IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #42

[Justice101]

Fitness levels vary from person to person. One 60 year could run up a hill and one 30 year old may find it hard to walk up a hill.....

I am a 56 year old man. I weight 250 lbs and have run 8 half marathons in the past 4 years. I run 900 miles every year.

Most any man (that is in decent health) at this age could walk down a little hill like that and back up. No big deal. Might be a little winded, but again.. not a big deal. I live in the mountains in Virginia. We have some BIG hills. IMO, up to age 60 could walk up and down those little hills in Indiana pretty easily. So you are right, this age alone should not exclude anyone from going up and down that hill.. thanks

 

[Daae]

I am bothered by the comment by RL about the crime scene being pristine. Do WS's think that the evidence recovery team carried away lots of mapped out debris to find fiber etc.???... I would hope so. This is a very challenging site.

BG probably wore gloves and may not have left body fluids. LE would be searching for hairs and fibers in leaves which is very tough. Maybe shoe prints were found but what else from BG???? Perhaps he left part of his "kill kit". Just wondering

 

[JLSChook]

I personally think the silence of LE is a good sign.

Memories fade over time and the time to ask for help from the public was in the early stages... the first 2 or 3 weeks.

Maybe this is wishful thinking. IMO, also you can't serve a search warrant to clear someone. I don't think it works that way.

Even though RL does not look like the BG... let's look at this from a distance.

1) The bodies were found on the land owners property.
2) The land owner lied to authorities as to his whereabouts at the time of the murders.
3) The land owner has been conveniently arrested and is incarcerated on an unrelated habitual offender (DUI probation violation) charge.
4) The land owner's house, land, property and vehicle were searched and the vehicle was seized.


If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck.. it's probably a duck.

1) A killer would be pretty stupid to leave 2 girls that he killed on his own property

2) Link, please? I think that's just rumor/spec

3) MANY other people were arrested after being questioned on this case because of warrants/failure to appear/probation violations, etc...
See here: http://www.cbsnews.com/news/search-warrant-served-in-case-of-slain-delphi-indiana-girls/

4) LE has to be thorough and look at everything around the crime scene. (and this crime scene is HUGE--RL's property)

I don't see a duck. Just proper and thorough police work...so far.

 

[deugirtni]

IMO RL is not involved. In tape I saw of him, he didn't seem like the type. He was really open with news people and even walked them down to the site, and doesn't give off an aggressor vibe. The way this crime was committed and the desperation that appeared to be involved makes me think it was a sex crime/murder at gun point which resulted in a quick abduction into a car where the girls were then taken and brought back later (with two perpetrators that subdued them and then later moved them after they were deceased). It makes more sense since so many people were there right around the time of the abduction before and after the search per news accounts. Even if the girls had their mouths taped etc. The trees are open and expose a clear line of sight pretty much everywhere. It seems someone would have seen or heard something if the man/men and girls had remained there. A car that was waiting @ end of bridge seems much more plausible for a quick get away and for SA, then later bring them back later once crime had been committed. I searched for sex offenders based off RL's address, which comes up in a simple google search if you search for him by his full name (RL) Delphi, IN.

I am not naming any sex offenders since the post said we needed to email or message about them if we want to mention them but I will put the site up for others to search and for anyone to draw their own conclusions:

http://www.sheriffalerts.com/cap_main.php?office=54816

I will say the site gives you pictures of the offender's faces, height and weight, and it gives the address of where they work if you click the work address box.

The top red circle is where the girls were found (whether the crime was committed there is not definitive). The road that passes under the bridge is down the hill from where the bridge terminates on that side. It is a dead end road and I doubt highly traveled other than to the Transfer Station, and so any car/truck/van leaving that area most folks would probably assume was at the dump. The 2nd red circle below that is where the road that passes under the bridge terminates. The road is traced in black. Arrows shows where it leads in both ways to town and to the end of the road.

In my mind with the identifiers here, a highly probable scenario comes into focus. For anyone who does this search, let me know what you think. A simple yes or no will suffice since naming them probably is a no.

I carefully avoided using names here and do not mention any specific offenders, but provide w the way you can see them and draw your own conclusions, especially if RL seems as unlikely to you as he does me. I don't see a guy his age dragging those girls down from his property without leaving a large amount of evidence or without thinking he wouldn't be investigated thoroughly and I kinda feel sorry for the guy given this other information, which IMO seems more probable in an Occam's Razor kinda way.

Thanks for the link. I'm with you in that RL is not their man. I'm not convinced that rape was involved in this crime, however I can't imagine what else could otherwise have been the motive to kill 2 teens that day in that location. After a look, one of the pics is haunting me. Just looks like could be a match. Works nearby. Potato nose intact. Age is appropriate. It's tough to imagine that LE hasn't been all over these SOs in the area though, and cleared each of them for involvement. The pic on the SO site linked - he'd need a bit of a shave, and to be wearing the camo hat. I'd love to hear a clip of him saying 'down the hill' though, I'll tell you! Lists him as a 'sexually violent predator'. That seems to also fit. I can't find info on this person's 1st conviction, as to whether it involved male or female. His 2nd conviction was in reference to deviant behavior with a male.

 

[Blue Amethyst]

Does any one know if the transfer station has security cameras? If he had a vehicle on the road under the bridge, took the girls across the creek and returned back there then perhaps he drove to the transfer station with a bag full of clothes or a backpack etc. MOO

 

[ninij9]

I am a 56 year old man. I weight 250 lbs and have run 8 half marathons in the past 4 years. I run 900 miles every year.

Most any man (that is in decent health) at this age could walk down a little hill like that and back up. No big deal. Might be a little winded, but again.. not a big deal. I live in the mountains in Virginia. We have some BIG hills. IMO, up to age 60 could walk up and down those little hills in Indiana pretty easily. So you are right, this age alone should not exclude anyone from going up and down that hill.. thanks

I think your spot on!
My mother is 75 with 6 stents in her heart. She's currently an ex a smoker, but smoke for 50 years. She paints her deck and climbs her roof and washes her 2 story windows AND maintains 5 acres of grass and gardens. This includes moving boulders. She lives in the country. She says the day she slows down is the day she dies. She's also broken her hip, back and legs in her lifetime. I think someone who has acreage, and worked their acreage their whole life would've been able to cross the terrain with zero problems.
(Not that I'm speaking of anyone specific, just generally)

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[midwestseeker]

I'm not saying they didn't search, nor that I don't appreciate efforts. I think family was worried and frustrated with the amber alert guidelines. In a small close town. Family, friends, and Volunteers come from everywhere quick! They searched well passed the official call off time. Some searched before official start the next morning. Originally thinking they were hurt and stranded. Imo they weren't there to find.
That's why the pinging all over.

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Agreed! My opinion has always been that the girls were taken elsewhere and then left later and therefore were not there to be "found" while the family was searching. JMO

 

[Bemused]

RBBM

Is there a source for the second claim?

I think that's an assumption based on police statements some alibis or information didn't check out, but I don't think they've ever specifically stated RL's information was lies. We just don't know the same way people assume SA and rope or restraints were used in Abby and Libby's murders.

 

[Bemused]

<mod snip>

FTR I don't believe any evidence was planted.

 

[Bird of Paradise]

I think your spot on!
My mother is 75 with 6 stents in her heart. She's currently an ex a smoker, but smoke for 50 years. She paints her deck and climbs her roof and washes her 2 story windows AND maintains 5 acres of grass and gardens. This includes moving boulders. She lives in the country. She says the day she slows down is the day she dies. She's also broken her hip, back and legs in her lifetime. I think someone who has acreage, and worked their acreage their whole life would've been able to cross the terrain with zero problems.
(Not that I'm speaking of anyone specific, just generally)

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MOO

I really don't think it's fair to compare one person's health to another. What may be doable for one doesn't apply to another. We cannot make judgements based on appearances. Or whether or not a person has done a particular job their entire life. No one knows how manageable that profession was for that person.

If people want to proclaim in their opinion the property owner looks healthy, walked down the hill with ease, etc etc., you obviously are free to say so. Personally I don't see what purpose it serves. Unless someone has access to his medical files (and no matter how thinly veiled I think it's apparent the health comparisons are directed at RL) then the point is moot.

 

[Bemused]

Sad to see nothing new around here. Still the debate about whether or not it is RL, which will go on until we know something for sure. What I cannot wrap my head around are the pictures I saw of him the first day…
compared to bg who has a jacket on, and it's quite loose and baggy, RL has a giant belly that overstuffs his shirt. Imo, as much as 2+2=4, RL's belly doesn't fit in bg's jacket especially with room to spare.
But, what else to discuss?

You or anyone else may be correct that BG is not RL, but would you or they be able to swear to that in a court of law? That's all that's going to matter in the long run so I'm not sure why people (not you, just in general) get so annoyed when someone else thinks BG could be RL or everyone doesn't see a gun, rope and knife in the BG photos.

There is nothing new to discuss but the same things we do know. To me it's just people waiting around for the police to make an arrest and everything not related to the murders is off topic for this thread. What else would be discussed, even if no one can agree on what any of it means.

 

[kirkassoc]

But I'll bet alot of them were searching all over town. I remember that night reading that some family thought and hoped Libby was trying to get to her father's house (allegedly she has done so before). Jmo.


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I thought I read that Libby might have been trying to get to her "brother's" house? I could be wrong, I often am.:scared:

 

[BlueShoe]

Although to my eyes RL does bear a resemblance to BG (beyond the clothes), I find it hard to think of him as a (possible) murderer. I do think a person of his age could definitely be in good enough shape, I find it hard to imagine a motive. The only (hypothetical) motive that comes to mind for me is if he happened to be drinking and somehow became enraged (some have speculated that the girls may have inadvertently trespassed). However, I think if RL had been drinking, he would never have been up on that bridge. That bridge and alcohol just don't mix. Of course, there could be more nefarious motives, but I tend to agree with those who think we would have other evidence of previous escalating crimes instead of just a few DWI charges (and I'm not minimizing those). So motive is where I am stuck. I'm starting to consider the possibility that RL may be BG, but only peripherally involved, if at all in the murders. This is all entirely my opinion. MOO

 

[Bemused]

For anyone familiar with cellphone technology. Does a battery have to have enough juice to be located by GPS? For example, we don't know what type Libby had, but I have iPhone and iPad that have Find My Phone. I don't know if the devices have to be on and with a charge in the batteries to be able to locate. Anyone know if it's the same as tower pings wrt GPS?

 

[Bemused]

Although to my eyes RL does bear a resemblance to BG (beyond the clothes), I find it hard to think of him as a (possible) murderer. I do think a person of his age could definitely be in good enough shape, I find it hard to imagine a motive. The only (hypothetical) motive that comes to mind for me is if he happened to be drinking and somehow became enraged (some have speculated that the girls may have inadvertently trespassed). However, I think if RL had been drinking, he would never have been up on that bridge. That bridge and alcohol just don't mix. Of course, there could be more nefarious motives, but I tend to agree with those who think we would have other evidence of previous escalating crimes instead of just a few DWI charges (and I'm not minimizing those). So motive is where I am stuck. I'm starting to consider the possibility that RL may be BG, but only peripherally involved, if at all in the murders. This is all entirely my opinion. MOO

I agree. A grown man may not be able to lift up a car on one side but if his child was underneath I've seen cases where people had so much adrenaline that they were able to. We don't know enough to state RL couldn't have done it physically.

 

[tokyorose]

MOO

I really don't think it's fair to compare one person's health to another. What may be doable for one doesn't apply to another. We cannot make judgements based on appearances. Or whether or not a person has done a particular job their entire life. No one knows how manageable that profession was for that person.

If people want to proclaim in their opinion the property owner looks healthy, walked down the hill with ease, etc etc., you obviously are free to say so. Personally I don't see what purpose it serves. Unless someone has access to his medical files (and no matter how thinly veiled I think it's apparent the health comparisons are directed at RL) then the point is moot.

Did LE POI make any kind of a statement yesterday? IMO they are absolutely waiting for the evidence from the SW on RL's home to be processed. It could be another 2 weeks of silence from LE. RL does not look like BG to me, but I am guessing he knows who BG is. IF LE can somehow link RL to this crime through forensic evidence then they will offer him (RL) a plea deal. Either tell us what you know or be charged as an accessory to a double homicide.JMO. Either give up BG or potentially spend the rest of your days locked up...JMO. They don't need the public to identify BG they already have someone who knows who it is. Also, JMO but LE has already checked out the RSO's in Delphi and probably the entire state. It's my educated guess it's the first thing they did.

 

[Bemused]

MOO

I really don't think it's fair to compare one person's health to another. What may be doable for one doesn't apply to another. We cannot make judgements based on appearances. Or whether or not a person has done a particular job their entire life. No one knows how manageable that profession was for that person.

If people want to proclaim in their opinion the property owner looks healthy, walked down the hill with ease, etc etc., you obviously are free to say so. Personally I don't see what purpose it serves. Unless someone has access to his medical files (and no matter how thinly veiled I think it's apparent the health comparisons are directed at RL) then the point is moot.

Some people noted the PO didn't seem to have any trouble walking down to the spot the girls were found in at least one of the media interviews. It doesn't say anything other than he didn't seem unable to.

 

[Bemused]

Although to my eyes RL does bear a resemblance to BG (beyond the clothes), I find it hard to think of him as a (possible) murderer. I do think a person of his age could definitely be in good enough shape, I find it hard to imagine a motive. The only (hypothetical) motive that comes to mind for me is if he happened to be drinking and somehow became enraged (some have speculated that the girls may have inadvertently trespassed). However, I think if RL had been drinking, he would never have been up on that bridge. That bridge and alcohol just don't mix. Of course, there could be more nefarious motives, but I tend to agree with those who think we would have other evidence of previous escalating crimes instead of just a few DWI charges (and I'm not minimizing those). So motive is where I am stuck. I'm starting to consider the possibility that RL may be BG, but only peripherally involved, if at all in the murders. This is all entirely my opinion. MOO

The only motive that makes sense to me based on my opinions is a crime of passion scenario. IMO heat of the moment.

 

[Eileen730]

Why lead 2 girls to your own property to kill them and then leave them.
Sorry makes no sense to me

 

[tokyorose]

The only motive that makes sense to me based on my opinions is a crime of passion scenario. IMO heat of the moment.

I would not rule out a sexually motivated crime in a man of 77. Not saying that is the case here, I have no idea. My father who is almost 90 still gives lustful glances after young women as did my father in law who just passed away at the age of 79. Men are different from women, and are always thinking about sex, even after middle age. There is no way to tell by looking at someone what goes on in their minds, and hearts. You just can't...MOO