IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #5

[ninij9]

I'm hoping this case doesn't go the way the Missy Bever's case has. If it does, we will still be here months from now debating the shadows in the photo.

Threads and threads of head lamp vs no headlamp. Ugh. I hope that doesn't happen. These poor girls.

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[ninij9]

You know that saying, One picture is worth a thousand words? We sure got that beat to all hell...

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[jillycat]

I do think this is possible but most people who carry guns like concealed carry(myself included) do not put them in a pocket.Well except the druggie robbing the qwiki mart.This is not secure.Even the guys in the movies stick them in the waist of their pants.But come to think of it concealed carry do not put in pocket because it could be seen and we may be seeing it.

My son carried in a holster he carefully chose, and said how and where you carry is/should be relative to how, given your body type, height, comfort/easy movement in angle, and many other things, you'll best be able to draw with sufficient speed and good grip to respond to a threat. I seriously doubt this person is that thoughtful, particularly if he's carrying for the purpose of coercing easy victims to an isolated location for his greater crime. But to haul a gun in that position is pretty strange.

And it may be a gun, it may not be. There seems to be many layers to his clothing and whatever else he's packing.

 

[DeDee]

John Mellencamp is from Indiana.

I adore John Cougar Mellencamp's talent. Saw him live at a JazzFest in 2011. He grew up in a Small Town very similar to Delphi.

Billboard, 2001

John Mellencamp is arguably the most important roots rocker of his generation. John has made fiddles, hammer dulcimers, Autoharps and accordions lead rock instruments on a par with electric guitar, bass and drums, and he also brought what he calls 'a raw Appalachian' lyrical outlook to his songs. Mellencamp's best music is rock 'n roll stripped of all escapism, and it looks directly at the messiness of life as it's actually lived. In his music, mortality, anxiety, acts of God, questions of romance and brotherhood, and crises of conscience all collide and demand hard decisions. This is rock music that tells the truth on both its composer and the culture he's observing.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Mellencamp

In Memory of Libby and Abbie ~ John Cougar Mellencamp

[video=youtube;SipZ2G31uls]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SipZ2G31uls[/video]

 

[JJ007]

What direction did the LE interview or article mention the POI might be traveling? Someone said south east towards Strawtown/Noblesville. But I also read possibly west towards Lafayette? Can anyone confirm without theory please. Doing some research on a possible reason for direction and it's good.

 

[jillycat]

I was having a mental image of a guy pretending to have a gun in his pocket but it is his finger.If you really have a gun wouldn't you just show it.

I was a case manager for a homeless shelter years ago and had a client that took a cabbie hostage and made him drive from Denver to Boulder under a pretense of having a gun in his pocket.

 

[perfectingpink]

Earlier, we were talking about familial DNA and the fact it is not in use in Indiana. Since the FBI is involved, can they us familial DNA? I know sometimes they can step in and take over the court case that can result in the death penalty in states that do not have the death penalty, so this is why I am wondering.

 

[cuffem]

If he's left handed and there is an " inside" pocket in his jacket, then he reaches in the jacket, with his left hand and can readily pull it out

Then he is a novice because no one who handles guns would put one in a pocket,not secure and no easy slide out.

 

[TeaTime]

Thank you for the John Mellencamp song. Beautiful.

 

[eekasaur]

For some reason, I do not believe that that mustache is fake. One, it doesn't look fake. Two, I get a feeling that that mustache is an integral part of his being. But you are right, if he has altered his appearance, he's probably shaved it off.

Something to keep in mind for people who are in the area and brainstorming who this might be...assuming that this mustache has probably been on his face for some time, and assuming that he has now shaved it to change his appearance...there is a good chance that he'll have a tanline on his face now because the hair has been covering that portion of his face for some time. Food for thought.

 

[neesaki]

In the video here, the former FBI agent suggests that the suspect would have history with the trail and the surroundings.

So that indicates a local, rather than a drifter? Sorry if I missed something, I'm just trying to get caught up. TIA

 

[Bob Saccamano]

So that indicates a local, rather than a drifter? Sorry if I missed something, I'm just trying to get caught up. TIA

Is this an agent who has had access to evidence?

 

[Falling Down]

A week ago, the search there had been suspended for the night, and LE, probably not alarmed themselves by tbe case, basically had said there was no cause for alarm in the hours previous.

12 hours later it turned into a double homicide investigation.

I live here in NE Indiana, and found out about fhe case on Thursday. I still maintain a regional, multi-state alert should have been issued.

This guy is long gone folks, and by that I mean he's no longer in the immediate area. He knew how to get in and out quickly. Could have done dry runs this winfer, as it's been mild for the most part. May have lived in the immediate area in the past.

Just trying to build a psych profile, here. Someone familiar with fishing. Has an interest in parks such as these, for a variety of reasons, but one of tbem centering around violent crime.

He knew he would raise little suspicion, with his disguise. He planned it in advance, as the clothing, while odd in some ways (for a variety of reasons) is suitable for the conditions. In warmer weather he could not have pulled this off. Foliage is non-existent, working in his favor, considering the premeditated crime he had planned, and fhat he may have used optics or jusf plain line-of-sight to see his target(s), across a large expanse.

I've hiked in urban, rural, and hilly/mountainous areas. One park where I'm from is in a densely populated city, but like this one is an old, abandoned railroad property. I swear I hiked that park, entering via a parking lot, down the main hard surface trail, many times over about a 3 year period, yet it wasn't until a November day that I noticed right off the trail on one side was a huge berm, and on the other side beyond the trees are the remains of old industrial buildings' foundations. We're talking mere feet, 30-50 feet on one side, and about 200 on the other. Features obscured by foliage, after decades of lack of use by the old owners.

Arthur Shawcross wasn't a hiker, either, in fact he was middle-aged and out-of-shape when he left one of his victims in the gorge below the area I described above. He knew the area, after having lived in the city for a short time, and had talked like any seemingly normal person would to those around him. People I know who met him had no suspicions about him, until he got picked up in (I think it was 1990). Co-workers and others had no idea the guy had murdered two young children in Watertown, NY, in 1972, and after being paroled ended up in Rochester.

This sick planned this well in advance. His urges, like other serial killers, get the best of him, but he's more methodical than a dummy like Shawcross. More similar to the guy in Buffalo I don't remember fhe name of, and other killers who target young women in public parks. This one knows the areas of several parks where he knows his female victims will be most vulnerable, but he can't strike every time he gets an urge. To him, it's a game. Even if someone alerted law enforcement to this , images like those we've seen would be all they could go on.

Ten guys at my local Rural King store could pass for this dude. He knows this, and can slip in and out of a scenario like this, especially considering the time of year.

 

[JJ007]

On the gun in pocket theory. If I were the killer I'd do the following as I exited the scene. Now, this is a huge leap but hear me out. Remember silencers are legal and available in Indiana with a tax stamp (or illegally via cash from a friend, on Craig'slist, anywhere really). If I were walking across a big area and had just killed two people and didn't want to be caught I'd put the gun in pocket with finger on trigger and if someone tried to bother my exit plan I'd pull the trigger through the coat so not to be noticed. Just a thought. Or even without a silencer for that reason. That way no one sees my gun, but is easily available. And silencers are short these days especially for semi-auto loading sub sized autos.

 

[ninij9]

RSBM

Can't believe how quickly this thread is progressing....

So, the girls' phones were found ? Not sure how I missed it. Looking back I think it was said their phones were found in water.. so forensics has been able to restore them, then ?
If so, that's good news.
:moo:

I don't think we were told the phones were recovered (or phone as it is said only Liberty possessed one). There was theory that the perhaps the perp could have thrown Libby's iPhone in creek to destroy evidence. But it was all theory. I do believe that LE is retrieving and recovering data from their cloud with the help of the FBI and probably helpful young friends of the girls.

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[mom2four717]

 

[aust amateur slueth]

So LE has no "tools" or capabilities for night searches. I did not realize this. I guess my next question is why the search did not commence at dawn the next day? I understand they waited until after 8am?

7:41 AM
Tuesday, February 14, 2017 (GMT-5)
Sunrise in Delphi, IN, USA

I'd suggest they waited until there was a reasonable amount of light so that evidence wouldn't be destroyed.

 

[Robert Lindsay]

I remember hearing somewhere that the FBI has people dedicated to infiltrating the dark web.

They got into one of the invite only sites by accident somehow and they busted the guy who ran it and his clientele. But that's it. They have not cracked anything else.

It's hardly crackable anyway from what I understand. No one knows who anyone is down there and there's no way to find out who anyone is. If a cop or anyone for that matter is wandering around down there mostly what you are going to see is a bunch of really weird closed doors to sketchy websites. Everything requires an invite or a password. It's like walking through a huge hotel where all the doors are locked.

There are all sorts of weird and creepy and sleazy sites down there, but the really illegal stuff like child is typically invite-only. And I guess the cops are not going to get an invite. One of the largest child sites down there is run by a woman who got molested as a girl and apparently liked it and turned into a pedo herself. I think she runs it with her husband. No one seems to know who she is, and there doesn't seem to be any way to find out.

I believe 60% of the Dark Net is CP. Ugly place.

PS I have never been to the Dark Net, and I don't go looking for real CP on the web. CP barely exists on the real web anyway, and your chances of stumbling across it accidentally are vanishingly small

 

[JJ007]

Please remember new members to look at the TOS rules about posting and responding to other posters before a mod comes in to do it.

About what topics? Just curious. Meaning like people mentioning FB and the like or do we have to have a mod intercede in every post? Confused.

 

[Elainera]

7:41 AM
Tuesday, February 14, 2017 (GMT-5)
Sunrise in Delphi, IN, USA

I'd suggest they waited until there was a reasonable amount of light so that evidence wouldn't be destroyed.

bbm - but they didn't think any crime had occurred, right? So why worry about evidence being destroyed in the dark?