Jason Young to get new trial #3

[JusticeFever]

Then you know that there was nothing nice about it. It was a character assassination.

Yes, it was and that was one of the biggest problems in this case. Every time a new search warrant came out they would float ideas and charges against JY.. For example, JY drugged CY, well, it wasn't long before rumors started that JY had tried to kill CY as well. It was like LE was trying their case in the public eye, to see what would work and how much more JY could be hated.
How could he ever get a fair trial when from the very beginning it was announced blood was found in his SUV and yet, it wasn't?

 

[oenophile]

Sorry....here is the like to Michelle's autopsy......

http://www.wral.com/asset/news/local/2007/01/22/1175523/1307321296-scan0001.pdf

The facts in the autopsy speak for themselves. Michelle was slaughtered and I can find no better word description.

Nobody defamed JLY.........Any negativity regarding JY was brought about all by himself, especially his character.

It is defamatory to claim as fact that JY killed his wife.

I don't contest the nature of the murder and the details of the attack. I ask how you know he did it. You have stated it as fact 3 times in a row, without stating that this is simply your opinion.

 

[SteelerGirl43]

It is defamatory to claim as fact that JY killed his wife.

I don't contest the nature of the murder and the details of the attack. I ask how you know he did it. You have stated it as fact 3 times in a row, without stating that this is simply your opinion.

Exactly.. No one knows for sure 100% unless you were there..... If you weren't there then its just your opinion and it should be stated as an opinion not as a fact..

 

[MyBelle]

I have to say from what I have read here alone it would not take a genius to come to the conclusion CY would be pretty close to MF, and likely the grandmother. MF was practically her second mother (moved there to help when she was born, lived with them for a bit, babysat, was at the house OFTEN, IIRC).
Looking in from the outside, I myself find the inlaws involvement a tad smothering, but if MY wanted her family close for herself and her baby, I am not going to judge (but I will admit even a decent man would probably go a little nuts with the inlaws constantly around!)

Back to my point, logic tells me CY had to have been close to MY's sister and mother (especially MF).

I agree there was a close relationship between Michelle's family and her child prior to her murder. My reference was to the years of time between Michelle's murder and the custody agreement. Nearly three years for a motherless child to be with her biological dad and some pretty nasty things were said about him in public documents that she can find and read. I think it would be terribly traumatic to the child to lose daily contact with her only remaining parent after all that time.

My thoughts are with the child's best interest only. In my opinion it is cruel to do that to any child and may have long term emotional impact on her.

JMO

 

[MyBelle]

This isn't true.

"The fact that there is a custody order does not end the matter forever. As already mentioned, an order awarding child custody in North Carolina may, subject to the court’s having proper subject matter jurisdiction, be modified or vacated at any time upon one party’s motion and a showing of changed circumstances by the interested party. “Changed circumstances” are changes affecting the child’s welfare both positively and adversely. The changes must, moreover, be substantial for the prior order to be modified."

"Changed circumstances" can certainly be --- the father was acquitted and is now available to have sole custody returned.

http://www.rosen.com/childcustody/carticles/child-custody/

Regarding what I mentioned about the appeal --- I was referring to MF's petition to adopt CY. That is still in the courts and there are documents on the court of appeals website.

Hopefully, anything that is in civil court will be stayed until the criminal charges are resolved...which should have happened the first time around. In a way, this reminds me of the Horman case where Terri Horman lost all contact with her daughter for four years even though she was never charged with a crime.

I think it is a huge broken piece in the child custody process that ends up only harming the children. Long separations and little contact are never in their long-term emotional best interest.

JMO

 

[MyBelle]

It's not unusual at all if the relative has good reason to believe the bio parents are a potential danger to the child's health or safety. Happens all the time.

But this IS a case where the father is suspected of murdering the mother and the father is acting squirrelly in a number of different ways (including total alienation from the child's dead mother's relatives <-- that alone gives grandparents and aunts/uncles standing to seek visitation or custody)

Is "good reason" enough for a court? Shouldn't it be backed up with actual evidence?

I personally don't believe waiting three years after a murder to seek custody is a very good reason. Especially if the parent hasn't been charged with any crime. Why wasn't Jason Young charged with child neglect for leaving the child alone with a corpse for multiple hours?

That he acted "squirrelly" really is your opinion and not a fact. I've no idea what squirrelly even means. I do believe if my MIL publicly accused me of anything at all, she'd never again see my kids or me and my husband would concur. I guess if that means I'm squirrelly, sobeit.

JMO

 

[MyBelle]

Michelle Young and Kathy Taft had very similar injuries and their cause of death was identical:


Blunt Force Head Trauma

Kathy Taft suffered:

Skull fractures,

Cerebral contusions

Subarachnoid and subdoral hemorrhage

S/p left craniotomy

By a stranger.

http://abc11.com/archive/7413663/

I will also post a link to the autopsy report.

What has always bothered me about both cases is that I think both started out as a burglary/robbery and when the victims awakened, they were killed in a rage.

Kathy Taft's killer's defense was that he was mentally ill and when he entered the house, he thought nobody was home. When Kathy awakened, he raped/killed her.

Well, two cars pulled away from Birchleaf that night. First Jason's and then Shelly's. Michelle walked Shelly out. So, if someone was lurking in the backyard as Shelly believed, they may have thought Michelle LEFT with Shelly and then entered the house and went up the back stairway before Michelle came back inside. And there may have been an attempted rape. We'll never know because no rape kit was done.

Then there are the Pettit murders. Those killers liked to enter dark homes wearing night vision goggles. They got a thrill of taking things while the owners slept.

I think law enforcement in that N.C. area really jumped to the conclusion Jason did it without any consideration for public safety. We've got too many mentally-deranged killers walking the streets and they know it.

JMO

 

[SteelerGirl43]

Is "good reason" enough for a court? Shouldn't it be backed up with actual evidence?

I personally don't believe waiting three years after a murder to seek custody is a very good reason. Especially if the parent hasn't been charged with any crime. Why wasn't Jason Young charged with child neglect for leaving the child alone with a corpse for multiple hours?

That he acted "squirrelly" really is your opinion and not a fact. I've no idea what squirrelly even means. I do believe if my MIL publicly accused me of anything at all, she'd never again see my kids or me and my husband would concur. I guess if that means I'm squirrelly, sobeit.

JMO

Means someone who acts odd, strange, etc..

 

[JusticeFever]

Again, slice it/dice it....explain/excuse it.........Michelle's OVERKILL coupled with ALL the CE points to one suspect, JLY.You nor anyone else can soften this or explain this away!!

JY SLAUGHTERED HIS WIFE AND UNBORN SON

Kathy Taft was murdered the exact same way...........just miles from Michelle's home.

 

[JusticeFever]

I just read the court of appeals opinion and I was under the wrong impression as to the grounds for overturning the verdict.

The only grounds were the admission of the civil judgments. The appeals court ruled that mentioning Jason's long silence to friends And relatives was not error. And not even error to mention that he did not talk or cooperate with police because he later waived his 5th Amendment right to remain silent when he chose to testify at trial.

The appeals court also ruled that the hearsay evidence from re daycare workers is admissible as a hearsay exception (excited utterance)

Now that I know that, I think the State will get its conviction if the only thing they have to do differently is to stay away from the custody order and default judgment. -- unless the defense finds the "real" killer or comes up with some compelling exculpatory evidence.

You never know what a jury will do, and you also don't know if this is even going to go in front of a jury again.
Besides, we all know that the conviction was overturned and why. It is on the very first page in the very first Trial 3 section here at WS. This happened back in April.

 

[JusticeFever]

I agree there was a close relationship between Michelle's family and her child prior to her murder. My reference was to the years of time between Michelle's murder and the custody agreement. Nearly three years for a motherless child to be with her biological dad and some pretty nasty things were said about him in public documents that she can find and read. I think it would be terribly traumatic to the child to lose daily contact with her only remaining parent after all that time.

My thoughts are with the child's best interest only. In my opinion it is cruel to do that to any child and may have long term emotional impact on her.

JMO

LE and the Fishers were probably beyond exasperated that JY would not talk and were determined to force his hand. First, the custody suit and then the civil suit. They backed him into a corner waiting to see and hear his response. So, he defaulted on one suit and was able to reach a satisfactory agreement with MF concerning CY, but he still didn't talk.
And, those 2 actions and the results of those 2 suits and allowing that information into a criminal trial is why we are heading into a possible new trial, and why Jason Young's conviction has been overturned.

 

[minor4th]

Kathy Taft was murdered the exact same way...........just miles from Michelle's home.

Wasn't she also raped?

 

[minor4th]

I agree there was a close relationship between Michelle's family and her child prior to her murder. My reference was to the years of time between Michelle's murder and the custody agreement. Nearly three years for a motherless child to be with her biological dad and some pretty nasty things were said about him in public documents that she can find and read. I think it would be terribly traumatic to the child to lose daily contact with her only remaining parent after all that time.



My thoughts are with the child's best interest only. In my opinion it is cruel to do that to any child and may have long term emotional impact on her.



JMO

But you see, for the first 1.5 years Jason and Pat were allowing Cassidy to visit with the Fishers on a regular basis. There was no need to go to court at that point because they could monitor Cassidy's well being and remain connected to Cassidy - they could also monitor Jason's behavior and could get a read on whether his squirrelly- ness was reaching a tipping point.

Once Jason and Pat got their feelings hurt (wrongfully, I might add, because it wasn't Linda or Meredith making comments to the media) - they took their ball and went home. i.e. They threw a tantrum and used Cassidy a a pawn to punish the Fishers.

Following that complete disregard for Cassidy's best interest, the Fishers tried to negotiate a visitation schedule with Jason and Pat. They weren't trying to take Cassidy away - they wanted to return to the arrangement they had been working with since Michelle's murder. But the selfish and childish Young's would have none of it.

Their intent was to completely extricate Michelle's family from Cassidy's life and from her awareness - wouldn't even open letters to Cassidy or deliver Christmas presents to her!!! Sorry but there is no argument that such behavior is in Cassidy's interest. The Young's were concerned only with Jason's comfort and interests. Can you deny that?

It was only after all of that that the Fishers filed a custody petition. The irony is it was Jason and Pat's own bad behavior that forced their hands.

Another "irony" is that Pat testified that they banished the Fishers from Cassidy's life because Pat heard from some gossip monger that the Fishers were going to abscond with Cassidy. The Young's' response? They did exactly the thing they feared the Fishers would do.

The Youngs actions leading to the custody suit had nothing to do with Cassidy and everything to do with Jason.

I include Pat in all this because I think she was the driving and destructive force. IMO Jason and Pat are in a totally enmeshed parent-child relationship, and Pat has a lot to do with why Jason grew up to be a narcissistic, entitled, self indulgent, overgrown 4 year old. (JMO)

While you may believe a parent's rights are akin to ownership of their children, despite any harm caused to the child - that is not the way the family courts go about determining custody issues for children who cannot speak for themselves and who are completely helpless and at the mercy of their caretakers, fit or not.

 

[JusticeFever]

Wasn't she also raped?

Yes, but she died from blunt force head trauma the same as Michelle. Do you also know a rape kit examination was ordered by LE but it was never performed on MY, it was requested and overlooked.
Not saying that MY was raped because her clothing was intact, but it was still an oversight......,probably because they had already circled in on JY. Just read the wording on his NTO warrant.

 

[JusticeFever]

But you see, for the first 1.5 years Jason and Pat were allowing Cassidy to visit with the Fishers on a regular basis. There was no need to go to court at that point because they could monitor Cassidy's well being and remain connected to Cassidy - they could also monitor Jason's behavior and could get a read on whether his squirrelly- ness was reaching a tipping point.

Once Jason and Pat got their feelings hurt (wrongfully, I might add, because it wasn't Linda or Meredith making comments to the media) - they took their ball and went home. i.e. They threw a tantrum and used Cassidy a a pawn to punish the Fishers.

Following that complete disregard for Cassidy's best interest, the Fishers tried to negotiate a visitation schedule with Jason and Pat. They weren't trying to take Cassidy away - they wanted to return to the arrangement they had been working with since Michelle's murder. But the selfish and childish Young's would have none of it.

Their intent was to completely extricate Michelle's family from Cassidy's life and from her awareness - wouldn't even open letters to Cassidy or deliver Christmas presents to her!!! Sorry but there is no argument that such behavior is in Cassidy's interest. The Young's were concerned only with Jason's comfort and interests. Can you deny that?

It was only after all of that that the Fishers filed a custody petition. The irony is it was Jason and Pat's own bad behavior that forced their hands.

Another "irony" is that Pat testified that they banished the Fishers from Cassidy's life because Pat heard from some gossip monger that the Fishers were going to abscond with Cassidy. The Young's' response? They did exactly the thing they feared the Fishers would do.

The Youngs actions leading to the custody suit had nothing to do with Cassidy and everything to do with Jason.

I include Pat in all this because I think she was the driving and destructive force. IMO Jason and Pat are in a totally enmeshed parent-child relationship, and Pat has a lot to do with why Jason grew up to be a narcissistic, entitled, self indulgent, overgrown 4 year old. (JMO)

While you may believe a parent's rights are akin to ownership of their children, despite any harm caused to the child - that is not the way the family courts go about determining custody issues for children who cannot speak for themselves and who are completely helpless and at the mercy of their caretakers, fit or not.

This is so wrong I don't know where to start.

 

[minor4th]

LE and the Fishers were probably beyond exasperated that JY would not talk and were determined to force his hand. First, the custody suit and then the civil suit. They backed him into a corner waiting to see and hear his response. So, he defaulted on one suit and was able to reach a satisfactory agreement with MF concerning CY, but he still didn't talk.
And, those 2 actions and the results of those 2 suits and allowing that information into a criminal trial is why we are heading into a possible new trial, and why Jason Young's conviction has been overturned.

You're right that it was prejudicial to read the custody petition and it's unproven accusations to the jury. And yes that is why Jason was granted a new trial.

Shame on the judge and prosecutors for failing to take better care of the record.

However, the Fishers were well within their rights to pursue the civil case and the custody case. I do not believe the custody case was merely a strategic maneuver - it was justified, and Jason is the one who backed his own self into that comer.

The wrongful death suit - probably strategic, but not for purposes of the criminal case. Getting a favorable judgment in the wrongful death case would fortify and legitimize the Fishers' pursuit of custody of Cassidy.

They knew Jason wouldn't talk or participate. But it wasn't the Fishers who backed Jason into that corner. It was Jason and his mother. At all times Jason had complete control over whether to participate and tell what happened - he elected to avoid the whole process because he did not want the prosecutors to be able to prepare their case with the benefit of his "version." That us a strategic decision that only Jason could make.

 

[minor4th]

This is so wrong I don't know where to start.

Go ahead - I will not be offended or defensive if I have made mistakes. This is my understanding from listening to all the testimony from the Fishers and Youngs and reading all the court documents in the last two days.

 

[minor4th]

Yes, but she died from blunt force head trauma the same as Michelle. Do you also know a rape kit examination was ordered by LE but it was never performed on MY, it was requested and overlooked.
Not saying that MY was raped because her clothing was intact, but it was still an oversight......,probably because they had already circled in on JY. Just read the wording on his NTO warrant.

I'll grant you - I do believe LE was too short sighted and did some questionable things and made some important omissions during the investigation.

 

[JusticeFever]

Go ahead - I will not be offended or defensive if I have made mistakes. This is my understanding from listening to all the testimony from the Fishers and Youngs and reading all the court documents in the last two days.

It can be your opinion, but it is not fact. LF was accusing JY from the very beginning of murdering her daughter, something she is/was entitled to, btw, but how in the world could these accusations benefit CY in any way? How were both families supposed to "get along" under these conditions? It was a no-win situation and the only person getting hurt would be CY. She loved her Daddy and I am sure she loved her grandmom and aunt, but not like she loved her Daddy, the parent she was living with, the person everyone who testified to was a good father.......
And, it's not about offending you, its about what is going on right now. You mentioned finding the real killer or exculpatory evidence that would clear Jason. No one ever said that was the reason for his winning his appeal.

 

[minor4th]

You never know what a jury will do, and you also don't know if this is even going to go in front of a jury again.
Besides, we all know that the conviction was overturned and why. It is on the very first page in the very first Trial 3 section here at WS. This happened back in April.

You never know.

And y'all might have all known why the case was overturned, but I had been under the wrong impression that the appeals court ruled that the daycare worker testimony should not have been admitted and also that the state should not have been allowed to discuss Jason's three year silence.

I was surprised that the appeals court gave the go-ahead on those two issues.

So - news to me, but probably not to anyone else here