Judge's Order re: OP's Mental Health Eval Thread #42

[TorisMom003]

During OP's testimony he threw a lot of people under the bus.

Reeva (during her texts) was either lying or exaggerating, was also at fault for not coming out of the toilet or speaking to him.
Dr. Stipp acted as if he didn't know what to do.
Sam and that other fellow was lying about the sunroof incident.
Roux and/or other defense team members lied and was irresponsible several times.
LE did not do their job properly, stole from him, moved things around to frame him.
Owner of Tashas lied.
Guys with OP at Tashas lied.
Construction guys were irresponsible leaving ladder outside overnight.
Painters were irresponsible when they removed the sensors from the outside walls.
Compound security was irresponsible.
The safe was accountable for being in possession of illegal ammunition.
OP's mother was responsible for his "anxiety".
Sam lied about other things when on the stand.

How many instances of anyone and everyone else being the blame does it take before one sees that the real problem, the only common denominator, in the life of OP is OP himself?

MOO

 

[Greater Than]

We will have to agree to disagree I have worked with folks who have been traumatized and I would never be so bold as to assert what a response to such an event as Oscar has described would be. It in MO is irresponsible to do so.

Irresponsible? He's on trial for murder! His testimony...his every word regarding the events and his emotions are KEY!

 

[Cherwell]

Yes he has denied saying this. <modsnip>

Well, he would, wouldn't he. MRDA.

 

[Trooper]

The only one I think I can remember saying that they had read it is Shane (?) something or other if I remember correctly.

IMO it gives a huge insight into Oscar's mind as well as the two letters that are included at the end of the book written by his brother and his dad. A very interesting family dynamic to say the least. That it was written long before he killed Reeva makes it all the more a valid barometer of his natural mindset.

Ive read it, and its drivelling garbage.. its written for 12 yr olds, which is fine, because that's who I borrowed it for.. ( I would never pay to buy a ghost written book, that is ludicrous ) ..but it didn't have to be so twee and saccharine, so badly written, and full of home spun stuff from the Department of the Bloody Obvious for page after page..

as it happens, the 12 yr old who got it wasnt that impressed.. entirely forgivable.

 

[Carmelita]

No but he is "fighting for his life".

Let's look at it from the other side for a minute. Let's say that OP intended to kill Reeva, knew that she was the one in the toilet. Instead of saying that he intended to kill an "intruder" and take his jail time/probation, he is trying to walk away with no punishment whatsoever. If OP really, truly thought that an intruder was in his home and he sincerely shot and killed Reeva by mistake, then why not admit this straight away instead of taking the case to court? Why not admit to the guns/ammunition charges straight away instead of saying he was not guilty to those in court?

OP is behaving like a man who expects to walk away from this without any jail time and/or probation at all. OP is behaving/speaking as if this is the competition of his life.

MOO

Thanks Tori and I agree that it is bizarre for Oscar not to admit to the lesser charges and it would have done his credibility well to do so, I think he is emotionally unwell, perhaps he he just a manipulative narcissist. Again I have never said that Oscar did not kill reeve knowing it was her in the bathroom I said the state has not proven it's case IMO. The judge may feel differently and I will bow to her knowledge, expertise and judgement.

 

[Cherwell]

During OP's testimony he threw a lot of people under the bus.

Reeva (during her texts) was either lying or exaggerating, was also at fault for not coming out of the toilet or speaking to him.
Dr. Stipp acted as if he didn't know what to do.
Sam and that other fellow was lying about the sunroof incident.
Roux and/or other defense team members lied and was irresponsible several times.
LE did not do their job properly, stole from him, moved things around to frame him.
Owner of Tashas lied.
Guys with OP at Tashas lied.
Construction guys were irresponsible leaving ladder outside overnight.
Painters were irresponsible when they removed the sensors from the outside walls.
Compound security was irresponsible.
The safe was accountable for being in possession of illegal ammunition.
OP's mother was responsible for his "anxiety".
Sam lied about other things when on the stand.

How many instances of anyone and everyone else being the blame does it take before one sees that the real problem, the only common denominator, in the life of OP is OP himself?

Oddly, Frank seems to have escaped blame.

So far.

 

[TorisMom003]

Well, he would, wouldn't he. MRDA.

Especially when he has denied everything else. The one time that he took responsibility for something, shooting Reeva, he had to add a BUT on the end of it. And that was after being pushed several times by Nel to admit to it.

I killed Reeva BUT if only she had come out of the toilet or spoken to me........

He can't even admit that he was the cause of the bullet being fired at Tashas. The gun just went off by itself without his finger being on the trigger.

:shaking head:

MOO

 

[Carmelita]

I don't see a co author on Oscar's book it simply says Oscar Pistiorus.

 

[CriLondon]

Hi Cri, with regards to this He probably meant to say desperate. I think you are thinking about it as to what would more accurately IYO describe what Oscar was feeling.

Oscar said what he said, I think he is bright, I think he is emotionally unwell, I don't have a problem making the cognitive jump from "overcome with sadness" to understanding from a psychological point of view what Oscar possibly maybe could have meant to encompass by saying "overcome with sadness".

Because it really is not so important to me , for i don't need him to tell me , DR.Stipp testimony was clear , he WAS overcome with sadness at that point.
I believe it's true that he was , "overcome with sadness" ,i'd say that's very probable that he was ,but i think the timeline of the emotions that went through him is a bit different from how he recollected it. So yes , imo he was desperate at some point and that preceded being overcome with sadness. They're just two different levels of sadness , one just preceding the other.

To pin-point emotions/timeline so that's it's clear what i mean:

Carrying Reeva down the stairs - fear(upthread mentioned as I'm panicking)/desperation
Dr.Stipp arrives and takes over - desperation
He returns from going back upstairs - overcome by sadness

that is IMO the rough timeline of emotions.

And yes it's my opinion "he meant to say desperate" because i believe he did experience that degree of sadness.

 

[PrimeSuspect]

I assumed that by being forced thru the wood panel of the door, at high speed and terrific power, that the bullet would be somewhat compressed.. misshapen, even...

oh well. I have never fired thru a door, so its a moot point with me.

Maybe it elongates after passing through the door making the bullet narrower, once it hit Reeva and loses momentum it then mushrooms out inside her body. :moo:

 

[Gryffindor]

I don't see a co author on Oscar's book it simply says Oscar Pistiorus.

Yes, on Amazon and Waterstones it lists the author as Oscar Pistorius.

 

[Carmelita]

Wow, ok, thanks. Sounds like it's worth buying and reading then. Not quite Peter Kay's laugh-a-minute though, eh? X

It is worth reading if you are interested in the human psyche. It is a first hand account of a very bizarre thought process of viewing the world IMO.

One of the first things to strike me was his concept of self.

 

[Viper]

Irresponsible? He's on trial for murder! His testimony...his every word regarding the events and his emotions are KEY!

According to this testimony Reeva was not the love of his life:

Nel: It’s because it never happened. Why are you getting emotional now?
OP: Because this is the night I lost the person that I cared about. I don’t know how people don’t understand that.

Court adjourns for a crybaby break.

 

[TorisMom003]

According to this testimony Reeva was not the love of his life:

Nel: It’s because it never happened. Why are you getting emotional now?
OP: Because this is the night I lost the person that I cared about. I don’t know how people don’t understand that.

Court adjourns for a crybaby break.

BBM

Shouldn't he have said "Because this is the night that I killed the person....." instead? I mean the word lost sounds like it was because of something someone else did.

MOO

 

[Cherwell]

Because it really is not so important to me , for i don't need him to tell me , DR.Stipp testimony was clear , he WAS overcome with sadness at that point.
I believe it's true that he was , "overcome with sadness" ,i'd say that's very probable that he was ,but i think the timeline of the emotions that went through him is a bit different from how he recollected it. So yes , imo he was desperate at some point and that preceded being overcome with sadness. They're just two different levels of sadness , one just preceding the other.

To pin-point emotions/timeline so that's it's clear what i mean:

Carrying Reeva down the stairs - fear(upthread mentioned as I'm panicking)/desperation
Dr.Stipp arrives and takes over - desperation
He returns from going back upstairs - overcome by sadness

that is IMO the rough timeline of emotions.

And yes it's my opinion "he meant to say desperate" because i believe he did experience that degree of sadness.

I would guess at 'misery' rather than 'sadness'.
Misery because it would be sinking in that his life was now ruined.
Plus a bit of regret, wishing that he hadn't done what he did.

 

[Carmelita]

I haven't read it, but as I mentioned above, such books are usually churned out at the height of a personality's success to milk the fans of a few £££, and provide families & friends with a Christmas present solution.

This was published in 2009 after his fight to compete with able-bodied athletes in the Olympics hardly his height of of success. That said I have no qualms with believing his main goal with the book could have been monetary gain and celebrity recognition.

 

[Carmelita]

Irresponsible? He's on trial for murder! His testimony...his every word regarding the events and his emotions are KEY!

My post had nothing to do with Oscar's lack of responsibility it had to do with anyone claiming that they knew how a person should respond and act in a situation of extreme emotions.

 

[CriLondon]

I would guess at 'misery' rather than 'sadness'.
Misery because it would be sinking in that his life was now ruined.
Plus a bit of regret, wishing that he hadn't done what he did.

Yes , perhaps more accurate , but it still emotionally classifies as sadness
I agree with the regret part , he has shown shame and regret many times.
To what extent it is for taking Reeva's life and/or for the consequences of the act is still a bit difficult for me to state an opinion on.
Gut-feeling would say more latter than former , but it's not how i'd like to reason here.

 

[Viper]

This was published in 2009 after his fight to compete with able-bodied athletes in the Olympics hardly his height of of success. That said I have no qualms with believing his main goal with the book could have been monetary gain and celebrity recognition.

LOL! I cannot really understand why he insisted on competing against men that did not have mechanical shock absorbers for lower legs, feet, and ankles. Apples to oranges to my logic. This comedian takes it a little further:

http://youtu.be/dTWDNIgM2pA

 

[Greater Than]

Because it really is not so important to me , for i don't need him to tell me , DR.Stipp testimony was clear , he WAS overcome with sadness at that point.
I believe it's true that he was , "overcome with sadness" ,i'd say that's very probable that he was ,but i think the timeline of the emotions that went through him is a bit different from how he recollected it. So yes , imo he was desperate at some point and that preceded being overcome with sadness. They're just two different levels of sadness , one just preceding the other.

To pin-point emotions/timeline so that's it's clear what i mean:

Carrying Reeva down the stairs - fear(upthread mentioned as I'm panicking)/desperation
Dr.Stipp arrives and takes over - desperation
He returns from going back upstairs - overcome by sadness

that is IMO the rough timeline of emotions.

And yes it's my opinion "he meant to say desperate" because i believe he did experience that degree of sadness.

This has spun into something way off base. The discussion is not regarding his emotions throughout a timeline. The discussion is OP's explanation for not screaming at the moment he ripped off the door panel and saw he riddled his girlfriend's body with bullets powerful enough to stop an elephant.


Nel: What was the purpose of screaming while you were breaking the door down?

OP: I was in a panic.

Nel: But when you found Reeva, you didn't scream then.

OP: I didn't know what the purpose of screaming would be then. I was overcome with sadness.


That's it. That statement. That emotion, at that moment.