KY KY - Kathy, 48, & Samantha Netherland, 16, Botland, 21 Apr 2014

[Muy Curioso]

It's particularly disturbing that this has yet to be solved - three unsolved cases in this Kentucky county only months apart. I live only minutes away, and when this story broke I have to admit it shook me to my core. I used to teach and two of my daughters are teachers now - one in the county neighboring Bardstown. In addition, my vehicle is a dead-ringer for the blurry image they've broadcast as the potential get-away car; however, I drive a Kia Optima. I'm still not convinced that the car they believe to be a Chevy Lumina is what they claim... The tail lights do not look correct for any model 2006-2012. IMO that vehicle could be one of several late models and indeed a couple of very dark colored vehicle colors.

My husband has a sister that lives down the street from this home, and this is indeed a very heavily traveled section of road. Ourselves, we travel this road quite often when going to Bardstown or Louisville or several other areas as its a common road for travelers wishing to connect to interstates in Elizabethtown and Louisville KY. And the food mart located near the home is extremely busy for travelers passing through by car and truckers (we almost always stop ourself to grab a drink and/or sandwich). Sadly, I can see how it would be quite easy for people to disregard and noises or people who seem out of place as this is common in the area.

In small towns, rumors are the norm, but strangely enough, I hear nothing on this case. There's no illicit stories on any family members, no speculation.... Nothing. Very common, and usually the nucleus of any good story in a small town is either a lover or drugs but this family appears squeaky clean. I'm stumped at the possible motive. Was it a wrong house? Someone visiting a liquor store or drugged thinking they had a drug dealers house and was off by a house or two? Was someone angry at the sub teacher because she disciplined their child at school? These are all as far-fetched as that can be and purely my imagination.... I'm totally at a loss with this case.


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Can you check for cameras on the side facing the road the next time you stop at the Walmart? In the street view of google there is something that seems cameras, but I am not sure. I also wonder if there are cameras at the gas station next to the church.

It would be interesting to know if the car continued to Bardstown or entered in the highway.

 

[Muy Curioso]

In a few days, second anniversary of the murders.

Another issue. Has anyone read or heard about a hammer as the weapon used against Samantha? In TV news, newspapers, ...

 

[bluebird55]

I go back and forth with Holly.. I think on her own she is a strange girl.. However.. Right after her dad passed she got a memorial tattoo of him...Very common right? A way to remember him.. shortly after that and BEFORE the murders of her sister and mother she got two more tattoos for her mother and sister.. as you can find on her facebook page.. Later after the murders she goes back to the most recent tattoos and gets the dates of the deaths underneath them..I guess it could be coincidence but..the insurance money doesn't seem like quite enough to orchestrate anything sinister IMO.. but she is traveling.. going to Disney.. paid off student loans etc.. Around the anniversary of the murders she will post something about her mom or sister in memory.. but NEVER have I seen anything on her facebook page to the effect of Find who did this.. or a push to get answers to this day.. If it were my family I would be all over it..she just seems strange to me in the press conferences.. but again she seems like a strange girl.. If she has nothing to do with it.. the liquor store across the street burns on my mind.. we have stopped there just a week ago and within 5 mins of being in there, 2-3 shady characters pop in.. I would be very curious to see the surveillance video around the liquor store and parking lot in the days or week leading up to this.. seems like a prime place to hang while checking out the house.. surely KSP have looked into that? It is just too close...

 

[Muy Curioso]

Surely Holly was investigated more deeply and longer than anyone else, and it seems that nothing suspicious was found. Is she a strange girl? Maybe. I have not been able to see on her facebook page those photos of tattoos, but anyway, when someone seeks something suspicious, everything looks suspicious.

People express their pain, their fear, their rage, in very different ways. Some come out in the media every day looking for the murderers, others cry and other get tattoos. You say that if it had been your family ... Are you sure? Maybe if you are a 20 years old girl, at the university, with homesick, and in 9 months you lose your entire family and left alone, Do you really know what would be your behavior?

Is she traveling to Disney? It not seems very sinister. Maybe she must stay at home, without leaving. A few years, or for her lifetime? We must consider that she not know why her mother and sister were killed, and therefore she does not know if she is in danger. Have you think that it could have some influence on her behavior?

Anyway, interesting contributions like yours are appreciated.

 

[bflocket]

I'm not sure how strongly (I know it will to some extent) this will affect the Netherlands' case (or that of Crystal Rogers or Off Jason Ellis), but there's been some substantial "drama" going on with the local police.

The mayor of Bardstown made some substantial changes to the Bardstown police force without consulting the Chief of Police, who was off work recovering from surgery at the time. Some officers were laid off or demoted while some were promoted. He also named a highly controversial officer (NBC, WAVE3, WKYT) as Assistant Chief.

I hope the KSP or some other group is working on these three Nelson County cases, because the local cops (both Btown and NC) are more than likely going to be consumed by arguing/bickering about this for some time.

There's been so much going on with the police that I'm having trouble explaining it all, but here are a few related stories. As if they explain the chaos any better...
This event actually led me to see the "s-word" in local news headlines, if that tells you anything. That's when I realized that it was really hitting the fan around here.

Changes were made behind police chief’s back
The Kentucky Standard (Bardstown, KY)
4/17/2016

Bardstown Police Chief Rick McCubbin was blindsided by Mayor John Royalty’s recent decision to restructure the Police Department without consulting him.

In an April 4 email to Royalty that The Kentucky Standard obtained through an open records request, McCubbin said the restructuring took him completely by surprise.

He asked the mayor to reconsider his directive, which included the demotion of two officers and promotion of two others.

Roby had intended to retire July 31, but after Royalty demoted him, he announced that Roby’s retirement would be effective April 24.

“I was going to retire this year anyway. I guess that’s what bothers me the most,” he said. “Three and a half more months and I would’ve been gone.”

Roby said several police officers could leave the department as a result of the decision. He said several have come to him personally to tell him they are “actively seeking other employment.”

“Their exact words were, ‘If it can happen to you, it can happen to me,’” he said.

Mayor critical of sheriff’s decision to withdraw deputies from Flex Team
Nelson County Gazette (Bardstown, KY)
4/16/2016

Nelson County Sheriff Ed Mattingly informed members of the law enforcement community and Nelson Fiscal Court
Friday that the sheriff’s office will end its participation in the Flex special response team.

The Flex Team is made of members of the Bardstown Police Department and the Nelson County Sheriff’s Office. Sheriff Mattingly’s decision will end the participation of three deputies who work with the team.

In an email Friday morning, Sheriff Mattingly said he had informed Flex Team commander McKenzie Mattingly of his decision. The sheriff went on to say, “I foresee the mayor making an issue with the joint team, and that I do not want to be involved in the drama.”

He called Sheriff Mattingly’s decision to withdraw from the Flex Team unfortunate, and said in his opinion, the decision may put the safety of city and county officers and residents at risk.

“God help the county if there is a Columbine-type of shooting here,” he said.

Mayor cuts off council discussion of city police department restructuring
Nelson County Gazette (Bardstown, KY)
4/14/2016

Unlike the fire department restructuring — where the council members were kept informed — Councilwoman Kecia Copeland said she was not aware of the police department changes until she saw an article posted Tuesday by the local newspaper.

...Bardstown Mayor John Royalty declared Copeland was out of order because the changes were administrative ones made by the mayor. Royalty moved on with the meeting, reading requests for cemetery deeds while Councilman Francis Lydian and Copeland made it clear they had more to say.

When Royalty started to adjourn the meeting, Councilman Fred Hagan objected, saying that he would like to hear what Lydian and Copeland had to say.

Here's the one with the s-word headline, if you were wondering which expletive was used...
Police chief warned Royalty of ‘**** storm’ from police restructuring plan
Nelson County Gazette (Bardstown, KY)
4/15/2016

“To say that a ‘**** storm’ will be created by this directive is putting it mildly,” McCubbin wrote.

McCubbin said he was unhappy “with the disrespect and unprofessionalism displayed toward me as chief” by the mayor’s decision to restructure the police department without involving him. He wrote it was apparent he was also excluded from discussions about the department by some of his officers.

After voicing his displeasure with the plan and how he learned of it, McCubbin promises to implement the plan if Royalty insisted on it, though he suggested the mayor be the person to debrief the police department about the plan and his reasons.

“I do not want to leave the department in shambles … I will not abandon my duties as chief but I am in the dark as any of our officers about this directive.

“Since I have been excluded from these decisions and have absolutely no idea what to tell the men and woman of BPD I will certainly yield to you,” he wrote.

 

[bflocket]

Ok... Now I just saw that McCubbins (Chief) is resigning. So that means McKenzie M will now be chief(?).

I'm at a loss for words. Or at least words I can say in public.

Bardstown Police Chief McCubbin announces he will retire May 31
Nelson County Gazette (Bardstown, KY)
4/18/2016

Bardstown Police Chief McCubbin announces he will retire May 31

McCubbin’s decision follows a week of turmoil following Mayor John Royalty’s decision to restructure the Bardstown Police Department without consulting its chief.

Royalty said Monday he met with McCubbin to discuss the matter. Royalty said he asked McCubbin to stay on as chief, but McCubbin told him he would prefer to go ahead and retire at the end of May.

I'm honestly scared about living in the area now.

 

[DropthePuck]

Ok... Now I just saw that McCubbins (Chief) is resigning. So that means McKenzie M will now be chief(?).

I'm at a loss for words. Or at least words I can say in public.

Bardstown Police Chief McCubbin announces he will retire May 31
Nelson County Gazette (Bardstown, KY)
4/18/2016


I'm honestly scared about living in the area now.

Looks like he'll only serve as interim chief.

"INTERIM CHIEF / NEXT CHIEF. After McCubbin retires, McKenzie Mattingly will serve as interim chief until a new chief of police is hired, Royalty said. Mattingly will not be hired as the permanent new chief, he stressed — the new chief will be hired from outside the community. Royalty said he has already received several queries expressing interest in the chief’s position should it open up."

I'm really curious as to why this all went down. Is it a mayor throwing around his authority just because he can? Did he feel like the department wasn't doing a good enough job so he decided to do some cleaning up and get rid of what he perceived as dead weight? Did he want to get his buddies jobs at the police department? I don't know. It will be interesting to see if there is any movement on the big 3 unsolved cases since there might be fresh eyes looking at the case files now. JMO.

 

[bflocket]

Is it a mayor throwing around his authority just because he can?

Did he want to get his buddies jobs at the police department?

If we only knew... But it doesn't sound right. None of it does.

 

[Inthedetails]

Looks like he'll only serve as interim chief.

"INTERIM CHIEF / NEXT CHIEF. After McCubbin retires, McKenzie Mattingly will serve as interim chief until a new chief of police is hired, Royalty said. Mattingly will not be hired as the permanent new chief, he stressed — the new chief will be hired from outside the community. Royalty said he has already received several queries expressing interest in the chief’s position should it open up."

I'm really curious as to why this all went down. Is it a mayor throwing around his authority just because he can? Did he feel like the department wasn't doing a good enough job so he decided to do some cleaning up and get rid of what he perceived as dead weight? Did he want to get his buddies jobs at the police department? I don't know. It will be interesting to see if there is any movement on the big 3 unsolved cases since there might be fresh eyes looking at the case files now. JMO.

If any or all of the three unsolved crimes were now solved, it would be a big benefit to some people's careers.

Just thinking aloud....

 

[bflocket]

As ridiculous as it sounds, I'd be more-than-likely believe that this is some kind of stunt pulled to distract the public from the Rogers/Ellis cases.
They both involved the local police force in one way or another. Ellis was a local police officer that happened to be ambushed on a night when he wasn't driving his usual patrol car (which had a camera). The one he was driving that night had no camera. Rogers went missing during a fairly volatile relationship with a guy whose brother was fired from the police department shortly after she went missing.

I don't know if the Netherlands had any connection to local police or politics, but I'd bet that there isn't gonna be much progress in solving their murders with all of this BS going on.

 

[bflocket]

Social media discussions led to rally Sunday to protest mayor’s actions
Nelson County Gazette (Bardstown, KY)
4/22/2016

Bardstown and Nelson County residents upset about Mayor John Royalty’s restructuring of the Bardstown Police Department and the decision of its chief to retire in its wake have organized a protest rally for 6 p.m. Sunday at the Nelson County Justice Center parking lot.

Royalty addressed the controversy and the planned protest in an interview Wednesday, April 20 with Central Kentucky TV Channel 6.
“I just as soon we’d handled this without individuals beating the drums and getting people together for a protest,” he said of the ongoing controversy.
Royalty was critical of social media users who are making their voices heard.
“I think its unfortunate that you’re doing it to Bardstown,” he said. “You can do it to me, but what everyone else is doing is hurting the City of Bardstown.”

I cannot believe he said what I underlined. Nobody's upset with Bardstown. They're upset with its mayor and his recent actions.

 

[bflocket]

Double murder mystery in Bardstown remains unsolved
WDRB Fox-41 (Louisville, KY)
4/21/2016

A mother and daughter are found murdered inside their home near Bardstown, and two years later, police have more questions than answers.

"Take the black Impala for instance that's probably our most important piece of evidence at this time," said Trooper Jeff Gregory with Kentucky State Police.

The picture of the car taken the day of the double murder is an image that Gregory has had in his mind for the past two years.

"I think that somebody somewhere knows something. to be able to pinpoint exactly where they may be it's hard to say. I wouldn't be surprised if there was some information over there that we haven't gotten that people may know," said Gregory.

Anyone with any information is urged to call the KSP post in Elizabethtown at (270) 766-5078.

 

[ALansby]

As I understand it KSP is investigating both the Ellis & Netherland murders, and the Crystal Rogers disappearance - not Bardstown P.D. - so all of Mayor Royalty's fit throwing and narcissistic meanderings shouldn't be impacting the investigations. However, is it giving the public something else to talk about, oh yeah.

 

[colette]

So sad, every time I click on this page I hope for an arrest. How can this be? A violent murder of 2 women and there is no evidence? The car? No one knows anyone who is connected with a black impala that might have some sort of connection with this terrible crime???

 

[colette]

As I understand it KSP is investigating both the Ellis & Netherland murders, and the Crystal Rogers disappearance - not Bardstown P.D. - so all of Mayor Royalty's fit throwing and narcissistic meanderings shouldn't be impacting the investigations. However, is it giving the public something else to talk about, oh yeah.

There is an "Unresolved" Pod cast on the murders in Bardstown. Part one is all about Jason Ellis but part 2 cover the Netherland murders and Crystal Rogers.

[video=youtube;uhaO2dmyCXk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhaO2dmyCXk[/video]

 

[bluebird55]

Back in June 2014 the Kentucky standard reported "evidence" was being sent to the state lab for testing. .said it would take 6 months to a year. ..what ever came of that? Nothing conclusive?

 

[bflocket]

Back in June 2014 the Kentucky standard reported "evidence" was being sent to the state lab for testing. .said it would take 6 months to a year. ..what ever came of that? Nothing conclusive?

I don't know if it's the state lab that's the problem. I think the locals are kind of "distracted" for the time being.

 

[Mimi_Joan]

http://www.wdrb.com/story/32113902/...-chief-over-allegations-of-document-shredding

Cover up? I used to enjoy driving to Bardstown but I think I'll stay clear for a while.

 

[Muy Curioso]

¿Lab testing? I want to remind everyone that KSP have not yet said how died Kahty and Samantha. I wonder who is really distracting.

According to KSP, both suffered some sort of trauma. Great.

 

[bflocket]

http://www.wdrb.com/story/32113902/...-chief-over-allegations-of-document-shredding

Cover up? I used to enjoy driving to Bardstown but I think I'll stay clear for a while.

I agree that something was being "erased" with that paper shredder. They said that it was drug cases, internal affairs and "other" things. Because the Internal Affairs papers were being shredded, I would think it had more to do with Jason Ellis or Crystal Rogers than the Netherlands. Ellis was a cop and Rogers was dating one.

It seems a little strange since he was with the Bardstown Police. Bardstown and Nelson County have separate police departments.
Officer Ellis was shot about 10-miles outside of Bardstown.
Crystal Rogers (more than likely) went missing outside of Bardstown city limits.
The Netherlands were killed outside the city limits, too.

I wonder what he was trying to cover up. Or who he was helping out.

P.S...
Bardstown sure ain't like it was 20-years ago. All of the "rowdy" kids from all over Nelson County (myself included) would go there to endlessly cruise down North Third Street, go around the courthouse and go back to the Winn-Dixie parking lot. Then you'd hang out for a while and repeat the loop.
I don't know what there is for kids (or anybody on a fixed budget) has to do in Bardstown now. Snort crushed pills and/or shoot up?

It's changed so much that I try to not go there unless absolutely necessary (i.e. to the doctor/dentist or things you have to go to the County Clerk for). There's no point in dealing with the hassle. And they've actually screwed around with the roads to make traffic even worse than it was before. If you go in the late afternoon, there are traffic jams in "Lil' Ole' Bardstown" that are worse than I ever dealt with during the decade I lived in Louisville.