Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #93

[DutchTreat]

The Shack is about a child who gets abducted and murdered by a serial pedophile who leaves behind clues. The father is a child of a alcoholic christian who beats his children. The premise is after his child is killed he struggles with God. What does the sheriff mean?

I think the sheriff knows exactly who the killer is. And this is a reference to something the killer can relate to.
I don't know if this has already been discussed, but a press conference being held on Easter Monday is really, really strange. Have there been press conferences on Catholic holidays before? It's not like there was some sudden development in the case that urged LE to do a presser on Easter. That was very, very deliberately chosen
IMO. That, as well as the reference to 'The shack' which has a religious theme as well, is no coincidence.
I think they know the killer is either a religious person. Or they might expect him to be at a family gathering for Easter and they planned this so they could observe his reaction to the presser.

I also wonder if there's a father and son involved in this case. When you look at both sketches, they could be a father and his son. Also the age range 16-40, could be a 16 year old and a 40 year old, so a father and a son. That combined with the reference to 'The shack' with complex father, son relationships as well as religion makes me wonder what is really going on here. And what exactly it is, that LE is doing.

 

[carmenugt]

"the Shack" is far deeper then that....the main character kills his abusive father and carries the guilt his whole life......it all comes to a head when his own precious little girl goes missing and her clothes are found with blood stains in an old shack/cabin......the man goes thru a spiritual revelation where he talks to God...God talks to the man and that God loves all his children, even the murderer of the man's little girl....that God forgives......ultimately the man is convinced to release his anger and hatred and forgive his dtrs killer......Carter is suggesting that the killer of Libby and Abby can be forgiven by God IF he does the right thing and admits it..

clearly, the police have the idea that this perp has a religious side, a side of him capable of carrying remorse....

Thanks for the insight. I thought he was suggesting it was a serial predator who left a calling card behind. Then I thought it was an angry Christian.

 

[MistyWaters]

What?.....do you have a link?

This poster’s information is not based on facts.

According to the Judicial Order to seal the autopsies, both girls died on Feb 13, 2017. The link can be found on the media thread if you’re interested.

 

[MassGuy]

This poster’s information is not based on facts.

According to the Judicial Order to seal the autopsies, both girls died on Feb 13, 2017. The link can be found on the media thread if you’re interested.

And what the coroner says, is the only thing that matters.

Not the date the parents chose for an obituary.

 

[tmar]

Hi everyone,
I’m very new to this site (but have followed this case carefully in the media since beginning-have kiddos close to this age).

I’m sorry to ask a question that might already have been discussed to death but:
I’ve seen the argument that BG can be seen hiding deep in the background in the trees in the image of Abby on the bridge. I can’t figure out how to find or search this, but saw someone had blown it up and it seemed possible. Do any of you believe this, or has this been dismissed? Thank you!

jules, firstly welcome with your first post.
I also saw videos that you refer to.
In the one with Abby on the bridge, and perhaps someone in the background amongst the tree, it later was stated (from my recall) that this was not a person.
It would be great if someone can access these videos.
MOO.

 

[carmenugt]

The rules of this thread are listed on page #1 and some of it pertains to discussion of people who are arrested for other crimes that have no connection to this one.

Yea, I only discussed it because he was ruled out and their are articles associated with this case and this man.

 

[ab01]

CASAREZ: So did you go -- did you go out -- since this was your property, you find out that they are there. Did you go out to the crime scene yourself?

LOGAN: The crime scene has been closed off. It was not -- my property was not released back to me until late Wednesday. I went to the crime scene Thursday morning to try to get a feeling of it. And it`s still difficult to just...

LOGAN: What did you see when you went out there?

CASAREZ: There was not much to see, other than the crime scene tape around the area. The area was still very pristine. You couldn`t actually tell that there was any such a violent action.

CASAREZ: You didn`t see any blood? You didn`t see a gruesome scene?

LOGAN: No, nothing. The area was very, very pristine. There was nothing there to see. I mean, really...

CASAREZ: Was there one crime scene and one location from what you could tell, or two separate crime scenes because there were two victims?

LOGAN: Just one. One scene. And apparently, I assume that both were found in this area because that`s -- what I`m pointing at to now is all that -- is all that was there.

CNN.com - Transcripts

What is this in reference to? I would assume evidence technicians would be very meticulous in collecting every single shred of evidence.....

 

[MistyWaters]

I am familiar with what the bridge looks like. We have been looking at this as a one or the other situation but it might not be. He could have been walking carefully because of the integrity of the bridge AND because of a limp or poor vision.

Do you think someone with a limp or poor vision would cross that bridge to commit a double murder?

 

[Wells]

New guy looks “slow/special ed” to me. As a veteran educator and school administrator/principal, I can always look at the eyes and see what is or is not registering...

My spouse is a SPED teacher and has worked with special needs adults and kids for almost fifteen years. That is wildly outlandish statement.

 

[Wells]

Do you think someone with a limp and poor vision would even attempt to cross that bridge?

Possibly. Depending on the degree of disability. A minor lazy eye might cause a person to walk a little more carefully was my point.

 

[gitana1]

I've taken to skipping pages

Someone once mentioned skipping every other page because you still see all the important stuff because it's usually quoted a lot.

 

[JillR]

It’s a sketch though, one made from a witness account.

I’m not sure a determination like that can be made, especially with all the variables involved.

I am not in the business of ever falsely identifying or labeling, however; since we should be focused on this new face, I am stating my opinion. It is MY 30 year professional opinion... and as any educator will tell you, we have seen MANY kiddos throughout our careers. This could help LE.

 

[Backstroke10]

CASAREZ: So did you go -- did you go out -- since this was your property, you find out that they are there. Did you go out to the crime scene yourself?

LOGAN: The crime scene has been closed off. It was not -- my property was not released back to me until late Wednesday. I went to the crime scene Thursday morning to try to get a feeling of it. And it`s still difficult to just...

LOGAN: What did you see when you went out there?

CASAREZ: There was not much to see, other than the crime scene tape around the area. The area was still very pristine. You couldn`t actually tell that there was any such a violent action.

CASAREZ: You didn`t see any blood? You didn`t see a gruesome scene?

LOGAN: No, nothing. The area was very, very pristine. There was nothing there to see. I mean, really...

CASAREZ: Was there one crime scene and one location from what you could tell, or two separate crime scenes because there were two victims?

LOGAN: Just one. One scene. And apparently, I assume that both were found in this area because that`s -- what I`m pointing at to now is all that -- is all that was there.

CNN.com - Transcripts

Wow, interesting! Thanks for sharing. There goes my knife, brutal and bloody theory.

 

[gitana1]

Why did they record themselves?

That's what kids do these days. And to think, when I was a kid we occasionally used a Casio to make a rape recording of each other telling jokes and making fart noises. Now they use smart phones to record every moment of their lives. And publish it on social media.

 

[Quinquin]

They could have DNA but if they do not have tissue to match , it's worthless.

I don't mean for evidentiary value for a court case. I am talking about comparing the DNA profile (which I pray that they have) with the "new" sketch. LE is able to compare a general DNA profile against the "new" suspect sketch. A general profile from a viable DNA sample will give characteristics like hair color, skin color, eye color, weight probability..etc. Not exact science like you say, but could add creditability to their description of the current POI.

 

[Jax49]

Wow, interesting! Thanks for sharing. There goes my knife, brutal and bloody theory.

Don't push that theory too far away. RL's comments were after LE finished with the scene. And, iirc we saw what some believed to be bloody leaves still visible. moo

 

[Wells]

I am not in the business of ever falsely identifying or labeling, however; since we should be focused on this new face, I am stating my opinion. It is MY 30 year professional opinion... and as any educator will tell you, we have seen MANY kiddos throughout our careers. This could help LE.

You can tell by their eyes if they are slow. That's pretty remarkable. My daughter has Dyslexia. Sometimes her eyes tear up because she cant read well. Through intervention and practice letters and words register, later than her peers but they register. Just curious, according to your intuition, can you tell when things may register as well or just that they dont register?

 

[carmenugt]

And what the coroner says, is the only thing that matters.

Not the date the parents chose for an obituary.

I respectfully disagree. I think the parents gets to do whatever makes them cope. I would never discount their feelings , acts or intentions of the parents. They get to grieve and believe what they choose to believe. IMO, the parents get to choose whatever day they want and it's okay. In a trauma, we would never try to change a families mind and tell them they are wrong. When they are ready, they may accept another story. They may not and that's okay. Grief is a journey. Everyone is different on that path. What they can accept is dependent where they are on that walk. IMO, it's not that big of a deal what date the family uses. Bless their hearts. I just can't imagine.

 

[MassGuy]

I am not in the business of ever falsely identifying or labeling, however; since we should be focused on this new face, I am stating my opinion. It is MY 30 year professional opinion... and as any educator will tell you, we have seen MANY kiddos throughout our careers. This could help LE.

And I am saying that there are many variables involved (witness accuracy, proximity to the suspect, artist skill, etc).

This is not a photograph of a suspect, it is a drawing that may or may not be close to what the guy looks like.

Drawing any sort of conclusion from that image in regards to mental capacity, isn’t just specious, it’s absurd.

 

[Backstroke10]

Do you think someone with a limp or poor vision would cross that bridge to commit a double murder?

No. IMO I know this wasn’t directed at me but I wanted to answer.