and some other guy. Three guys from the same department running against each other. All are Republicans and whoever wins the primary on May 3rd will be the new sherif. Tony Leggett also happens to be one of the two or three detectives assigned to the case.

Carroll County has a total of thirteen sworn officers. The sheriff, the chief deputy, two detectives, and nine patrol officers. That’s is not enough manpower to cover the county 24 hours a day. They must have some agreement with the state police to cover the remaining time.

Deputy Thomas claimed to not know who is investigating the case whether it be his department or the state police. He claimed to have never been invited into the “inner circle”. On the night that the girls were missing he claimed to not know anything about it and didn’t learn of the situation until he came to work the next morning. He also intimated that the weak spot on the department was the lack of skilled interviewers and if elected he was going to find some! He explained that Superintendent Carter has been the face of the investigation because “they are used to that sort of thing”. (Appearing before the press).

Before today I had thought that they had just not gotten the right break (I’ll refer you to my story of five years ago about cases that are meant to be solved). All of my thoughts have changed. Mike Thomas might be the best patrol officer in all of Indiana but the key to this case is that Carroll County is way over their heads in this one and I can’t figure out how the state police didn’t walk in and take the case from them.

I’m bumping this up because I put it in the wrong thread and as a result was buried.

 

[margarita25]

Here is a blast from the past. A master of Google Maps, @skibaboo, created this one. It also has the cell tower locations.

Abigail Williams & Liberty German. Delphi, IN. 2/13/17 - Google My Maps

There 4 cell towers closest to the trail. However, the one farthest to the SW probably would not be a factor and it is almost on the same line from the trails as the tower near the high school. There is a 4th tower to the NE, but it is so far away I don't know if it would be a factor.

I haven’t looked at your post/ map again because I’m compiling a thing in the media thread off your articles post, but this reminds me of the shed I think Skibby found it, and we zoomed on it. I’ll make a note to find that discussion.

—

the shed.

(...the shack?)

the shed.

—

Also, I’m reminded now of another shed, and flowers?? Was it on RL property?

—
eta, oh and there was another shed I remember seeing on a video, a quick drive by and I think the frame had to be frozen to see it. I think it was on the left of the screen, maybe reddish in color, like a barn.

Just thinking out loud, nothing new here. I’ll be lucky if I can keep details fresh.

 

[margarita25]

February 10, 2022
Delphi murders 5 year anniversary: police ask for more tips
FOX59

* Officials specifically looking for information related to anthony_shots profile, an online persona used by Kegan Kline

* KAK arrested in Miami County for possession of child , child exploitation, child solicitation and synthetic identity deception

“If you or someone you know communicated with the profile, police want to know when, how and what form of social media was used.”

* No link between Kline and Delphi murders has been established

* Police executed search warrant related to Kline’s case on February 25, 2017, more than one week after the murders

 

[Silver_produce0]

OK here is a news article today about the 5 year mark and tips. AND they AGAIN bring up anthony_shots. If it doesn't have any relationship to the murder why include it?
Delphi murders 5 year anniversary: police ask for more tips

I'm wondering how much of this is coming directly out of LE's mouths and how much is due to the media including it without LE stating so. Then again, ISP opened Pandora's Box with that video clip in December so I suppose until LE makes a definite statement that the two cases are not related it is fair game for the media. I will say this, Fox59 has been doing a fairly decent job so far. It was Fox59 that sat down with the lead ISP investigator, 1st Sgt Holeman, in August 2017.

The ISP statement on their website is a little bit odd, in my opinion.

As We Approach the Five-Year Anniversary of the Abby and Libby Murder Investigation

If you scan through the statement, there is a brief summary of the crime, a statement that they are working hard on it, and a request for any information on the crime (“on this crime”).

Then, a paragraph saying investigators would also like info on the profile. Like it almost seems like they’re not saying that the profile is a separate issue but it might be a separate issue.

 

[JnRyan]

The ISP statement on their website is a little bit odd, in my opinion.

As We Approach the Five-Year Anniversary of the Abby and Libby Murder Investigation

If you scan through the statement, there is a brief summary of the crime, a statement that they are working hard on it, and a request for any information on the crime (“on this crime”).

Then, a paragraph saying investigators would also like info on the profile. Like it almost seems like they’re not saying that the profile is a separate issue but it might be a separate issue.

Yes, that is really odd and coming directly from LE. The 5 year mark and KAK is apparently having a star role.

 

[JnRyan]

IF KAK is not involved in any way, directly or indirectly, he's got to be sitting in his cell wondering how in the world he got dragged into this case! "Why me?"

 

[margarita25]

Anniversary of the killings of Libby German and Abigail Williams approaches and police renew the plea for tips
February 10, 2022 / source: wane

Kegan Kline

* December 2021 - ISP released images from a social media profile for “anthony_shots” on Instagram and Snapchat

* Police said account had been used to solicit nude photos from underage girls

“Investigators are again asking anyone who may have communicated with, met, or attempted to meet the anthony_shots profile to contact them. For example, investigators want to know when the communication took place with anthony_shots, how it took place, what social media applications the account used, and if anthony_shots attempted to meet or obtain your address. Anyone with saved images or conversations with the anthony_shots profile, should include them in the tip.”

* Person linked to “anthony_shots” profile, KAK, is in custody and faces more than two dozen charges in connection with a child exploitation investigation

* KAK is being held in the Miami County Jail.

“Kline admitted to contacting underage girls on social media and soliciting nude photos, according to court documents. He told police he had about 100 photos and 20 videos of a sexually explicit nature.”

 

[margarita25]

Rsbm
As We Approach the Five-Year Anniversary of the Abby and Libby Murder Investigation

“As We Approach the Five-Year Anniversary of the Abby and Libby Murder Investigation

Delphi, IN - On February 13, 2017, Abigail Williams and Liberty German went missing while walking on a trail near the Monon High Bridge in the town of Delphi, Indiana. On February 14, 2017, their bodies were discovered. The Carroll County Sheriff's Department assisted by the Indiana State Police, Delphi Police Department, and other law enforcement agencies continue to work diligently to bring this case to a close.

Law enforcement continues to utilize county, local, state, and federal resources to accomplish our goal. There is still a dedicated, multi-jurisdictional team working on this case every day, which includes two Carroll County detectives, two Indiana State Police detectives, and other law enforcement officers. We continue to actively investigate all tips and leads we receive by phone and email. This type of violent crime cannot and will not go unanswered.

Anyone with information about this crime is encouraged to contact law enforcement by utilizing the TIP HOTLINE: [email protected] or (765) 822-3535. Provide as much information as you possibly can. For example, the name of the person of interest, their date of birth or approximate age, physical description, address, vehicle information, why they could be involved, and if they have a connection to Delphi.

Investigators would also like any individual that communicated with, met, or attempted to meet the anthony_shots profile to contact law enforcement utilizing the tip hotline listed above. Please provide as much information as you possibly can. For example, when you communicated with anthony_shots, how you communicated with the profile, what social media applications the account used, and if anthony_shots attempted to meet you or obtain your address. If you have saved images or conversations with the anthony_shots profile, please attach them to your email.

Listed below are Statements from the Sheriff of Carroll County and the Superintendent of the Indiana State Police.

"We continue to diligently seek the justice so honorably owed to Abby, Libby, their respective families, and our dedicated, local community. To that end, I want to stress that the investigation is still quite active and is NOT a cold case. We also continue to encourage the submission of valid and valuable information which will help us to attain the goal of justice for our precious Abby and Libby. Thank you to all who have come alongside us in our ongoing efforts."

- Sheriff Tobe Leazenby

“Working diligently every day with our county, local, and federal partners, we continue to give our very best efforts to solve this case. Abby, Libby, their families, and the Delphi community deserve nothing less. We also continue to ask for tips to be submitted, because one day we will obtain that one piece of information we seek…the identity of the person responsible for this senseless crime.”

- Superintendent Doug Carter

This is all the information that will be released at this time.”

 

[MistyWaters]

Copying from above, unfortunately I don’t think LE has a strong suspect, already locked up in jail or not.

“Working diligently every day with our county, local, and federal partners, we continue to give our very best efforts to solve this case. Abby, Libby, their families, and the Delphi community deserve nothing less. We also continue to ask for tips to be submitted, because one day we will obtain that one piece of information we seek…the identity of the person responsible for this senseless crime.”

- Superintendent Doug Carter

This is all the information that will be released at this time.”