Israel - Palestinian militants launch massive attack, 7 Oct 2023 #2

[StarryStarryNight]

Agree to disagree. Withholding water, food, electricity, and fuel from civilians is bad jmo.

Then we will disagree.

 

[PrairieWind]

Yesterday there was a Danish fighter plane running a loop over the ocean just west of Gaza. An Italian Air Force plane was on the ground at Ben Gurion airport, apparently preparing to leave. I assume they were evacuating Italian citizens. I think the Mexican planes are also evacuating Mexican citizens

Didn't Mexico just recently recognize Palestine?

 

[justtrish]

Also of note is a Russian Air Force Plane that flew from Ouagadougou to somewhere in Syria. I googled the plane and the exact plane was the one making the news that landed in North Korea in August. These planes always seem to disappear before they actually land.

I think countries are taking sides and discussing whatever agenda they have.

 

[Curiousobserver]

Unfortunately I don't buy this. She looked dead in that video. And why would terrorists take her/let her be taken to the hospital? It doesn't seem plausible.

I hope they are right. I saw a few different clear videos of this event and it looked to me as if she had a gunshot wound to the back of her head with an open entry wound. I think it is unlikely she survived that. On the other hand, why drag a dead body back to Gaza? This could also have been blunt force from a rifle.

 

[steeltowngirl]

The thing I've found in my somewhat sporadic following of this conflict is that Palestine supporters will avoid talking about Hamas like their lives depend upon it (which in a way it kind of does), whether that's expressing condemnation of them or support.

Whenever they get interviewed on a news channel the first thing they're asked about is the latest bad thing Hamas has done, they completely ignore the question and talk about illegal settlements and air strikes on Gaza instead! Whether or not they truly support Hamas or any of the other prescribed terror groups that commit violent acts in the name of their cause is therefore a mystery. A lot of them certainly find it impossible to condemn them though!

As I dig in to this, I’m learning from my father‘s paperwork and talking to my uncle that we still have family in West Bank. I want to believe as Christian Palestinians that they are condemning Hamas, but I’m not so sure. I was disappointed to read this. I want them to fight back.

After an unprecedented Hamas attack against Israel Oct. 7, the Latin Patriarch of Jerusalem called for world leaders to de-escalate violence, urging a peaceful solution to the conflict in the region.

But while the patriarch did not condemn directly the Hamas attack, a priest living in Israel told The Pillar that Cardinal Pierbattista Pizzaballa faces a difficult prospect as the war begins, with the possibility that a statement from him could cause harm to Palestinian Christians.
[…]

Fr. Antoine Levy, OP, an academic who lives in Jerusalem, told The Pillar that the Pizzaballa has to approach his public statements very carefully, because of how they might affect Palestinian Christians, who could face lethal violence if they were perceived to oppose Hamas activities.

Palestine Christians have no 'margin of maneuver' amid violence

Amid brutal Hamas attacks - and Israel's response - are 'boxed in' Palestinian Christians

www.pillarcatholic.com

 

[Curiousobserver]

Agree to disagree. Withholding water, food, electricity, and fuel from civilians is bad jmo.

Agree- there is no obligation to provide free electricity but you must allow food and water to get through. And every single one of those trucks should be dismantled going in and out to search for weapons and people.

 

[OtisC]

Agree to disagree. Withholding water, food, electricity, and fuel from civilians is bad jmo.

If they do not support Hamas, can the Gaza citizens not seek asylum in Egypt or surrender to Israel?

I am not certain how many fall into that category.

Just my thoughts.

Otis

 

[Momoffourboys]

I hope they are right. I saw a few different clear videos of this event and it looked to me as if she had a gunshot wound to the back of her head with an open entry wound. I think it is unlikely she survived that. On the other hand, why drag a dead body back to Gaza? This could also have been blunt force from a rifle.

BBM
Because they know Israel will do whatever possible to retrieve deceased citizens. They will negotiate in exchange for living prisoners to retrieve and give A proper burial for their citizens.

 

[JennieM]

36s ago

Palestinian death toll rises to 900 killed, including 260 children​

The number of Palestinians killed in the Gaza Strip since Saturday has reached at least 900, an increase from 830 earlier today, Gaza’s health ministry said.

Among the dead are 260 children and 230 women, it said. Some 4,600 people are wounded, it said.

At least 1,000 people have been killed in Israel since the attacks by Hamas on the weekend, Israel Defence Forces said on Tuesday.

Israel-Hamas war live: Israel defence minister ‘releases all restraints’ on troops; Biden calls Hamas attack an ‘act of sheer evil’

UN commission sees proof of crimes on both sides and is ‘gravely concerned’ by Israel’s siege announcement; Biden says Israel ‘has a duty to respond’ to attacks

www.theguardian.com

 

[justtrish]

Agree to disagree. Withholding water, food, electricity, and fuel from civilians is bad jmo.

While I don't want innocent civilians to starve or suffer due to these terrorists, I also think the goal is not to starve innocent civilians, it's to make the terrorists job much harder. The ball is in their court and by continuing to attack, they themselves are showing they do not care about the Palestinian people or anyone for that matter.

Perhaps a trade would be more likely when these things are cut off. Release all the hostages and the power will be restored or quit firing on Israel and the power will be restored.

I don't think Israel desires to hurt anyone in Gaza that is innocent. They gave plenty of warning, which is far more than Hamas did. I don't see Israel continuing to withhold those items, but in order to have the upper hand if they enter on the ground, I think total darkness gives them an advantage. If Hamas cared about any of the people they are fighting for, then they would put an end to it all, but instead they continue to send rockets into Israel.

Let's say these things were not cut off, then when does Hamas stop? By making it harder for Hamas to operate it can bring this to an end sooner. Unfortunately, it's not possible to prevent all loss of life and by trying to keep supplies going into Gaza, they are also adding fuel to Hamas so in the long run, this might be the best shot at limiting the losses on all sides.

 

[MassGuy]

<modsnip - unnecessary>

The amount of dead Hamas fighters throughout southern Israel is staggering. Some roads we travel are lined with them. This was a widespread, coordinated attack.

https://x.com/treyyingst/status/1711824169166402004?s=46&t=1LeaTK_fug_ONwN11qOyUw

 

[Sundog]

As I dig in to this, I’m learning from my father‘s paperwork and talking to my uncle that we still have family in West Bank. I want to believe as Christian Palestinians that they are condemning Hamas, but I’m not so sure. I was disappointed to read this. I want them to fight back.

After an unprecedented Hamas attack against Israel Oct. 7, the Latin Patriarch of Jerusalem called for world leaders to de-escalate violence, urging a peaceful solution to the conflict in the region.

But while the patriarch did not condemn directly the Hamas attack, a priest living in Israel told The Pillar that Cardinal Pierbattista Pizzaballa faces a difficult prospect as the war begins, with the possibility that a statement from him could cause harm to Palestinian Christians.
[…]


Fr. Antoine Levy, OP, an academic who lives in Jerusalem, told The Pillar that the Pizzaballa has to approach his public statements very carefully, because of how they might affect Palestinian Christians, who could face lethal violence if they were perceived to oppose Hamas activities.

Palestine Christians have no 'margin of maneuver' amid violence

Amid brutal Hamas attacks - and Israel's response - are 'boxed in' Palestinian Christians

www.pillarcatholic.com

For Palestinian Christians, it's a matter of survival - life and death - on a daily basis. No disappointment from me, they are not required to go on a suicide mission living in the midst of Hezbollah terrorists.

 

[HmmMysterious]

If they do not support Hamas, can the Gaza citizens not seek asylum in Egypt or surrender to Israel?

I am not certain how many fall into that category.

Just my thoughts.

Otis

I'm not sure if that's possible. A tenth of the population has already been displaced.

After reading more about Palestinians, I've realized that they won't surrender to Israel. In their minds, why would they surrender to a country that has committed colonialism and ethnic cleansing against them? That's their logic.

 

[Sundog]

Agree- there is no obligation to provide free electricity but you must allow food and water to get through. And every single one of those trucks should be dismantled going in and out to search for weapons and people.

The UN can work with Egypt to set up a humanitarian corridor on the border with Gaza to supply food and medicine and other essentials to the Gaza Strip.
With everything going through an Israeli military check point, I would think.

So far Egypt has been supplyng fuel and other essentials. With the UN's help I imagine they could do a lot more. So where is the UN on this? Hope they are working on it rather than making statements about war crimes. That can come later if they choose.

 

[adot0902]

If they do not support Hamas, can the Gaza citizens not seek asylum in Egypt or surrender to Israel?

I am not certain how many fall into that category.

Just my thoughts.

Otis

It's complicated to explain, but no. Palestinians have burned a lot of bridges in other countries, by trying to overthrow governments, start civil wars, etc. to a number of countries that have let in refugees. So they already don't have a great reputation as refugees, and the way they went about this attack isn't helping.

 

[PrairieWind]

If they do not support Hamas, can the Gaza citizens not seek asylum in Egypt or surrender to Israel?

I am not certain how many fall into that category.

Just my thoughts.

Otis

My understanding is that in general Palestinian refugees are not really welcome in other Arab nations.

 

[shotgun09]

The Tunnels in Gaza. Built for military movement safely...underground. Yet, not one safe underground 'shelter' exists for the safety of it's own innocent people. They exist to fight, and their own people be damned.

MOO

 

[bobbymkii]

The geography and demographics of the Gaza strip baffle me.

Why on earth do so many (2 million) people, most of them children (for some reason) live in this tiny little strip of land that doesn't appear to have any particularly useful natural resources or economic value that would usually explain such a booming population?

 

[OtisC]

I'm not sure if that's possible. A tenth of the population has already been displaced.

After reading more about Palestinians, I've realized that they won't surrender to Israel. In their minds, why would they surrender to a country that has committed colonialism and ethnic cleansing against them? That's their logic.

Still, they have a choice.

Just my thoughts.

Otis

 

[Elley Mae]

Also, does anyone know if there are likely Israeli spies inside Gaza? Was there ever a time when people could come and go from Gaza to Israel without so much trouble? Is it likely there were Americans living in Gaza (not sure why they would want to.. it sounds less than ideal on the best day ) I was thinking of ways to rescue the hostages and I know with the US there are often people on the ground that can provide some intel or people that talk and one way we have be able to find and rescue hostages is by having that inside info or someone coming forward to say they saw something or heard something.

Not sure about israel’s allowed in gaza.

Israel expands number of work permits for Gazans

***

www.haaretz.com