Josh Duggar charged with Receipt/Possession Child Sexual Abuse Material, 29 April 2021 *guilty* #3

[gitana1]

And Anna, growing up so sheltered, probably doesn't know the beauty of what true intimacy between loving partners can be. I'm sure she has suffered abuse, perhaps physical, definitely emotional, but I worry too about her children - she has several young daughters.

That’s a sobering thought. IMO she has lived a sham marriage. But does she even know that? So tragic. Your words paint a picture of the grim, unsatisfying, lonely life she probably has had with this person. Trying to convince herself that all was well and that this was love...

 

[mickey2942]

My hunch is: He sees Anna is a baby machine. He goes through the motions to get her pregnant. MOO...MOO...MOO...MOO.....

(Been there. Done that with fertility issues)

That is what I think too. The video posted by @Seattle1 was really interesting, when the doctor discussed having a relationship with a person who has psychopathy, there really isn't a "relationship".

Makes perfect sense.

 

[gitana1]

oh man I didn't know this
this is who they sent their pedophile son to get counselling from?!

Not really. He was sent to sex harasser Bill Gothard to do hard labor for a few months. On the way home they stopped by their cop friend’s house for a talking to. The Duggars talk about it in an interview. “And he really told him what a bad road he was going down.” (All said with a “serious” affect and big eyes), but that was it. He did NO counseling of any kind with any mental health professional. (IMO based on everything I’ve read). They don’t believe in psychology.

After the Ashley Madison scandal he went to a Bible based rehab that focuses on work, bible study and prayer. Again, not one mental health professional on staff.

 

[CharlestonGal]

That is what I think too. The video posted by @Seattle1 was really interesting, when the doctor discussed having a relationship with a person who has psychopathy, there really isn't a "relationship".

Makes perfect sense.

I doubt Josh was interested in having an actual relationship. He looked forward to having an object to use for sex, yes, but I think he would have been just as happy having sex with strippers in DC instead of being stuck with a wife. imo

 

[CharlestonGal]

I just had the most horrible thought.....

Can federal inmates provide their sperm for their wife's IVF? Seriously legit question. I have no idea, but I don't know why not...?

 

[Friday Fan]

I just had the most horrible thought.....

Can federal inmates provide their sperm for their wife's IVF? Seriously legit question. I have no idea, but I don't know why not...?

This was a lawsuit based on California Dept of Corrections
No Right to Artificial Insemination | Prison Legal News

The good news: I don't think so...
A Federal prison inmate is suing the Government over its refusal to permit him and his wife to have a child through artificial insemination.........

......The Federal prison system has no official policy on artificial insemination, and Mr. Goodwin's suit, filed last month in Federal District Court in Springfield, challenged the lack of policy. The suit is pending.
Mr. Goodwin sued after he was refused doctors' assistance in collecting his sperm at the prison so it could be frozen and shipped to St. Louis, where his wife's doctor would take over. Mr. Goodwin has offered to pay any costs, which could reach $400.

Inmate and Wife Seek Right to Conceive Child (Published 1987)

On a lighter note, this also involves a federal detainee. From 2003 Con's Wife Faces Sperm-Smuggling Charges
With Regina's then 35-year-old biological clock ticking away, and with Kevin still facing many more years behind bars, Regina was desperate. So they figured out a plan to get Kevin's sperm out of prison, and into Regina. And it worked.

 

[Doghairrules]

And Anna, growing up so sheltered, probably doesn't know the beauty of what true intimacy between loving partners can be. I'm sure she has suffered abuse, perhaps physical, definitely emotional, but I worry too about her children - she has several young daughters.

Right. And she's been so sheltered, whatever Josh tells her is likely what she believes is normal in an intimate relationship.

 

[CharlestonGal]

This was a lawsuit based on California Dept of Corrections
No Right to Artificial Insemination | Prison Legal News

The good news: I don't think so...
A Federal prison inmate is suing the Government over its refusal to permit him and his wife to have a child through artificial insemination.
Inmate and Wife Seek Right to Conceive Child (Published 1987)

Thank you! I knew someone would know.

I feel better now.

 

[Shamrock1]

I just had the most horrible thought.....

Can federal inmates provide their sperm for their wife's IVF? Seriously legit question. I have no idea, but I don't know why not...?

Some faiths prohibit IVF, typically because of the potential for surplus embryos. Note that IVF is completely different from IUI (intra-uterine insemination). IVF is more invasive and significantly more expensive than IVF and most health insurances do not provide any fertility coverage. Standard practice is to fail at IUI before attempting IVF. IUI and IVF both require a male to provide a sperm sample; some faiths also prohibit IUI because of how the sample is provided.

Anyway, you might be relieved to read Gerber v. Hickman 291 F.3d 617 (9th Cir. 2002). Link to cheat sheet: Gerber v. Hickman | Case Brief for Law School | LexisNexis

Now, perhaps the prisoner could argue that reproduction is an essential component of his faith. But I don’t see going anywhere.

Further, we all know that prisons are porous but smuggling out viable sperm would require some carefully-timed planning IMO. Temperature, for starters.

JMO.

 

[Friday Fan]

Some faiths prohibit IVF, typically because of the potential for surplus embryos. Note that IVF is completely different from IUI (intra-uterine insemination). IVF is more invasive and significantly more expensive than IVF and most health insurances do not provide any fertility coverage. Standard practice is to fail at IUI before attempting IVF. IUI and IVF both require a male to provide a sperm sample; some faiths also prohibit IUI because of how the sample is provided.

Anyway, you might be relieved to read Gerber v. Hickman 291 F.3d 617 (9th Cir. 2002). Link to cheat sheet: Gerber v. Hickman | Case Brief for Law School | LexisNexis

Now, perhaps the prisoner could argue that reproduction is an essential component of his faith. But I don’t see going anywhere.

Further, we all know that prisons are porous but smuggling out viable sperm would require some carefully-timed planning IMO. Temperature, for starters.

JMO.

Sperm was successfully smuggled out in 1999! Con's Wife Faces Sperm-Smuggling Charges

 

[Shamrock1]

Sperm was successfully smuggled out in 1999! Con's Wife Faces Sperm-Smuggling Charges

Impressive!

 

[CharlestonGal]

Some faiths prohibit IVF, typically because of the potential for surplus embryos. Note that IVF is completely different from IUI (intra-uterine insemination). IVF is more invasive and significantly more expensive than IVF and most health insurances do not provide any fertility coverage. Standard practice is to fail at IUI before attempting IVF. IUI and IVF both require a male to provide a sperm sample; some faiths also prohibit IUI because of how the sample is provided.

Anyway, you might be relieved to read Gerber v. Hickman 291 F.3d 617 (9th Cir. 2002). Link to cheat sheet: Gerber v. Hickman | Case Brief for Law School | LexisNexis

Now, perhaps the prisoner could argue that reproduction is an essential component of his faith. But I don’t see going anywhere.

Further, we all know that prisons are porous but smuggling out viable sperm would require some carefully-timed planning IMO. Temperature, for starters.

JMO.

I'm sure somebody out there somewhere can cherry-pick an obscure bible verse to support IUI and IVF if it suits their purpose. Some sects are experts at that kind of thing.

 

[RickshawFan]

I just had the most horrible thought.....

Can federal inmates provide their sperm for their wife's IVF? Seriously legit question. I have no idea, but I don't know why not...?

How would they do that? I mean, practically speaking. They can't hand over anything to each other during a visit; surely, a lightly-lidded cup with body fluids would be all kinds of no. Let me see, Amazon....Prisons are kinda partial to Amazon. Does Amazon have a mail order channel to ship body fluids?

 

[nyvictoria]

How would they do that? I mean, practically speaking. They can't hand over anything to each other during a visit; surely, a lightly-lidded cup with body fluids would be all kinds of no. Let me see, Amazon....Prisons are kinda partial to Amazon. Does Amazon have a mail order channel to ship body fluids?

Only if you know someone who works in the warehouse lol

Didn’t Ted Bundy manage to impregnate someone while he was in prison?

 

[Seattle1]

How would they do that? I mean, practically speaking. They can't hand over anything to each other during a visit; surely, a lightly-lidded cup with body fluids would be all kinds of no. Let me see, Amazon....Prisons are kinda partial to Amazon. Does Amazon have a mail order channel to ship body fluids?

It would not surprise me if this becomes a civil rights issue where the exchange is facilitated via a medical visit and/or professional.

https://ccrjustice.org/files/Report_JailHouseLawyersHandbook.pdf

 

[Friday Fan]

How would they do that? I mean, practically speaking. They can't hand over anything to each other during a visit; surely, a lightly-lidded cup with body fluids would be all kinds of no. Let me see, Amazon....Prisons are kinda partial to Amazon. Does Amazon have a mail order channel to ship body fluids?

In the mob case, the wife brought in a vial and I believe the inmate bribed a guard. The mob apparently started a bit of a "sperm racquet" in prison too with the help of some guards...Go figure...
This was early 21st century in Allenwood Fed Pen in PA. I'm sure this involved other prisons too.
BOP Guards Smuggle Sperm for Mobsters | Prison Legal News

 

[mickey2942]

It is not that hard to do. They are allowed a "chaste" kiss during visits.

 

[Shamrock1]

I’m sure the prisoner-to-visitor transfer is easy. Getting it to a facility in time would be the issue, IMO, though there’s always DIY IUI. (I think this is enough Internet for me for today).

 

[RickshawFan]

It is not that hard to do. They are allowed a "chaste" kiss during visits.

Immaculate conception?
PS If kisses procreate, I’ve had many near misses. Phew!

 

[Shamrock1]

Immaculate conception?
PS If kisses procreate, I’ve had many near misses. Phew!

I believe the poster meant that a mouth-to-mouth transfer could take place during a kiss. JMO.