"incestuous" images found on JP's computer in Utah

[DLT88]

How do we start to make something a law? I think we should try and get someone to draft up a proposal and get a zillion signatures (we can do it) and put pressure on whoever we need to make computer-generated 'cartoon' images that depict child TO BE ILLEGAL. He could have been arrrested 2 years ago if it were.

 

[DLT88]

Just wanted to add that one of the reasons I believe it was unplanned and that Susan stumbled onto something is that if it were planned, I don't think Josh would plan it for a Sunday afternoon/evening knowing all he'd have to go through to get rid of her body, in a blizzard and in the middle of the night, dragging his kids with him, and missing work the next day, and knowing the babysitter would be wondering where the heck the kids were.

If it were preplanned, I'd think he'd want the most possible time between killing her and when people would start noticing she was gone. I'd think he'd plan for the kids (witnesses) to be elsewhere.

All this (to me) speaks of sudden unplanned violence, then holy *****, I have to get rid of this body. Then 'where's my beanie' and 'can someone get me some lotion for my wind-burned hands.'

It's possible he was planning it but maybe not for that specific night but he had to move quick because maybe something did get revealed that night.

They think he planned everything, though, down to the detail once they saw how 'retentive' he was keeping every single receipt filed in the order the purchase was made for many years. It showed a very very controlling person -- plus with other things -- shutting off the utilities, etc. I often thought the 'sledding with the boys' thing was planned, too, to give the drug he gave Susan time to work, perhaps, AND to have an excuse to get out the sled because I think he moved her body from the trunk to wherever by pulling it on a wooden sled.

 

[strawberry]

I can't believe what I just read. Father in heaven forgive me for the anger I feel right now.

This was the document dump prayer on the Caylee forum: "Forgive me for what I am about to read."

 

[dovebar]

I'm utterly baffled at all the info UT had, and all the info WA had, and STILL.

STILL he had those boys in a situation where he could have killed them and the social worker. Or killed the social worker and gone on the run with them and molest them to no end. Instead, he managed to kill two of them.

I just need explanations and answers from the authorities, or I'm not going to feel safe in either state, and I don't think other women and children should either.

 

[CHERIE.T]

WHY wasn't j charged with posession of child ?
Anyone care to take a guess?

I can hardly stand reading this stuff.
I hope the fires of hell are eternal.

imho

 

[simlyme]

We've all got so many questions with this case, and it will probably sound like I'm beating around the bush? because I've been thinking about this for quite some time. BUT, here it goes, I hope it makes some sense to at least 1 sluether.

I think we have to ask ourselves,

Who is responsible for this?

Who pulls the plug?

What I mean is, out of the hundreds,maybe thousands of "officials"-"proffesionals" that have worked on this case for 2+ years, WHO is the person that "SHOULD" have stopped this maniac?

I 've come to believe that "officials"-"proffesionals" will only do what they can to a point, once they feel they /or their family could be harmed by the "maniac(s)",its passed on, almost like being a victim.

When we think about how insane this person really is, how can anyone take the task on of pulling the plug?

I think JP scared everyone during most of his living years, like a paralizing scare, and actually continues to, even after his death.

I dont think any official/proffesional could have SAFELY pulled the plug, there would have been many more taken by JP.

I dont know if that made sense to anyone :innocent:

 

[Dr.Fessel]

So what was he saying there, he washed the couch before going camping and it was not a wet spot on the floor drying?

 

[Dr.Fessel]

WHY wasn't j charged with posession of child ?
Anyone care to take a guess?

I can hardly stand reading this stuff.
I hope the fires of hell are eternal.

imho

Cherie, what Josh had is not illegal child according to the courts. Ben Winslow linked this article.

http://www.law.duke.edu/journals/dltr/articles/2002dltr0019.html

 

[Dr. Know?]

So what was he saying there, he washed the couch before going camping and it was not a wet spot on the floor drying?

Yes, we all wash the couch...we agree to these chores? Wha?? I don't do couches as a pro needs to clean them & would probably suck the ick out of it with pro tools from what I've seen.

Nevermind, not venting at you doc, just floored.

 

[Dr.Fessel]

Yes, we all wash the couch...we agree to these chores? Wha?? I don't do couches as a pro needs to clean them & would probably suck the ick out of it with pro tools from what I've seen.

Nevermind, not venting at you doc, just floored.

It sounds like at some point he went through a lot of questioning by the state. I hope these news stations release it all and not redacted and in small chunks.

 

[Dr. Know?]

If he was looking at that type , he had unresolved thought about it or maybe clear thoughts about it. You don't have 400 images, drawings which is flooring me at the moment, or links to with children cartoon like having sex with anyone!, What a creepy weird thought process if the boys were exposed to this. My heart goes out to Charlie & Branden. Susan, maybe soon you can be found. Glad that WA is releasing info in a way. This is overload though. Just give us all the documents to decide for ourselves. xoxo

 

[dovebar]

How is it possible that the psychologist in this case did 5 years of work at a facility for sex offenders, but didn't see anything off about JP's conduct and didn't recommend a psychosexual exam until presented with actual images?

I would think that if that is your background, you would ask for that evaluation when handed the case file.

http://www.dshs.wa.gov/SCC/default.shtml

 

[Perodicticus potto]

Hundreds of images!!!??? Spongebob? Is there a name for that fetish?

There is a tradition (for want of a better term) of featuring popular cartoon characters -- used without permission, of course. Between the 1920s and the 1960s, this stuff was distributed in little comic books known as "Tijuana bibles." (You can see examples if you Google that phrase, but be warned -- just because it's old doesn't mean it isn't graphic.) I guess some of the stuff JP was caught with could represent the development of that form into the modern age. Combined with the fake child , though, it does look very dodgy.

Why did he have these kids??

Having read the psychologist's report, I really think that he was just very good at misleading people. I suspect Dave Cullen is right about him having been a psychopath. Psychopaths can deceive just about anyone.

 

[Just K]

How is it possible that the psychologist in this case did 5 years of work at a facility for sex offenders, but didn't see anything off about JP's conduct and didn't recommend a psychosexual exam until presented with actual images?

I would think that if that is your background, you would ask for that evaluation when handed the case file.

http://www.dshs.wa.gov/SCC/default.shtml

The one thing that struck me was that the Dr. doing JP's evaluations is a PHD doctor. He was not a psychiatrist. He is a psychologist.

He diagnosed JP with a personality disorder with 60 other underlying behaviors or symptoms! That, in and of itself, would suggest that supervision would be an ongoing need. There is quite a bit of research that suggest that there is no cure for personality disorders and without successful behavior modification the patient can be a danger to himself and others. This was not going to be a short-term custody/placement arrangement and then add the newer information and the court order for a psycho-sexual exam...JP knew this was an uphill battle at best.

It disturbed me immensely that on his second home visit with the boys he showed them the three sleeping pads and said they would soon go on another camping trip... Made me wonder if he did have other plans for the boys or if this was some sort of psychological threat to keep the boys in line...as in a message to say "stop talking about our other camping trip!"

 

[ThoughtFox]

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/53537666-78/powell-charlie-documents-state.html.csp

Editor’s Note: Readers should be aware this story contains graphic descriptions of sex acts, images, and violence. It also quotes messages of religious hate.

—

Documents released by Washington officials on Friday detail the child welfare case involving Josh Powell and his sons, showing troubling comments made by the boys to a wide variety of people and why authorities were concerned about the home the children shared with their paternal grandfather and other relatives.

Page 14 is so strange! It's about Josh baking brownies with his kids.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/81994361/Josh-Powell-psychological-report

He cut the brownies up in "Frankenstein body parts" which the boys arrange on their plates. :what:

Page 16 is where Josh mentions the sleeping bags in the garage. That should have set off alarm bells, but I don't think it did. Flight risk? Hello?

Later on page 18, he does mention that Josh took the boys camping in the snow in 2009, 40 miles from home while Braden was still in diapers, which was considered "at best to be foolhardy."

Yeah, and Mommy disappeared that night too! OMG.

I think all the warning signs were there, but the glowing appraisals of Josh's "interpersonal skills" and "excellent parenting" glossed over the scary things.

For instance, on page 18 the report also talks about how Josh's "interaction style seems forced or staged." And he "cannot or will not stay focused on his children's needs enough to leave his apparent suspicions, vigilance, and perceived threats out of his communication."

I just think they were bending over backwards to give Josh the benefit of the doubt.

But this was no ordinary custody case, and Josh wasn't just some guy who had been arrested for pot or writing bad checks. And he was still displaying odd behavior, such as ranting about the Cox family and the Mormon church. Not normal.

 

[Just K]

Please Correct me if I am wrong: But it appears this PHD psychologist was referring JP to regular therapy sessions with a Graduate level therapist who has experience in both personality disorders (Narcissistic Personality Disorder) and forensics (forensic psychology, I assume is what he meant.)

Why a Grad level clinician and not a PHD level clinician?

 

[erynne936]

Please Correct me if I am wrong: But it appears this PHD psychologist was referring JP to regular therapy sessions with a Graduate level therapist who has experience in both personality disorders (Narcissistic Personality Disorder) and forensics (forensic psychology, I assume is what he meant.)

Why a Grad level clinician and not a PHD level clinician?

"Graduate level" (which in RI happens to be a master's degree plus another degree on top of that, plus 2000 hours of supervised counseling experience) therapists often have much more training and experience in counseling/psychotherapy than PhD level psychiatrists, as the psychiatry industry is pretty much entirely focused on prescribing medications and very little on psychotherapy to facilitate change. In general, seeing a psychiatrist gets you put on medication; seeing a licensed counselor/therapist gets you actual counseling/therapy. (Of course this may vary based on the individual PhD and where their interests and focus lies.)

 

[GrainneDhu]

Please Correct me if I am wrong: But it appears this PHD psychologist was referring JP to regular therapy sessions with a Graduate level therapist who has experience in both personality disorders (Narcissistic Personality Disorder) and forensics (forensic psychology, I assume is what he meant.)

Why a Grad level clinician and not a PHD level clinician?

He did recommand a Ph.D level clinician; that's what "doctoral level" means.

 

[Just K]

He did recommand a Ph.D level clinician; that's what "doctoral level" means.

For some reason I thought it said Graduate level and that means Master's Degree. I just went back and read it again. For some reason my mind's eye was thinking student; probably because the word level came after doctoral. Thanks! I just couldn't understand why this PHD would recommend a Grad student. Well, at least that was not the case.

 

[SmoothOperator]

Thoughts on Josh and his computer use.. with his being so very computer savvy I am quite certain that what was found to be on his computers was not the extent of his computer browsing and/or proclivity for certain genres..

For example what I mean is that Josh would have been more than capable of erasing his tracks for say, his researching any number of things such as ghb for example in that I'm almost convinced that Susan was somehow drugged that day and that she did not die until she was out of the family van.. He could do something about PREVENTING there being a decomposition trail for dogs to alert on, (again something he easily could have researched and erased his tracks) but he could not have done anything about that AFTER THE FACT...IMO meaning that Susan was not deceased while inside the van, but rather only incapacitated, and was actually killed at or near where she was buried or disposed of..

IMO from what I believe I am seeing in cases where there was atleast some premeditation(including with some cases the premeditation is possibly not even planned to the point of choosing exactly when it will happen, but moreso just planning and thinking and then in the heat of a moment putting those thoughts/plans into actual action)... it certainly seems to be that these type cases are much harder to nail the perp, not even speaking of to be able to successfully convict those perps of the actual homicide..

And I believe that at some point in the months leading up to Susan's murder that Josh had long since determined that Susan would never ever even have the chance to make good on her threat to divorce and take the boys,if he didn't get his chit together.. as for the particular day that her death was carried out I don't know if something quickly escalated, a fight, or a discovery made by Susan(child or even worse abuse on her boys), or just a day that Josh decided that it was gonna be the day to rid him of Susan for good.. that I don't know, but I do believe that there were definitely things related to her murder and disposal that Josh very much researched thoroughly in advance.. and truly if ever there were a case where the suspect actually had the capabilities to erase his "fingerprints" on his computers.. well Josh Powell would be it!!!

Therefor I believe what was left on Josh Powell's computer was not a mistake and was left there because he knew it was in no way whatsoever illegal, and it truly wasn't illegal hence the problem there was in actually doing something about the incestuous animation that they found..

I know exactly of the images that are spoken about in concern that were found on his computers.. several of them I knew exactly what they were speaking of when I read them described in the affidavits.. as I'd come across them sadly in my lifetime.. they are NOT ILLEGAL AND SADLY ARE on so very many different websites that are NOT LABELED AS , but rather just humor related websites.. This is true and I'm certain I'm not the only adult who in their time on the internet they have seen the cartoon sextoons .. and believe me they weren't come across while searching some dirty, backroom type sites, either.. but my point with this is that they are not illegal and Josh Powell knew this and its why they were on his computer and its the reason why they were NOT LEGALLY ABLE TO IN ANY WAY PROSECUTE HIM FOR THEM.. Josh knew this!

And IMO what Josh's true proclivity for genres was much much darker, very much "real"(as opposed to animated), and absolutely WERE ILLEGAL!!.. None of which nary even a trace was left of..

As I said if ever there were a case where the suspect ACTUALLY WAS CAPABLE OF ACTUALLY ERASING HIS TRACKS REGARDING THE WWW INTERNET...WELL JOSH POWELL IS THAT CASE AND POINT..

all IMO, tho!