KS - Patricia Kimmi, 58, Horton, 6 Nov 2009 - #1

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  • #301
I think the person that did this went to the house to take her. I dont think they went there to rob the house. If they wanted to kill her, I think it would of happend then and there. Kind of makes me think someone is holding her somewhere. Im sure people can think of reason to take her so I will not post about that. If it didnt have to do with the ex, maybe someone that worked at her house at some time? Was going to buy/sell something to her? A weirdo that has been stalking her online?
Or maybe she came down with a medical thing that affects the brain and she had a nose bleed or blacked out hit her head and wandered off. I know a guy that at sundown or sunup gets amnesia, dont know him well and never talked about it with his family.
MOO
 
  • #302
Ditto, to all those questions. Can you tell me what time her last post was with your group????

Sorry Rita, we combed all the posts and last she wrote was Wednesday afternoon, same as when I last heard from her on FB :( I went to that first to see if we could help with a timeline. She generally posts in the afternoon. Can anyone get into her email and see when her last "read" emails were? That could narrow things down if she was indeed using the computer at the time.
 
  • #303
Another day....and still no answers. It all just seems like a bad, bad dream.

Three things that my mind keeps going to....

1. I know that when my door is open that the dogs are right there and ready to run out. If someone were trying to take me out, especially with force, I am sure that the dogs would be outside too. Does this mean that Pat did know who was at the door and went out to talk to them...purposefully leaving the dog inside?

2. Everyone keeps talking about why Pat wasn't just harmed in the house. Why would they take her away? To me it seems like the obvious answer is that there would be more evidence in her home if they went inside. She was a fighter so hair and possibly other evidence would be left behind.

3. Since the beginning of this my mind keeps going back to the quarry pond. I don't know exactly how deep it is, but I know that it was frightening to me to have such a deep pond on the corner of my property when I lived there.

Rita....I can't begin to imagine what it would be like to try to plan Thanksgiving with all of this going on. But it seems to me that your Mom would love to think of the family together. The post you wrote about sitting with your brothers and remembering the good times would make your Mom smile...I'm sure.
 
  • #304
i bartend in hiawatha and am racking my brain about this money clip. have you checked with bartenders in horton and dealers and cashiers at sac and fox about regulars that may be associates of the ex that pay with cash and may have seen this clip? if the ex is a drunk, and if he hired someone, its likely the deal was made over a few beers. also, have you thought about buying a similar clip on ebay or something to take to local businesses and gas stations so that people have something they can really see and it might jog a memory?


rita, i'm so sorry for your family right now. know that people are keeping her in our hearts, even if we don't know her or you.
 
  • #305
also, if there was a struggle, i doubt someone had the time to "plant" something. were these items found in the house or on the porch?
 
  • #306
I think the person that did this went to the house to take her. I dont think they went there to rob the house. If they wanted to kill her, I think it would of happend then and there. Kind of makes me think someone is holding her somewhere. Im sure people can think of reason to take her so I will not post about that. If it didnt have to do with the ex, maybe someone that worked at her house at some time? Was going to buy/sell something to her? A weirdo that has been stalking her online?
Or maybe she came down with a medical thing that affects the brain and she had a nose bleed or blacked out hit her head and wandered off. I know a guy that at sundown or sunup gets amnesia, dont know him well and never talked about it with his family.
MOO

I agree w/ the first part of your post - I can only think that someone went there to take her, for what reason exactly I don't know - someone who "liked" her in a bad way that she never expected? For money, but things went really wrong and they abandoned the plan? I know our only hope for her to be alive is the first...

No medical issues but even if she did, evidence tells us that this involved someone who harmed her...this woman loved her family and friends above all else, it was all that mattered to her, and she would NEVER voluntarily be away from us like this.
 
  • #307
Sorry Rita, we combed all the posts and last she wrote was Wednesday afternoon, same as when I last heard from her on FB :( I went to that first to see if we could help with a timeline. She generally posts in the afternoon. Can anyone get into her email and see when her last "read" emails were? That could narrow things down if she was indeed using the computer at the time.

:( Thank you - I should have known you all would already have checked that out. I didn't get to see anything on her computer before LE removed everything from the house. I'm on pins and needles to see what she was looking at or where she posting at the time.
 
  • #308
I haven't posted here before. First of all I want Rita and her family to know that I didn't know their mom, but I want you to know how sorry I am that this happened and my prayers are with you.

I did join the search at the fire station on one of the days. I have also went out on a few of my own searches. I searched some rural Highland roads since I was going that way anyway and it didn't look like those roads had been searched at all. I am close to Pat's age and I know if it were me missing or my mom or daughter, I'd want everyone out there searching whenever they could. My eyes are constantly open no matter where I'm going (driving).

When something like this happens the rumors fly. I "heard" that she was awarded quite a bit of money in the divorce settlement. Whether she collected or not, I don't know. So......

What if a couple drugged up guys heard she got a lot of money and get the great idea of kidnapping her for ransom. There is a struggle and things go wrong. They come down off their drugged up state, realize what happened and freak out at what they had done. Of course they don't go through with asking for ransom in their sober state.

Or: If she hadn't gotten the settlement money yet from the ex or all of the settlement money, would the ex. have to pay her if she was gone? Not dead, but gone? If she was dead, the money "might" go to the kids. If she is just gone, I doubt he'd have to pay unless there was proof of her being deceased. Another reason to take her.

Or of course, someone could have been obsessed with her and taken her.

My brain hurts from trying to think WHY someone would take her.

My thoughts are with you. I really hope my scenarios didn't offend you, Rita or your brother. I'm just trying to make sense of this too.
 
  • #309
Another day....and still no answers. It all just seems like a bad, bad dream.

Three things that my mind keeps going to....

1. I know that when my door is open that the dogs are right there and ready to run out. If someone were trying to take me out, especially with force, I am sure that the dogs would be outside too. Does this mean that Pat did know who was at the door and went out to talk to them...purposefully leaving the dog inside?

2. Everyone keeps talking about why Pat wasn't just harmed in the house. Why would they take her away? To me it seems like the obvious answer is that there would be more evidence in her home if they went inside. She was a fighter so hair and possibly other evidence would be left behind.

3. Since the beginning of this my mind keeps going back to the quarry pond. I don't know exactly how deep it is, but I know that it was frightening to me to have such a deep pond on the corner of my property when I lived there.

Rita....I can't begin to imagine what it would be like to try to plan Thanksgiving with all of this going on. But it seems to me that your Mom would love to think of the family together. The post you wrote about sitting with your brothers and remembering the good times would make your Mom smile...I'm sure.

Yeah, I know that's what she would want. It is so hard, though, thinking that she might still be alive out there waiting for us and we're no closer to finding her. We will for sure be together on Thanksgiving though no matter what.

The quarry has only been searched by helicopter and people looking around it. LE has talked about bringing divers in but I haven't heard anything definite.

As far as her dog, she didn't always try to run out the door and after this happened, she sometimes would hide when we came in the house, so I don't know if maybe someone scared her so badly that she didn't try to get out the door? She wasn't harmed in any way.
 
  • #310
Welcome

to all the newcomers to WS!


And thank you all for showing your support for Pat & her family.
 
  • #311
I haven't posted here before. First of all I want Rita and her family to know that I didn't know their mom, but I want you to know how sorry I am that this happened and my prayers are with you.

I did join the search at the fire station on one of the days. I have also went out on a few of my own searches. I searched some rural Highland roads since I was going that way anyway and it didn't look like those roads had been searched at all. I am close to Pat's age and I know if it were me missing or my mom or daughter, I'd want everyone out there searching whenever they could. My eyes are constantly open no matter where I'm going (driving).

When something like this happens the rumors fly. I "heard" that she was awarded quite a bit of money in the divorce settlement. Whether she collected or not, I don't know. So......

What if a couple drugged up guys heard she got a lot of money and get the great idea of kidnapping her for ransom. There is a struggle and things go wrong. They come down off their drugged up state, realize what happened and freak out at what they had done. Of course they don't go through with asking for ransom in their sober state.

Or: If she hadn't gotten the settlement money yet from the ex or all of the settlement money, would the ex. have to pay her if she was gone? Not dead, but gone? If she was dead, the money "might" go to the kids. If she is just gone, I doubt he'd have to pay unless there was proof of her being deceased. Another reason to take her.

Or of course, someone could have been obsessed with her and taken her.

My brain hurts from trying to think WHY someone would take her.

My thoughts are with you. I really hope my scenarios didn't offend you, Rita or your brother. I'm just trying to make sense of this too.

First of all, THANK YOU for helping us. We can never say that enough, no matter what happens in the end, to tell people, friends, family, and strangers alike, how much it means to us that people care so much. I so, so, so wish my Mom could see and know what everyone has done.

Second, we aren't offended by anything that might give us some answers, so whatever you come up with, we are glad to hear it.

Someone sent me a private message regarding some thoughts that they didn't want to be viewed publicly, so if anyone else would like to do that to contact either my brother (MindonMom) or myself, that would be great.
 
  • #312
i bartend in hiawatha and am racking my brain about this money clip. have you checked with bartenders in horton and dealers and cashiers at sac and fox about regulars that may be associates of the ex that pay with cash and may have seen this clip? if the ex is a drunk, and if he hired someone, its likely the deal was made over a few beers. also, have you thought about buying a similar clip on ebay or something to take to local businesses and gas stations so that people have something they can really see and it might jog a memory?


rita, i'm so sorry for your family right now. know that people are keeping her in our hearts, even if we don't know her or you.

Thank you for your kind thoughts - do you know who my "dad" is? I know one of the last times I saw him, he mentioned drinking w/ a doctor there and how funny he thought it was that the doctor would drink until closing time and then go to the hospital...as a surgeon, no less. Yes, idiot, that is just hilarious that a doctor would do that. Anyway...I know that happened in a bar in Hiawatha but I have no idea which one or in what time frame.
 
  • #313
also, if there was a struggle, i doubt someone had the time to "plant" something. were these items found in the house or on the porch?

My opinion is nothing was planted...something just went wrong. No items at the house, just a few signs of struggle. Evidence was found about a half mile west of her house.
 
  • #314
I hope Pat's computer will be helpful (assuming she was using it after she came home).
It might narrow the time frame of when something happened...
and if the 'dually' PU was seen at about that time.
I wondered if Pat had been 'shopping' that day & if there were items purchased (groceries or other things) had she put them away.
Also, I was wondering if Pat had any 'outdoor' lighting (that kind that comes on at dark) &/or if she would turn on any 'outdoor' lighting if she was answering the door or letting dog in or out.
 
  • #315
Thank you for your kind thoughts - do you know who my "dad" is? I know one of the last times I saw him, he mentioned drinking w/ a doctor there and how funny he thought it was that the doctor would drink until closing time and then go to the hospital...as a surgeon, no less. Yes, idiot, that is just hilarious that a doctor would do that. Anyway...I know that happened in a bar in Hiawatha but I have no idea which one or in what time frame.



i don't know who he is, but i'm good with faces, not names. i do know the doc you're talking about, and he doesn't drink at the bar i work at.
 
  • #316
I hope Pat's computer will be helpful (assuming she was using it after she came home).
It might narrow the time frame of when something happened...
and if the 'dually' PU was seen at about that time.
I wondered if Pat had been 'shopping' that day & if there were items purchased (groceries or other things) had she put them away.
Also, I was wondering if Pat had any 'outdoor' lighting (that kind that comes on at dark) &/or if she would turn on any 'outdoor' lighting if she was answering the door or letting dog in or out.

I wondered too what she might have bought that day. One of her friends knew that she bought something little, that would have been in a sack, but I don't know what. I didn't find a sack or anything still in a sack. Possibly it was a little knick knack that she took out of the sack and sat up on the counter w/ a bunch of other knick knacks - I don't what is old and what is new.

The outside porch light was on that first morning when I pulled up along w/ rope lighting that goes all around the porch rail, but whether it was already on when someone came to the house or whether she turned it on when someone came to the door, I don't know. I wish I did. Of all things, I wish the most that I could see whether she actually opened the door to someone she knew or if a strange person tricked her into it.
 
  • #317
bumping up for Pat and her family! Let this be the day for answers!
 
  • #318
Yeah, I know that's what she would want. It is so hard, though, thinking that she might still be alive out there waiting for us and we're no closer to finding her. We will for sure be together on Thanksgiving though no matter what.

The quarry has only been searched by helicopter and people looking around it. LE has talked about bringing divers in but I haven't heard anything definite.

As far as her dog, she didn't always try to run out the door and after this happened, she sometimes would hide when we came in the house, so I don't know if maybe someone scared her so badly that she didn't try to get out the door? She wasn't harmed in any way.

Your mother's dog seemed to maybe have almost PTSD from when she was attacked and abducted..
In risk of sounding insane, it might be important to observe how her dog reacts around different people, dogs are extremely intelligent, no doubt the pup would be able to "identify" the perp in some way or another. Not that the dog's "identifing" a perp would hold up in court, it could help with a direction to go.. Now that i said this, i'm not sure how to expose the dog to different "people", especially ones who may be a perp.
The dog wasn't harmed in any way, so whoever the perp was did not see the dog as a threat, imo.. One who harms humans, will just as easily harm animals i would think.. When faced with a threat animals, as humans do have a fight or flight response.
Your mother is a fighter, the dog is a flighter it seems. Poor thing must have been very scared for her mom, too. If she was very scared she may have hid that night as well.

Your mother, being a "fighter" is good, as that she left more clues down the road in an attempt to escape the car.
It is mentioned by other posters that why wasn't she just harmed in the house? Why was she taken away?
These are good questions that i wish we had answers to..
Would it be possible that the perp(s) had knowledge of the area and your mother personally, so they knew she is fighter and the cautious type.
They may try to "seperate" her from means of communicating with others asap (her cell phone, computer,etc).
The only reason i can think of to "take her away" instead of doing something at her house would be evidence, fear of your mother either calling one of her children, or the children showing up (or friends for that matter), fear of leaving a lot of evidence (this may be possible if they know that your mother has a "fighter" type of personality and wouldn't go willingly or easily with them), also and lastly, possibly someone was "hired" or abducting her to bring to someone else in person. The person who would have "hired" others for dirty work wouldn't be able to be seen in that area, as they would be identifiable, which would mean they are familiar in the area there.
A perp who is familiar there would go to extremes to make it look like it was no one familiar to the area; hiring others to do an abduction, renting a vehicle possibly (or bringing in an unfamiliar one).
I hope i am making sense here..
Rita, my heart and prayers go out to you and your family, especially around this time of Holidays..
 
  • #319
Utilities workers, or someone posing as same, have a natural reason to be on the property and could manufacture a reason for getting a door opened to them. Any authority figure (or, again, someone posing as one) sometimes automatically will be trusted.
 
  • #320
I was thinking that Rita said Pat's car was in the driveway but also thought I had read about cars in the garage..I thought she might have gone to the car to get something or put the car in the garage.
 
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