IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #46

[mtnlites]

Families do not choose date of death. Coroner does that.


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My son died in 2010. In our case, we provided the obituary to the local newspaper, along with the date. The coroner didn't have anything to do with it. This might be a small town thing or it might just be a MY town thing.

 

[Confusion]

I know this goes again the grain of most learned thinking, but I still wonder if there is a chance BG doubled back and caught up with the girls on the north end of the bridge and this might possibly be the route of the abduction to where the bodies were found???


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That's always been what made the most sense to me. Either he turned around and went back north when the girls got on and started heading back that way, or they passed on the bridge and he turned around and followed them back. I believe they started across and waited on the first platform for him to pass. MOO

 

[Bemused]

Bemused, from what transpired at the probation hearing, it seems LE is not considering him more of a supsect. Do you think LE would have showed their hand more if they thought he was?

WADR, when the Sheriff of Carroll County personally transports a prisoner, and the Chief of Police of Delphi is at that hearing, and given LE has never cleared the PO publicly TTBOMK, something is up. IMO

 

[WebSight]

Here's the link I was looking for - this photograher is MSM so this should be allowed:

https://www.facebook.com/jkyle.keen...7780.1073741969.1174987605&type=3&pnref=story

Also here:

I am glad you found it. I had two screens up as I was trying to find it for you. I had the link saved but couldn't find it so, honestly, why did I even bother, lol.

 

[jillycat]

My son died in 2010. In our case, we provided the obituary to the local newspaper, along with the date. The coroner didn't have anything to do with it. This might be a small town thing or it might just be a MY town thing.

Same here. I wrote my son's obituary and the funeral home published it on their website as I wrote it and forwarded it to the local paper who did the same.

 

[YQuest]

If true he might have left them both for dead when in fact one wasn't. IMO

JonBenetRamsey was found on December 26, but the family chose December 25 for the date of her death. Her father spoke of this in an interview.

 

[WebSight]

There are several newer articles that state RL isn't a suspect. (Sgt Kim Riley on RL's court day)

Do you still think RL is BG?

On another note, Bemused....You are amazing with finding older links and videos on this case! Whenever someone needs something, (morning, noon or night)--there you are with the info. I think that's awesome.

I hope you find time in there somewhere to sleep. :bedtime:

FWIW. And NOT to take away your kudos to Bemused but more jumping off your post:

I wonder that people don't use the media thread at the beginning of each new thread. There are twelve+ pages of links to videos and articles plus transcripts of interviews and Skib's maps plus many others, all in chronological order. Most of the links to videos are there, especially the older ones. We can find those ourselves if would take the time.

People have put in a lot of work to add to them so it would be great if we would look there. Also, Youtube has many of the news story footage posted there.

If we are sleuthing, shouldn't we do some of the leg work?:lookingitup::findinglink:

 

[expatCanada]

No it's not "highly unusual". We did that with my foster brother. He had a diabetic episode and was declared brain dead. He wanted his organs donated and that took time to get the donees ready, etc. His organs were donated 2 days later and he was kept "alive" on life support. For his obit ... we chose the day we said good-bye ... brain death day and not the day his organs were taken and his life support ceased. Six weeks later the death certificate arrived and it stated day of death was when his organs were donated.

Families write the obit with the funeral home. IMO one family picked the day they disappeared and the other family picked the day they were found. JMO again.

Go look at all these missing person cases. The day of death is the day body found even if they had been missing 1 day or months or years.
Example: Caylee Anthony's death certificate - Day found even though she had been dead (obviously) for a very long time.

http://www.autopsyfiles.org/reports/Other/anthony, caylee_report.pdf

Choosing a day of death is highly unusual and would typically happen only if the exact day wasn't known. I have no doubt they passed on different days. The question is, why? Jmo

 

[AmateurAnalyst73]

Jumping off on the "not very tech savvy" angle, I don't think we really can say one way or the other. If Liberty sent the video straight to Snapchat(?) or some other cloud capture, BG could have, maybe later(if he realized she had a phone), taken the phone from her, eventually destroying it, pulling the battery and discarding, etc. LE still has not, AFAIK, stated whether or not they have the physical phone.

Anyone think there is a very small chance the bridge guy (BG) wore a disguise? I don't really think so. Due to his age, he's not very tech savvy and wasn't able to destroy the images from the victim's phone. Also, he wasn't planning on letting the girls live to describe him. I don't think he had the foresight to consider the girls would have gotten video or still photos of him before the attack or even during.

On the other hand-- if he is extremely, extremely careful and methodical and patient and like the Zodiac (who claimed to have worn disguises) he might have worn a disguise especially if he is a local on the small chance that one or both victims either escaped his attack or survived.

 

[Jethro4WS]

Thanks, but it's all I can do to keep up here.

http://www.pharostribune.com/news/local_news/article_9a9f575c-f3b3-11e6-98fc-6f2b82153734.html

That has some information on the search.

Generally speaking, MSM has done shoddy reporting about the search. Like I said, you will learn more about the searches including the exact times different kinds of searches took place in the scanner thread. I would not rely on any of the MSM reports of search activities - not the least of which is the one that says that the searches began at 11:45am. Nor would I rely on what Leazenby said when talking about searches - especially the dogs - which also wasn't accurate. I say this because the actual Fire and Police scanner traffic says otherwise.

 

[Jethro4WS]

If the girls were not located at the SE end of the bridge as I've marked on the map, where were they?

Where would you place the "SE end of the bridge" in the map?

The SE end of the bridge is some 500 feet or more south of where you have it. The bridge goes over land for quite a distance.

 

[Bemused]

You don't think it had to do with the SM death threats? I'm having a really hard time trying to figure out why so much attention on RL and why LE ISN'T coming out one way or the other about him.

Why weren't there more police officers around the van RL was transported in when he was taken out to go into the courthouse? He didn't appear to have a BPV on that I could tell. There was Sheriff Leazenby and another deputy who, btw, was wearing a vest but the Sheriff wasn't. The Sheriff either isn't a terribly busy man, which I doubt, he only has one deputy, which I also doubt, or something smells like smoke. MOO

 

[asyousay]

I think the death certificate for one of them was the 14th and one died on the 13th.

Why would the family's pick different dates unless the dates were different as it seems almost disrespectful to the girls who stuck together until the end ?

 

[Bemused]

They didn't have enough man power to search 4.5 miles X 4.5 miles which is in that range for square miles.

http://www.pharostribune.com/news/local_news/article_9a9f575c-f3b3-11e6-98fc-6f2b82153734.html

 

[shifferbrainz]

Jumping off on the "not very tech savvy" angle, I don't think we really can say one way or the other. If Liberty sent the video straight to Snapchat(?) or some other cloud capture, BG could have, maybe later(if he realized she had a phone), taken the phone from her, eventually destroying it, pulling the battery and discarding, etc. LE still has not, AFAIK, stated whether or not they have the physical phone.

Am am going to assume if they haven't found the phone they would not be letting anyone near and would still be combing the woods looking for it. Merely an assumption.

 

[Bird of Paradise]

FWIW. I wonder that people don't use the media thread at the beginning of each new thread. There are twelve pages of links to videos and articles plus transcripts of interviews and Skib's maps plus many others. Most of the links to videos are there, especially the older ones.

People have put in a lot of work to add to them so it would be great if we would look there. Also, Youtube has many of the news story footage posted there.

If we are sleuthing, shouldn't we do some of the leg work?

Thank you for this. There have been so may posts with questions that can be easily answered by looking in the media threads. (Heck, even a quick Google search). And I am grateful for all the effort of those who put together timelines which benefit all of us.

 

[Bemused]

FWIW. And NOT to take away your kudos to Bemused but more jumping off your post:

I wonder that people don't use the media thread at the beginning of each new thread. There are twelve+ pages of links to videos and articles plus transcripts of interviews and Skib's maps plus many others, all in chronological order. Most of the links to videos are there, especially the older ones. We can find those ourselves if would take the time.

People have put in a lot of work to add to them so it would be great if we would look there. Also, Youtube has many of the news story footage posted there.

If we are sleuthing, shouldn't we do some of the leg work?:lookingitup::findinglink:

I am just accustomed to using a search engine with keywords to locate information. Nothing wrong with the media thread at all.

 

[Bird of Paradise]

Why weren't there more police officers around the van RL was transported in when he was taken out to go into the courthouse? He didn't appear to have a BPV on that I could tell. There was Sheriff Leazenby and another deputy who, btw, was wearing a vest but the Sheriff wasn't. The Sheriff either isn't a terribly busy man, which I doubt, he only has one deputy, which I also doubt, or something smells like smoke. MOO

Fair enough, but bouncing off that thought, what does having them present prove? Did they think RL would make a run for it?

 

[Alexsea]

Okay, this is going to be really unpopular, but does it really matter what end of the bridge they went off, where the "down the hill" happened? We have our theories, of course. They were found where they were found. We have all the released photos, which seem to point to the south end, but what, exactly, does that prove. If they went off the north end, how does that help us? Just asking the question. I'm really not trying to cause controversy here.


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[AmateurAnalyst73]

Humiliation, as well, or as a way to make it easier to control them. Being embarrassed by nudity would be a deterrent to running for help for most teens, I would suspect, again, if we assume they even WERE found without clothing.

Crime scenes are sometimes staged to try to throw the police off. The other evidence will tell the tale.