Resolved LA - Tallulah, WhtFem Skeletal 163UFLA, 19-23, Dec'94 - Name not found

[CarlK90245]

Thank you both for the validation. Technically you spotted the possibility first Carl, I was just lucky enough to spot it with the photo.

I saw the photo a week or so ago in a Charley Project update, and I remembered that I had been looking for her photo. But I was working on something else at the time, and it didn't occur to me to re-check the UID cases. And I had forgotten that I had posted her as a possible to this Jane Doe.

I don't consider it my find if I didn't follow-up with a submission. This was just a vague-"maybe" until we saw her teeth.

 

[CarlK90245]

I left a voicemail with Mary Manhein, who is the head of LSU Faces lab. I suppose we will have to wait until Monday for her to call back.

I also left a message with Stacey Reynolds of the NCMEC. She is the NamUs case-manager for Bertha's case.

The Police contact number (Luke Holcomb) indicated in Police Information is disconnected.

 

[CarlK90245]

:bump: bumping to the current page.

This girl showed up in NamUs today, but there is no photo of her:

Bertha Bea Sieg
https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/12824/31

She might be a little too young (15) and too light (105 lbs) to be this Jane Doe.

But the other details seem close enough. She was last seen at approximately the same time that this Jane Doe was thought to have died. Her height is right. She has reddish hair. She might fit the description of being mixed race. And she is from Duncanville (i.e., a suburb of Dallas), which would explain the Dallas Cowboys shirt.

Hi there, I was wanting opinions on this possible match.

A Jane Doe was found December 24th Lousiana who was bludgeoned to death.
http://doenetwork.org/cases/163ufla.html


She wore a Dallas cowboys jumper and so using that as a possible clue to her origins, I looked for auburn haired teens from Texas and Bertha Sieg came up, who was from Dallas and ran away after an argument with her mother.

https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/12824/11?current_page=case_information

The age is slightly out, the weight is wrong but the time line is good and looking at the teeth of Jane Doe and the smiling photo of Bertha I see similarities.

Would love other opinions.

I'd say that's definitely our Jane Doe. I'd submit.

I mentioned her on this thread last year, but didn't have a photo of her at the time. Now that we have a photo, I'd say that the teeth are definitely consistent.

If you want me to send an e-mail to Helen Bouzon, I'd be glad to. But this is your find, so I'll let you submit if you wish to.

 

[CarlK90245]

I just got done speaking with Helen Bouzon of LSU Faces Lab. She agreed that the teeth look very close, and the circumstances and timeline are very compelling.

She says the problem is that her NamUs dental chart indicates that according to her dental records dated March 1993 (11 months prior to her disappearance), she had absolutely no dental work. The Jane Doe had two upper wisdom teeth removed, and fillings in six teeth. This isn't necessarily a rule-out because her dental records may not represent the last dental work done on her. But eight fillings on six teeth, and two wisdom tooth extractions is quite a lot of dental work to have done in 11 months.

Nevertheless, she is going to have her dental records sent to a forensic odontologist for a closer comparison using actual x-rays, rather than charts. She will let me know what she finds out.

 

[CarlK90245]

I just received a follow-up from Helen Bouzon on this case.

I sent the DNA profile for our Jane Doe to North Texas and asked them to compare it to the profile from Bertha's mother. Unfortunately, the two do not match.
Bertha is ruled out as being a possible match.

That's twice I thought for sure I had a match on this case. First with Anjanette Piotrowski, and now Bertha Sieg.

 

[KT Can]

I know someone mentioned Lorraine earlier in the thread, but was she ever conisdered? I didn't see her on the rule out list.

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/l/light_lorraine.html

 

[yorick]

In case anybody needs another link to it:

https://identifyus.org/cases/889


(Make sure to hit the link that says "show all exclusions.")

Is there a separate list here on webslueths? (Sorry if that's a dumb question - still fairly new here.)

It looks like they added Bertha to this list.

Thanks again to Carl for the help in getting Bertha ruled out.

Thanks to KT for bringing up Lorraine. Is there a way to get her ruled out? According to KT's link, there's some files that got lost regarding the case.

 

[webrocket]

Yorick, your link is for a different deceased.

the interesting thing is that they had enough data to make a rule out for that UID but are unable to do the same for this UID.

 

[yorick]

Yorick, your link is for a different deceased.

the interesting thing is that they had enough data to make a rule out for that UID but are unable to do the same for this UID.

Am I looking at something wrong? The original thread was about this lady, right?

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/163ufla.html

And that photo is also on this link with the rule outs:

https://identifyus.org/cases/889

If I made a mistake, please verify and I delete my posts. Sorry if there is any confusion. Thanks for your help.

 

[CarlK90245]

In case anybody needs another link to it:

https://identifyus.org/cases/889


(Make sure to hit the link that says "show all exclusions.")

Is there a separate list here on webslueths? (Sorry if that's a dumb question - still fairly new here.)

It looks like they added Bertha to this list.

Thanks again to Carl for the help in getting Bertha ruled out.

Thanks to KT for bringing up Lorraine. Is there a way to get her ruled out? According to KT's link, there's some files that got lost regarding the case.

Yorick, your link is for a different deceased.

the interesting thing is that they had enough data to make a rule out for that UID but are unable to do the same for this UID.

Am I looking at something wrong? The original thread was about this lady, right?

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/163ufla.html

And that photo is also on this link with the rule outs:

https://identifyus.org/cases/889

If I made a mistake, please verify and I delete my posts. Sorry if there is any confusion. Thanks for your help.

It looks to me like the right link.

 

[webrocket]

sorry Yorick, I must have been confused. won't be the last time either!

 

[smileypace4]

What do y'all think of Debra Asbury? The dates line up closely.

https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/106/0/

Newspaper article

http://news.google.com/newspapers?n...RshAAAAIBAJ&sjid=zFIEAAAAIBAJ&pg=4643,3049804

 

[CarlK90245]

What do y'all think of Debra Asbury? The dates line up closely.

https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/106/0/

Newspaper article

http://news.google.com/newspapers?n...RshAAAAIBAJ&sjid=zFIEAAAAIBAJ&pg=4643,3049804

The timeline is spot-on, but I don't see anything else that screams possible match.

It would be nice if we could see her teeth, but there are no teeth photos.

And there's nothing in the circumstances to suggest that she would end up in Louisiana from Lexington South Carolina (about 650 miles away).

If the heights are right, she is too tall, and at 26, she is a little bit too old (though not by much).

If there were other compelling commonalities, none of these negatives would be a big deal by themselves. But aside from the date, I don't see much else.

 

[carbuff]

The current ruleouts (https://identifyus.org/cases/889)

Michelle Burchell 1972 Kentucky
Jayne Davis 1968 Texas
Brenda Green 1972 Alabama
Deanna Joy 1973 Minnesota
Hazel Klug 1962 Virginia
Kristi Krebs 1970 California
Jeanie Lofton 1972 Texas
Roxanne Martin 1954 Florida
Donda Martino 1961 Tennessee
Shannon Melendi 1974 Georgia
Genevieve Munoz 1976 Mississippi
Amy Pagnac 1976 Minnesota
Anjanette Piotrowski 1973 New York
Anjanette Piotrowski 1973 New York
Patricia Schmidt 1964 Virginia
Tiffany Sessions 1968 Florida
Mary Shinn 1953 Arkansas
Bertha Sieg 1978 Texas
Michelle Thomas 1967 Texas
Kelly Wilson 1974 Texas
Jennifer Wyant 1958 Tennessee

 

[Roselvr]

MI - Aundria Michelle Bowman, 14, Holland, 11 March 1989 Ruled out 4/6/2013

22 exclusions

The following people have been ruled out as being this decedent:
First Name Last Name Year of Birth State LKA
Aundria Bowman 1974 Michigan
Michelle Burchell 1972 Kentucky
Jayne Davis 1968 Texas
Brenda Green 1972 Alabama
Deanna Joy 1973 Minnesota
Hazel Klug 1962 Virginia
Kristi Krebs 1970 California
Jeanie Lofton 1972 Texas
Roxanne Martin 1954 Florida
Donda Martino 1961 Tennessee
Shannon Melendi 1974 Georgia
Genevieve Munoz 1976 Mississippi
Amy Pagnac 1976 Minnesota
Anjanette Piotrowski 1973 New York
Anjanette Piotrowski 1973 New York
Patricia Schmidt 1964 Virginia
Tiffany Sessions 1968 Florida
Mary Shinn 1953 Arkansas
Bertha Sieg 1978 Texas
Michelle Thomas 1967 Texas
Kelly Wilson 1974 Texas
Jennifer Wyant 1958 Tennessee

 

[joeytes]

According to the Doe Network, this person is now identified. There are no other details

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/163ufla.html

 

[Roselvr]

According to the Doe Network, this person is now identified. There are no other details

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/163ufla.html

Gonna see what I can find out; NamUs profile still online.
LSU FAces says identified too
Thankful she has her name back! Hopefully they can find her killer

 

[CarlK90245]

Gonna see what I can find out; NamUs profile still online.
LSU FAces says identified too
Thankful she has her name back! Hopefully they can find her killer

From what I recall, they already found her killer.

 

[chaddylex]

From what I recall, they already found her killer.

I am glad she was finally identified. Carl, don't you have some kind of pull to see who she was? I am curious to know because I am the one who started this thread back in 2009 and I totally forgot about it.

 

[bessie]

An Arkansas couple convicted of kidnapping and raping a Northeast Louisiana University student, are suspects in her death. Joseph McKinney, of North Little Rock, Arkansas is serving a life sentence plus 50 years, and his companion, Sylvia Grover, is serving a 45-year sentence for the September 17, 1994 abduction of an 18-year-old woman from the Super Kmart Center in West Monroe. The girl was taken to Caldwell Parish, where she was raped and her throat was slashed several times. She survived. Several months before the West Monroe kidnapping, workers picking up trash near the intersection of Interstate 20 and Louisiana 602, about two miles east of Tallulah, found this victim's bones near a culvert.

After McKinney and Grover were arrested in the West Monroe kidnapping, Madison Parish officials questioned them about the dead woman. After the questioning, there is no question they are somehow linked to the dead woman.

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/163ufla.html